EU - Whither or wither the European Union

Brotherton Lad

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#81
That cartoon sums up the EU perfectly
View attachment 360594

It is not EU ("our") money it is UK money that we have (overly) generously offered as a bribe to reach a deal. The EU consider this as their right, regardless of outcome!

Do you honestly think 'no deal' is a good idea?

Or would you prefer the upstarts to be sent homewards, to think again?
 
#82
Jean-Claude Bonkers (aka Drunker) is all that is wrong with those arrogant, ignorant political fakirs and Political Turd polishers in the EU-s Brussels Politburo. It is all too late for them now, now the rot has set in. The whole Political Experiment could fall apart in a few years. All this was forecast many years ago by Common market and EU brussels Watchers.

Taking a Dog in a Manger attitude is all they need for the whole rotten edifice to come apart like a piss and shite stained mattress falling apart at the seams.
 

Auld-Yin

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#83
Do you honestly think 'no deal' is a good idea?

Or would you prefer the upstarts to be sent homewards, to think again?
Why do you keep asking the same question instead of address the point made in the post? Are you under instruction from HQ EU to dissemble posts that query the EU ethos?

Is the money ours, or theirs? If a deal is good for both sides, should we even pay any of the bribe money?
 

Brotherton Lad

LE
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#84
Why do you keep asking the same question instead of address the point made in the post? Are you under instruction from HQ EU to dissemble posts that query the EU ethos?

Is the money ours, or theirs? If a deal is good for both sides, should we even pay any of the bribe money?
Don't worry. The UK will pay its dues.

I suspect it will continue to do so.
 

Auld-Yin

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#85
Don't worry. The UK will pay its dues.

I suspect it will continue to do so.
I suppose that is as close (but not quite) an answer as I will ever get from you!
 
#86
I think the EUs breaking point will be the Euro which is a political fudge, not a true natural currency. No currency union has ever lasted more than 25 years without political union, yet there are many long lived natural currency unions (Sterling, US$, AU$ etc etc), Rouble etc etc.

In a natural currency union, trade cash flows from poor to rich areas of the union are balanced by subsidies in the other direction because there is an implicit political will to do so. Thus regions at different stages in their economic cycle can share the same interest rate.

The political fudge that the Euro founding fathers claimed would solve this dilemma was convergence; allow in only countries with economies with convergent debt ratios, interest rates etc and balance any minor divergence with Target 2 balances, effectively short term debt.

But they let the PIIGS, allowing economies like Greece to operate on an interest rate suitable for Germany’s. So PIIGS governments, businesses and citizens could borrow at German rates often from compliant German banks to buy BMWs so the cash flow headed back to Germany. Thus Germany has built up a massive trade surplus built on high risk debt held by its own banks. While the debt has been used to buy stuff rather than invest in growth.

It can’t won’t survive the next global recession which is probably a near term event given Trumpian economics. The fall out will be bitter.
 

Auld-Yin

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#90
Summarise please, are they furrit or agin Macron?
 
#91
Summarise please, are they furrit or agin Macron?
Macron is popular (within the EU establishment) and his enthusiasm for the EU and his energy are generally appreciated. Defence and border protection seems to resonate but further, deeper integration and reform not so much. It is reckoned that he will not give up trying but that the EU as a body is stubborn, unmoving and glacial in response to any suggestions of reform or changing direction. Your assessments may differ.

ETA to clarify that the question posed in the article was in the context of the EU and their support for Macron NOT the public support for Macron which we know is not good.
 
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#92
Macron is popular and his enthusiasm for the EU and his energy are generally appreciated. Defence and border protection seems to resonate but further, deeper integration and reform not so much. It is reckoned that he will not give up trying but that the EU as a body is stubborn, unmoving and glacial in response to any suggestions of reform or changing direction. Your assessments may differ.

My bold .. really? French President Emmanuel Macron's job-approval rating hits its lowest point yet
snip "Fewer than two years into his first term as France's president, Emmanuel Macron is staring down his lowest approval rating yet, and has become more unpopular than his predecessor Francois Hollande was at the same point in office.
The majority of respondents in the Ifop poll claimed they disagree with Macron’s vision for the country or the economy, and 78% said he was out of touch with the worries of the French people"
 
#93
My bold .. really? French President Emmanuel Macron's job-approval rating hits its lowest point yet
snip "Fewer than two years into his first term as France's president, Emmanuel Macron is staring down his lowest approval rating yet, and has become more unpopular than his predecessor Francois Hollande was at the same point in office.
The majority of respondents in the Ifop poll claimed they disagree with Macron’s vision for the country or the economy, and 78% said he was out of touch with the worries of the French people"
The question posed in the article was in the context of the EU and their support for Macron NOT the public support. I should have made that clear but it was a direct reply to @Auld-Yin rather than a general post. ETA now added to my post to that effect. Hope that helps.
 
#94
A lot of questions have been asked about cash flow in this thread. I think the EU has worked out a new revenue generation scheme though.
In the last year the EU has find Google 7.7Bn USD alone. It's also been creating laws that allow it to fine social media companies for chunks of their profits.

Of course that raises questions about how long they can carry on, and when will the companies say "Bugger this for a game of soldiers." and close access to accounts in Europe, similar to what happened with GDPR.
 
#95
A lot of questions have been asked about cash flow in this thread. I think the EU has worked out a new revenue generation scheme though.
In the last year the EU has find Google 7.7Bn USD alone. It's also been creating laws that allow it to fine social media companies for chunks of their profits.

Of course that raises questions about how long they can carry on, and when will the companies say "Bugger this for a game of soldiers." and close access to accounts in Europe, similar to what happened with GDPR.
I'd love these companies to relocate their European HQs to the UK once Brexit has been done, not sure that will stop the EU fining them but at least their taxes would not be paid to the EU, a big two fingers up to them :)
 
#98
I'm looking forward to the point where the UK leaves and BMW, VAG and Mercedes suddnly realise that 20% of their market has just evaporated. I drive a Merc BTW but if the price for a replacement goes stupid it wou't stop me buying a Mazda / Honda / Suzuki when the time comes.

Brinksmanship is wonderful.

The EU however must be trembling in it's collective boots as with one country leaving, it sets a precedent for others to do the same.

What if Italy said "Stuff this for a game of soldiers" and left? Or Greece, or Poland?

I suspect that the Federalists are distinctly worried.
 
#99
I'm looking forward to the point where the UK leaves and BMW, VAG and Mercedes suddnly realise that 20% of their market has just evaporated. I drive a Merc BTW but if the price for a replacement goes stupid it wou't stop me buying a Mazda / Honda / Suzuki when the time comes.

Brinksmanship is wonderful.

The EU however must be trembling in it's collective boots as with one country leaving, it sets a precedent for others to do the same.

What if Italy said "Stuff this for a game of soldiers" and left? Or Greece, or Poland?

I suspect that the Federalists are distinctly worried.
I currently drive a merc, the wife has an Audi. Neither of us will be buying either again and are currently looking at buying Japanese or Korean.

I truly hope many more follow suit, it would teach the Germans a very much needed lesson.
 
I currently drive a merc, the wife has an Audi. Neither of us will be buying either again and are currently looking at buying Japanese or Korean.

I truly hope many more follow suit, it would teach the Germans a very much needed lesson.
I would have considered a Skoda but as it's part of VAG there are emissions questions. The Czech built cars still seem better built than the German vehicles. Hard to choose French cars when the workers frequently engage in violent demonstrations and threaten to blow up their factories. That's not what unions were originally created for.
 

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