Ex-ACF Cadets / first impressions of OTC

#1
hey, this thred is mainly on what peoples opinion of OTC is compared to ACF. also non-ACF cadets, what where you expecting? i have just moved, and am finding it a complete dos in comparison.

i was hoping for somthing a bit more professional, but it seems to just be a booze-up. in my opinion you should work hard to play hard.

whats your opinion? was anyone else hoping for something a bit more... military?
 
#2
DOGboys said:
i was hoping for somthing a bit more professional, but it seems to just be a booze-up. in my opinion you should work hard to play hard.
?
That was exactly my opinion 25 years ago. Some things just don't change.

I gave it 18 months and then went across to the TA.
 
#3
Well the ACF is all about drill, and yeah the OTC is a bit of a doss, but you get to do much more than the ACF and you get paid..
Also the ACF think they are in the army and try to prove it by doing hardcore things to make up for the fact.

Go join a local TA Inf Bn, you will prob have much more fun and people wont have to listen to 'when I was a cdt WO2 etc'.
 
#4
it seem there is no weeding out the wasters, just here to have fun and p1ss about from the cadets who want to put some effort in and get something from the experiance, whilst still having a good time.

i just get the feeling that this is just going to produce inferior officers who were hoping for more of the same, and getting instead a rude awakening!
 
#5
DOGboys said:
it seem there is no weeding out the wasters, just here to have fun and p1ss about from the cadets who want to put some effort in and get something from the experiance, whilst still having a good time.

i just get the feeling that this is just going to produce inferior officers who were hoping for more of the same, and getting instead a rude awakening!
It certainly has in the past (those that go to the TA). But at last this is starting to change with the requirement to run proper MOD 3 courses.

Hopefully the direction that has been coming down from CRF such as putting requirements on OTCs to produce a quota of TA officers will continue the change to a unit with some military value, but it won't happen overnight.

If you're primary interest in military training you're still better off in the TA or possibly as a TASO at OTC.

Nothing worng with drinking societies per se but I'd rather they wern't funded from my taxes and pretended to be part of the Army.
 

BBear

LE
Kit Reviewer
#6
Coming from a CCF background, I'm really enjoying OTC. If you want a challenge, then yes go to a TA unit. But just think, you're at university and you want to have fun, you get paid to be part of an otc and you'll be with people much your own age.

If you want a real challenge, then try to get on a cambrian team - i hear that's not quite a little bimble around a park.

Just out of interest, what OTC are you with?
 
#7
If (as your avatar suggests) you aspire to be in the QRL then you may find that an OTC background stands you in better stead than a TA Bn?

There are plenty of opportunities in the OTC to spring into more warry pastimes - I did CTCRM's 'Green Student' and there are plenty of attachments and competitions to be done, from (in my day) Ex Cambrian Patrol through to Ex Coprolite Midden.

OTC pays out what you put in, just like the TA.
 
#8
sorry, but i feel the need to fight the ACFs corner here, as it is something i feel strongly about.

yeah we did alot of drill, but the ACF is about giving kids from predominantly poorer areas something to feel pride for and to develop self respect and discipline, which is what drill is all about.

and no, we never thought we were real soldiers, but held a deep respect for them (even if we were a bit lippy sometimes), and because of this many tried to emulate them by doing "hardcore things".
 
#9
no offence bbear, but most of the rest of my OTC is ex-CCF, and they all say the exactly same thing, they all love it. one said somthing like

"OTC is great, its just like CCF, no one minds about your dress, training is easy and we get to drink as well. i was worried they would shouting at us n stuff"

what more can i say?
 

BBear

LE
Kit Reviewer
#10
DOGboys said:
no offence bbear, but most of the rest of my OTC is ex-CCF, and they all say the exactly same thing, they all love it. one said somthing like

"OTC is great, its just like CCF, no one minds about your dress, training is easy and we get to drink as well. i was worried they would shouting at us n stuff"

what more can i say?
All I can say to that is that they definately didn't go to my CCF! I wouldn't say that my lots training is easy, dress standards are high and we do get shouted at if we fcuk up! What part of training don't you like?

Also, sorry - I can understand drill for "the movement of a body of soldiers, whether individually or in a group, in a smart and uniform manner". To make kids from the lower end of the social spectrum feel some pride then that's admirable. But I'd rather do stuff like battlefield pt, FA, inf skills than drill, but that's just me I guess (would help with some of the xmas podge as well!)

Sorry, what lot are you with again?
 
#11
it's not the training, its the attitude. on camps cadets bimble round where they want. backchat and lack of respect for ranks go unnoticed, not even corrected!
student ran naked across the stage at the annual ball for crists sake! there were miner dignataries there, the culprit has "remaind unknown" and the worst that happened was a mention on next parade about responsable behavior!?! WTF

and as far as ACF is concerned, we did an even mix of all those things, we just give drill the importance it deserves as being equily important as the more "green" stuff.
 
#13
DOGboys said:
it's not the training, its the attitude. on camps cadets bimble round where they want. backchat and lack of respect for ranks go unnoticed, not even corrected!
student ran naked across the stage at the annual ball for crists sake! there were miner dignataries there, the culprit has "remaind unknown" and the worst that happened was a mention on next parade about responsable behavior!?! WTF

and as far as ACF is concerned, we did an even mix of all those things, we just give drill the importance it deserves as being equily important as the more "green" stuff.
I bet they can spell though - and it sounds like they're having fun too.

Maybe you should be in the TA.
 
#14
I think the difference is you are treated more like officers than other ranks. There isn't as much shouting, but then the people there are meant to be intelligent undergrads. etc. and boozing is not an abnormal way for messes to be used. If you visit a regiment's officers mess, you might find that certain aspects are quite similar (this being an observation rather than a statement of fact) as the people there are none too different either. I am enjoying it at OTC as it is a fulfilling option and don't see why you would rather be treated as a delinquent a la ACF. Ours seems to get a good balance of work hard play hard, without impinging too much on an already busy schedule (mine is anyway).
 
#15
DOGboys said:
"OTC is great, its just like CCF, no one minds about your dress, training is easy and we get to drink as well. i was worried they would shouting at us n stuff"
Nor was this the atttude in my CCF (but lets not turn this into another CCF vs ACF b1tch fest)!

I was also a bit disapointed with the OTC when I first joined, for what sound like similar reasons to you, although perhaps not quite to the same extent. I also found some of the training quite tedious because I had covered the same things in the CCF, in some cases I'd even taught it too!
Best thing is just to crack on and help your mates who aren't as experienced as you. Once you move on to the MTQ2 training though you will be going over things that are new to you and everyone else, and hopefully by that time those who aren't as keen/committed as you will have fallen by the wayside.

My advice to you would be stick with the OTC till after your annual camp this summer. If you're still having issues then perhaps you should move on, either to the TA or back to the ACF and train to become an AI.

PS The antics at your dinner sound quite amusing, perhaps you need to loosen up a bit. :wink:
 
#16
firstly, i'm dyslexic. i read all these posts out before i submit them, but mistakes still get through.

secondly, if your first instinct upon talking to someone you don't know is to take the p1ss and make not very funny jokes about them your going to make a very bad first impression, though i won't hold it against you.

thirdly, yes they are having fun, as i've said no problem with that
"in my opinion you should work hard to play hard"
it's just that they don't put in any of the hard work (i.e. iron kit, drill, polish boots, practice fieldcraft... i could go on)

the other day i had to help several second years to pass their mapwork test, most didn't know how to take a baring, convert from grid to mag... anything.
 
#17
ive got no problem with excessive drinking, i am often first at the bar/last to leave. i love the social side of it. it's just i'm getting to feel more and more that its the only side of it!
speed of training is to quick, so most have forgotten 1/2 the stuff by the time they get home, and everyone is pushed through the MTQ1 exam whether they have the skills or not. if their not good enough then a sargent will give you some "help", and hay presto your into MTQ2 training and you can't even put camo on properly!
 

BBear

LE
Kit Reviewer
#18
Hmmm, then I'd say maybe your unit isn't right for you, and your not right for the unit.

I also think it may be prudent to remind you that the otc is designed to give "future leaders of industry" (Apparently graduates...) an insight into the workings of the army so they'll (hopefully) look upon the military in a good light. Very good things if they happen to be working with TA guys and gals underneath them. Personally, I do OTC to get away at weekends, have a good fizz sesh, do something different and get on the (very cheap!) piss! I do not miss the endless bullshit that came with being in a ccf.

I see a lot of the more "bullshitty" side of being a member as a bit of a way of demonstrating your personal pride. But, ex-cadets usually have much higher standards then non, mainly because they've seen a uniform before.

But not being able to take a bearing is a cadet staple, isn't it...:p
 
#19
No OTCs are alike; however I speak for one (EUOTC) and like to think it combines some form of standards with treating all the cadets like the adults they are. Attendance is not compulsory; however when you attend less than 50% you are then becoming the lowest common denominator and warned then discharges. In uniform a reasonable standard is demanded (tidy hair, uncreased uniform polished boots) without getting overzealous.

For those out there who like to think that OTCs are booze ups alone an exemplar is the standard on a field firing week at camp is getting up to section live field firing, through pairs and fire teams and this is not done by cutting corners as the staff (rightly) cannot afford to do so. On the physical side most of the Unit are fitter than anything I have seen in most of the TA. This is not saying EUOTC are operationally deployable, we are not; neither is it comparing OTCs and ACFs; different objectives and members, both good organsiations.
 
#20
From reading your posts on here and from the other questions you have asked about commissioning and being an instructor, I wonder what you are expecting from the OTC?

You seem to have come from a background of being one of the senior cadets in your ACF unit and teaching other cadets. One thing I would ask you to consider is what do you want from your time in the OTC, do you want to learn or teach?

If its the teaching side you want then being an AI would be the way to go, remember current army tactics and lessons are very different in many ways from what you are taught in the ACF/ACF/cadets.

I have helped several times with the ACF cadets in my time with OTC and I am always reminded that they require very different skill sets.

I have done MTQ 1/2/3, a DIT's cse, CMT3, and the Battlefield Cas Trainer Cse plus other AT quals in my time so I can say for sure there is a world of opportunities out there for you with the OTC if you get stuck in and not take the attitude of "I've done this all before" you may well have but everyone has to start at a common level ie at the basics and work up. In case of most OTCs the instructors are some of the best in the army with a massive amount of operational and real world experience to draw on.

Most OTC's assume a certain amount of self-discipline on the part of Ocdts and personally I think this is were the POs show through but in order for this to happen requires a certain amount of critical mass (people) to work.

And hell yes when my Coy work hard we get fcuking wasted after!!!

PS come on name the unit :thumright: North or South?
 

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