Fighting the War Documentary

Can anyone tell me if this is yet another BBC get at the Army and MOD.

The programme trys to lay out that Telic was a complete farce and we just got through it - I know many of the people involved may feel that they are being portrayed in a negative light - is this fair !!!!

BBC get a grip - or was Mr AC of Downing Street right !!!!!

Any points greatly appreciated
TELIC was not a farce - it worked pretty well.  We did get through it, after all, and 'won ' the war (the peace is a different matter).  This is, of course, despite everything... such as kit shortages (in many places/times), planning for the wrong war, planning in the wrong timeframe, etc.


The planning process is always strange - jut depends on which bits you highlight.  the whole point is to be ready to deal with the 'unexpected' - whatever it may be.  Otherwise, all those SO1/2/3s are wasting their rations...


War Hero
This is a serious blow for Bliar and New Labour, but it's just a lovers tiff.

The BBC has been so biased to Bliar for years now, and is full of his luvvies, they will soon come round. And TELIC only seemed to be a farce because of Bliars making everybody believe it would be done and dusted in days, when everybody who knew anything knew it wouldn't be, but hey, it hkept the public sweet for a while.
It has all come at a very interesting time.  There is already a huge appetite to strip the BBC of the licence fee and the new communications regulator - ofcomm - is sure to want to make its mark.

I don't know anyone on the 'Fighting the War' programme personally but thought Chris Vernon came across quite poorly.
The BBC bash everyone - and that's why it's so good.
I heard the good Mr Hoon on the radio, saying that the Iraqis must have had Chemical/ Biological because they had NBC suits and respirators.  The logic being that the Brits and US don't so it must only have been protection  against their own stuff.
Such  complete  lobbocks can only mean the barrel is starting to be scraped in a manner so far unknown.
Long may the BBC continue to ask the questions the nancy  boys on the opposition benches fail to.
I don't think that this is a deliberate plan by the evil BBC.  These guys are war correspondents who are used to being the heroes of warzones the world over.  All of a sudden some Col from the QRH is telling them that they can't go into an unsecured objective and they throw a hissy fit.  There will always be the problem that they think what they are doing is important, whereas we are never going to waste troops, heli time and effort (on them) unless the battle is won.
I see their point, but they have the option to go it alone.  Strangely after the death of Terry Lloyd, none of them fancied it.  A classic case of wanting to have cake and eat it.
Agree Armitage,

It might be a temporary falling out, but the BBC seems to think it's honour is at stake, and it looks like they're willing to defend it

I think Campbell is trying to get the BBC to bubble the spook that blew the whistle. they know they can't do that, because they'd never get an inside story again.

So stand firm Auntie Beeb  ;D
I totally agree with you BitterSub - I should have added that the hacks came across as whining brats - the 'do you know who I am' syndrome was never far away and the army was spot on to keep them in check.

I'd be surprised if Campbell resigned just now - I suspect he is keen to go but less keen to have his departure forever attributed to being 'eased out by the BBC' as opposed to going on his own terms. Today's papers say Campbell is about to be cleared for his part on the the dodgy dossier role and so that will be his cue to leave 'unblemished'.

In the early days of new lab, perhaps the Beeb would have got rid of Gilligan but I think everyone has had enough of the bullying now.  Campbell's pull over the press pack was 'Do as I say or I'll never give you anything again'.  Now it has gone far beyond that and the media has almost nothing to lose by standing up to him.
Personally the whole thing didn't really tie up with what I seem to remember happened a couple of months ago.  And as for the briefing of the DSG...ha ha ha ha ha ha ha.

The DSG moved about a couple of days after the fighting started.  What the flip was the RQMS talking about minimum force for?  It's exactly that kind of thinking which resulted in a couple of deaths unfortunately.  We were fighting a high intensity war, not PSO in NI / Balkans.  A slightly more robust approach was therefore entirely acceptable.  Plus the speech was bonk.

As for holding up the move into Basrah. Bollocks.  It was never intended to go straight in.  I seem to remember the brighter than a brain-planeted GOC saying something like 'no Stalingrad'.  It's called an operational pause.  If we'd wanted to lay waste to the city it would have been easy.

The misreporting was absolutely dire, so too was the overly-dramatic voiceover.  'The BG must be refuelled and resupplied or it will be unable etc.'  At that point.  Bollocks.  Not enough ammunition had been expended by that particular BG for a start.

And running away from the bridge when some mortar rounds were fired?  I know another BG which didn't, notwithstanding 21 days of it, rather it id'd the baseplate and engaged it (the fire was observed and not predicted as there did not appear to be that capability then).

And as for the other three BGs in the Bde?  Mayhap we weren't there?

The list could go on and on.  Rant not over.


War Hero
lot of very unhappy red hackles after last night programme - to say edited fiction would be unkind to fiction writers everywhere. :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad:
I did wonder why the programme was concentrating on the BW, as I was looking out for a particular Fusilier........I think it might be something to do with the fact that it was the BBC embedded with the BW and ITV enbedded with the Fusiliers - therefore the BBC programme would show the footage they had..................


Has anyone got yesterdays on VHS ? F*cking vid went screwy and I missed the first 10 Mins. Sad Git I Know, but I've converted all the others to VCD for viewing on my DVD player when I'm old and crinkly.

Any help appreciated


One of the problems has already been brought out in this discussion - The 'I want it now; at all costs' attitude of the press; perhaps this is because they are so used to the spin that is generated by the likes of Mr Campbell and cannot cope with not only not knowing what will happen but also being purpously delayed, (for a good reason) on what has happened. It is important to remember that the press can make a difference but they should not be allowed to control what is going on because of this.

I think the BBC are showing an interesting documentary in that they have tried to look at all levels ie individual to PJHQ but the program is very slanted in its' opinions.


I notice Christiane Amanpour from CNN came across as the pretentious jumped up bitch I imagined her to be. So maybe the beeb is getting something right.
Does anyone know where you can get a hold of the series? I only saw one or two of the episodes when it was on, and would quite like to have another gander... can't find it on t'interent after a brief schufti.



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