Firearms squad was unsupportive

Discussion in 'Current Affairs, News and Analysis' started by Agent_Smith, Feb 24, 2006.

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  1. Whilst it is a great shame that this officer felt strongly enough to commit suicide, surely the findings of this report are way out of line. She failed the tests SIX times and even shot a target in the wrong lane. How could they justify allowing her to continue as a firearms officer?

    Do they have a duty to 'care' and be supportive for someone who has repeatedly failed to make the grade, or should people just accpet that they are not up to the job?

  2. It sounds fair enough to me. If you can't pass the test, you don't get the job. She actually sounded more dangerous to her own people, than the 'bad guys'.
  3. ViroBono

    ViroBono LE Moderator

    Various recent news stories would indicate that this is not how the police work any more.

    Sadly it's more like: 'If you can't pass the test, you don't get the job. Unless you are from an under-represented ethnic or other minority group, in which case here are your joining instructions.'
  4. Well, VB, it actually sounds like positive discrimination didn't happen in this case (unless it was used to get her on the course). She was a minority, and she still kept failing the tests. The testing process worked as it should. The fact that she took her own life, though regretable and very sad, just goes to show that she didn't have what it takes to do the job. Can you imagine what her reaction would have been if she had actually fired and killed a 'bad guy', or even worse an innocent bystander/collegue?
  5. so as the consequence of being rejected as a fire arms officer she took her own life?

    so pysche profile

    emotionally stable?

    proportionately responsive?

    i'm ever so surprised she didn't make the grade
  6. As with all cases, happen to know that there is much more to this one than is reported. Coroners inquest ongoing, appears there were serious leadership failings within Merseyside Police leading to a bullying and unsupportive culture that was very unhealthy.

    Be slow to judge this case, Coroners verdict will be v interesting. And connect with Telegraph reports of last week of the same force failing to discipline proportionately those guilty of sending racist and offensive emails. Perhaps the fault may not lie with the individual in this case?
  7. Regardless as to the reasons, it is still very sad that an officer felt low enough to take her own life.

    R.I.P. Officer.
  8. I must echo my sympathy for the deceased and her family. I just wanted to spark a debate about the claims that she was driven to suicide because she had not been helped or dealt with sensitively enough when she failed to meet the required standards.
  9. There may well have been some underlying issues, but given the responsibility that FOs have to burden and the speed at which they are criticised when they get it wrong, I for one am glad that they do weed out those who cannot make the grade. I'm just concerned at how many attempts Merseyside gave her. It is indeed sad that this lass killed herself and there may very well be other reasons which influenced her, but lets not get too carried away. She had six attempts? At what point were they going to pass her? We have seen similar conduct in our training centres where soldiers are tested until they pass. I for one am glad that she didn't make the grade. Can you imagine the field day the Press would have had had she been involved in an incident and got it wrong. I feel that Merseyside may have been ubder some pressure to have a 'female' on the team and that they gave her more chances than she perhaps deserved.

    Poltical correctness has more than had a hand in the amount of chances she was given. Personally, I wouldn't have had the front to go back after failing on the second occasion. She was obviously made of sterner stuff than me or perhaps placed to much store in her gender being favoured in the PC climate we have lived in now for the past decade.
  10. Again, be very slow to judge on this case. There will be a host of coroners observations on this and the entire system will take a hit. A lack of decent leadership meant that she was treated v badly throughout. As for six fails, again, you need to be very clear what that meant at the time. Also bear in mind she was aleady a trained AFO, ARV and rifle officer, not an officer attempting to pass. And she recd no remedial training between failing one shoot then the next - hardly the way to improve someones skills.

    Not well handled, not well led and not well looked after. Tested against a standard not recognised elsewhere and under 'unique' working conditions with a very unsupportive culture that did not want any minorities in it. If that describes where you work, you better hope no one there tops themselves. Cos you might end up in Coroners Court too.

    As I said, watch the coroners comments over the coming days
  11. C What would have happened if the tree huggers had got their way and she remained in active duty....shooting a target in the wrong lane could easily have been shooting an innocent bystander in the REAL world! Regardless of the number of fails she was "shaking" on the range 8O , so there is no way she should be on the streets with a gun. Considering that she was the sort of emotionally unstable loser who would top herself, the decision to remove her from firearms duty should be applauded. Furthermore, if she was so shallow as to feel incomplete without her gun then she is better off not carrying one.
  12. I've read some moronic, insensitive bullsh1t on this forum but this takes it to a new level.
  13. Veg: Couldn't care less what you think. You smack of the sort of individual that would idly stand by and let any unqualified/unstable idiot walk the beat with a firearm. Are you so cavalier with your own soldiers?

    She was being reassigned back to routine police duties! it was not as if she was being given the sack for failing, as she was an experienced an qualified PC already. To many people get over emotional about the small shit nowadays and everyone else in command is then blamed as being insensitive. The good officers above her went out of their way (more than they would have done for a male PC i expect) to give her opportunities to re qualify for firearms duties. She still had a job, but it was obviously firearms or nothing.
  14. Ord_Sgt

    Ord_Sgt RIP

    Renavatio, if you'd been bothered to check you would realise veg is a copper and not a soldier. While your sentiments have some merit your powers of expression and subtlety are more than a little lacking.
  15. ^ You don't know dick about me.

    Your post insinuates something very distasteful if you go back and re-read it. You could always go back and edit it, couldn't you?