FIBUA Tactics

[shemulie]

I, as many of you, have probably been thrown through the FIBUA training, grappeling hooks, ladders n all. As useful as it may have been in the battle of Stalingrad it doesn't exactly seem practical for most of the areas of operation we see ourselves faced with. Certainly there never seems a heave emphasis on the training and that there is is never very thorough.

I still see 2 men taking rooms with a grenade in every room and hozing the place down afterwards, not clearing corners and not havign all arcs covered. Hardly practical in a large urban area or one with civilians still present. Unlike most of our doctrine the tactics never seem very fluid or thought out. I am on my way to Afghan and still the lads seem to be applying this there.

What sort of room clearing drill where taught for NI? Surley we learnt a lot there?

It almost pains me to say it (and many of my buddies over there will be looking really smug right now) but I think we can learn something from our American counterparts. They dropped the drill we used and have evolved them to the point that now they use adaptations of the 4 man stacks to clear rooms, with additional teams to breach the doors and pull security. Doctrine lifted from the SWAT teams. I trained with them on it and it works very fast and fluidly with all angles covered and a lot less confusion.

 

[Mother]

I did FIBUA (OBUA now or is it OUA now?) in Gib. I thought the training was brilliant and aimed towards some of my lot going out to Afghanistan. We did house/room clearing and tunnel/tunnel & building/room clearing in pitch black. All of these things were very fluid and effective and looked like it would work well for the operations at the moment as it was being trained to and/or practiced by "other" units before they went out to Afghanistan.
Dark, hot, noisy, exhausting and great. Guys in Gib Reg were great.

 

[bobath]

We're taught not to just throw grenades around now. Most buildings in the sandy places can't handle it. After the first breaching explosion you shouldn't need them. As for hosing the rooms, thats old hat, only shoot if you need to, but be very ready to.

We do a fair bit in my unit, and we have some good instructers, which helps. Most of the stuff in the pam is a bit out of date, but you don't have to follow it slaveishly.

 

[smartascarrots]

I did the NATO FIBUA Instr. Cse at the School of Infantile several years pre-Iraq, and the emphasis even then was always on “Yes, you will be doing high intensity warfighting, but be prepared to conduct the full spectrum of OBUA”. There was some especially good input to tactics at sub-unit up from the USMC students, who were really into the 3-block concept.

Borrowing tactics from SWAT is fine in those types of scenarios, but SWAT do not operate in a high-intensity environment, so you need to be able to escalate as appropriate. In particular, the low level tactics of sending 4 guys rushing into a room which the enemy has had time to do some basic preparation proved even with ISAWES to multiply the casualty rates immensely. Even with body armour, I can well imagine the havoc caused to such a stack from a burst of close range high-velocity fire.

Having said that, our doctrine needs an overhaul, especially at the lowest levels – coloured flags in this day and age, I ask you! Our emphasis on heavy explosive charges to gain entry seems more suited to northwest European building techniques. And don’t get me started on the massive-upper-body strength methods favoured by gym-queens and thrusting COs everywhere. Is it really such a good idea to have troops dangling from ropes outside third floor windows when the enemy have mutual support? Not unless you hate them, it’s not!

The faults described by Shemulie seem more to do with poor skills & drills and can be remedied by realistic training by those who understand their subject, just like any other training issue. A bit of ruthless DS-ing helps; my personal favourite c*ck-stand was entry teams placing a heavy mousehole charge then hiding round the corner at what wouldn’t be a safe distance for Guy Fawkes’ Night. It was a bit of an unorthodox method to test your platoon’s casevac drills, but highly effective.

 

[woody]

Unless your ape like the grappeling hook is a joke .Hopefully the lessons from afganistian filter down pretty quickly .

 

[ugly]

What sort of room clearing drill where taught for NI? Surley we learnt a lot there?

We certainly didnt have grenades and very rarely automatic weapons (unless out in the cuds). In good old NI if a house was occupied you surrounded it and knocked on the door. Not much use for the sandpit(s) I know but you did ask. The only time I recall ever entering without permission was on hot pursuits, unnoccupied searches or lifts!
Unless you were under fire or had a planned op you basically had to respect private property! Rule of law old chap and all that!
Burned into my memory of the supergrass lifts a la Robert Lean in 83 is young Ugly having tried to force entry hanging from a swinging outwards door by his leg firmly stuck through said door!

 

[Targets_UP]

What sort of room clearing drill where taught for NI? Surley we learnt a lot there?

We certainly didnt have grenades and very rarely automatic weapons (unless out in the cuds). In good old NI if a house was occupied you surrounded it and knocked on the door. Not much use for the sandpit(s) I know but you did ask. The only time I recall ever entering without permission was on hot pursuits, unnoccupied searches or lifts!
Unless you were under fire or had a planned op you basically had to respect private property! Rule of law old chap and all that!
Burned into my memory of the supergrass lifts a la Robert Lean in 83 is young Ugly having tried to force entry hanging from a swinging outwards door by his leg firmly stuck through said door!

Respecting property, that cant be right,i remember stripping out a certain players car in the pouring rain on the cullyville rd(think thats the spelling) and just leaving it all there seats an all,we were all soaking wet but to see the look on the players face "priceless" happy days

 

[ugly]

Yes but if you damaged anything NIHE the housing exec just coughed up. The Unit CO/OC could get very shirty over property damage that was ragged at him by HQNI by the NIHE. Cars on the other hand. I recall an unnocuppied search of acertain taxi association which left many vehicles less than roadworthy!
I also remember leaving people stood in the rain for ages.

 

[polar69]

Unless your ape like the grappeling hook is a joke .Hopefully the lessons from afganistian filter down pretty quickly .

I thought the grappling hook was to pull suspect booby traps etc ?

 

[BedIn]

I'm recently back from Iraq and we did enter a few houses during contacts.

My CSM had some SF experience and I had him teach the blokes the 4 man room clearing drill. We found it not only more thorough, but critically easier to control and quicker to employ, as the guys are already in 4 man teams, each with a JNCO.

In a complex situation such as entering a building in down town Basrah you simply cannot do every room with a grenade and a magazine. It is simply snap decisions, guts and leadership. I understand that non-lethal kit, like stingball and stun grenades, may soon become available to normal Infantry - that should make things a bit easier.

 

[ugly]

Those non lethal weapons may prove bad news if you lob one accidentally into a cot or someones fuel supply!
The problem, seems to be its neither war nor assisting local plod! Typical only we can get ourselves into a situation which requires a 1000lb bomb to be dropped on an enemy position butwe have to risk life and limb as there may be civilians in the area. I think the yanks are just starting to work this one out! edited to add I meant see this prblem, I'm not sure they'll ever work out how to deal with it!

 

[Red Shrek]

Those non lethal weapons may prove bad news if you lob one accidentally into a cot or someones fuel supply!
The problem, seems to be its neither war nor assisting local plod! Typical only we can get ourselves into a situation which requires a 1000lb bomb to be dropped on an enemy position butwe have to risk life and limb as there may be civilians in the area. I think the yanks are just starting to work this one out! edited to add I meant see this prblem, I'm not sure they'll ever work out how to deal with it!

I think the tactics differ a bit. The USMC did a LOT of FIBUA in Fallujah and they seemed to use the 4 man team concept as mentioned above a lot.

 

[ugly]

They also used a lot of tanks and planes and flattened a lot of buildings. That sort of figting is Fibua full on, no questions but as for most day to day ops I suspect Rule of Law may take precedence!

 

[Red Shrek]

They also used a lot of tanks and planes and flattened a lot of buildings. That sort of figting is Fibua full on, no questions but as for most day to day ops I suspect Rule of Law may take precedence!

I get ya

 

[dancing_colonel1]

In particular, the low level tactics of sending 4 guys rushing into a room which the enemy has had time to do some basic preparation proved even with ISAWES to multiply the casualty rates immensely.

My bold.
What?

 

[smartascarrots]

In particular, the low level tactics of sending 4 guys rushing into a room which the enemy has had time to do some basic preparation proved even with ISAWES to multiply the casualty rates immensely.

My bold.
What?

Infantry Small-Arms Weapons Effects Simulator. Basically an improved version of the laser simulator 'SAWES' introduced for TESEXs. The body sensors come mounted on a vest rather than those sleeves which fitted over webbing yokes, and it has a dual battery compartment so that battery replacement doesn't switch the system off. Also lacks the barmine sensor pack strapped across your kidneys that made SAWES such a pleasure to wear.

The point I intended to make (possibly not too clearly, now I read it again) was that even though these simulators don't absolutely imitate small arms fire, especially so far as penetrating effects are concerned, a prepared enemy could cause havoc in an entry team with well-aimed rapid or automatic fire.

In training, the body of the first man through the door effectively provides cover-from-laser-fire for the rest of the squad; a live round at 10-15m wouldn't stop so easily, but would continue into the second or third man. My own experience from CHD village, for what that's worth, was that a burst of automatic fire into the entry team could 'kill' several of them and only the tail end charlies would have a chance to return fire effectively or escape. I can only believe reality would be far worse.

This was my point about adapting tactics to suit circumstances. Critical as I am about much of our FIBUA methodology, I still think it's important to train for the worst case scenario. You stand the best chance of minimising casualties and dominating the BUA with 2 man teams if your talking about high intensity situations, but a 4 man, tightly controlled, team makes sense if you're trying to insert overwhelming force to make an arrest without accidental casualties amongst the locals.

 

[ugly]

10 to 15 m is a big room!

 

[woody]

Unless your ape like the grappeling hook is a joke .Hopefully the lessons from afganistian filter down pretty quickly .

I thought the grappling hook was to pull suspect booby traps etc ?

The grappling hook is still taught as a method of entry ,but,even without
body armour it soon becomes apperent .Unless your a ninja on crack either
someone from a neighbouring building will shoot you .Or someone in the
house you are storming will. Thats just climbing up the rope hanging from
the rope while trying to throw grenade and then storm room is clearly not going to work .It may have its uses but outside of ultimate force primary means of room entry isnt one of them.

 

[smartascarrots]

10 to 15 m is a big room!

My mistake, I meant feet. Damn this new fangled metric system! We had 16 rods to the kumkuat, in my day, and liked it!

 

[BedIn]

The 4 man stack is good for COIN. With reference to casualties taken in conventional OBUA, I think that the reality is the way we teach it isn't really a going concern.

The experience of the British Army in WW2 (and, lets face it, they did have a bit of experience) was that entering buildings was a last resort. Heavy artillery fire actually made an urban defensive position harder to take (piles of rubble etc). The preferred solution was to use flame to flush them out, then brass hem up as they presented in the street. Now I know that we can't do this now, but the principle stands. Welly the building with a "thermo baric" or "novel explosive" weapon, plaster it with fire and the tracer may well do the trick. Fire smoke at the house. Stuff in CS gas? But, critically, don't go in. Imagine the reality if clearing Copehill Down, properly defended, with light infantry entering and clearing every house. With a determined enemy you'd never get half way.