EU to establish joint air transport fleet

#1
EU to establish joint air transport fleet


BRUSSELS, Belgium: EU governments agreed Monday to establish a joint military air squadron to improve their transport capabilities to far-flung operations such as Afghanistan, Africa or the Middle East.

The 27-nation bloc has had a long-standing shortfall in available military transport planes, and EU defense ministers meeting in Brussels hope to reduce this by pooling C-130s, the new Airbus A400 heavy lifter and other types of cargo aircraft.

Czech Republic, France, Germany, Greece, Italy, Luxembourg, Netherlands, Portugal, Romania, Slovakia and Spain have signed on to the initiative, which will be implemented by the European Defense Agency, the ministers said in a statement.


"Pooling European aircraft and services will improve the lift capabilities and alleviate a significant European shortfall," agency director Alexander Weis said.

The agency has not yet determined how many aircraft would participate in the joint squadron. But defense agency officials have said they plan to concentrate the planes on one or two European air bases to make it easier to deploy them in an emergency.


In recent years, troops from EU nations have operated in places like Lebanon, Congo or Aceh in Indonesia. They have relied mainly on the U.S. or NATO for logistical support because of their lack of air transport.

The new, much-delayed prototype of the A400M, the first military plane produced by Europe's Airbus consortium, is scheduled to take to the sky soon. About 200 will enter service in eight EU air forces starting in 2009.

The defense ministers' statement agreed to boost the capabilities of the EU's transport helicopter fleets by 2009. This would include upgrading the obsolescent Soviet-built helicopters still in air force inventories in Eastern Europe, and a long-term Franco-German-led project to develop a new heavy-duty transport chopper.


The ministers also said they would make sure that at least one of Europe's five operational aircraft carriers will be at sea at all times. These would be escorted by destroyers and frigates from various other EU nations, which would also provide refueling and other logistics vessels.


The European Defense Agency was created in 2004 to boost cooperation, eliminate duplication and end fragmentation of the European defense market, which is worth about 30 billion euros a year.

"These programs will create tangible European capabilities and improve the capacity for crisis management operations," said EU foreign policy chief Javier Solana, who chaired the meeting.

___

Associated Press writer Paul Ames contributed to this report.
http://www.iht.com/articles/ap/2008/11/10/europe/EU-EU-Defense.php

European Air Transport Fleet Launched

Brussels, 10 November 2008, Press Release European Defence Ministers, meeting in the Steering Board of the European Defence Agency, launched today concrete initiatives and projects for improving European military capabilities. Decisions were taken on programmes related to air transport, maritime surveillance and helicopters, amongst others.
"This is the concrete follow-up to the discussions which took place at the Informal EU Defence Ministers meeting in Deauville early October. We are seeing today that the Agency can very quickly translate political intentions into concrete proposals. These programmes will create tangible European capabilities and improve the capacity for crisis management operations”, said Head of the Agency Javier Solana, who chaired the meeting.
European Air Transport Fleet

European Defence Ministers launched today EDA work on establishing a European Air Transport Fleet (EATF). A Declaration of Intent on participation in the initiative was signed by Defence Ministers of Belgium, Czech Republic, France, Germany, Greece, Italy, Luxembourg, Netherlands, Portugal, Romania, Slovakia and Spain.
The EATF aims at reducing European air transport shortfalls by pooling aircraft such as the A400M and C130. Participation can take different forms: making aircraft available; purchasing, providing or exchanging flying hours; or to provide and benefit from shared and/or pooled support functions (training, maintenance, etc.). Milestones have been set with the aim of reaching EATF initial operational capability by the next decade.
“The EATF Declaration is most welcome, as pooling European aircraft and services will improve the lift capabilities and alleviate a significant European shortfall”, said Alexander Weis, the Agency’s Chief Executive.
Maritime Mine Counter-Measures

The Steering Board also launched two other projects. Ten Member States (Belgium, Estonia, Finland, France, Germany, Netherlands, Poland, Portugal, Romania and Sweden) plus Norway will work closely together in an EDA project for the future replacement of their maritime mine counter-measures capabilities in an EDA project. Activities will commence with an assessment phase, leading to recommendations for the selection of systems solutions and addressing all relevant aspects. Mine counter-measures in littoral sea areas has been identified as one of the initial 12 prioritised actions in the context of the Agency’s Capability Development Plan (CDP).
Future Unmanned Aerial System

Another project, related to Maritime Surveillance, is the launch of work for a Future Unmanned Aerial System. Based on common requirements, seven Member States (Finland, France, Germany, Poland, Portugal, Spain and Sweden) will begin the preparations for the development of an unmanned aerial system, which will be able to take off and land on a ship’s deck. This future system will increase the capability for wide area surveillance in support of ESDP operations, a need which has been identified in the Capability Development Plan.
Space-based Earth Surveillance System

Five Member States (Belgium, France, Germany, Greece, Spain) signed a Letter of Intent on the second generation of space-based imaging capacity. This Multinational Space-based Imaging System for surveillance, reconnaissance and observation (MUSIS) project aims at continuity of service from 2015 onwards. The MUSIS partners intend to launch an EDA Category B project on the basis on their initiative, which will be open for other Member States' participation.
Helicopters

The Steering Board endorsed a roadmap for the Helicopter Tactics Training Programme, part of the Agency’s work to improve availability of helicopters for ESDP operations. The contents of this programme will be defined in the course of 2009, based on the results of two studies – focussing on the requirements – and the lessons learned from an exercise, to take place in France in spring 2009. The Programme itself will start in 2010.
“The Agency is quickly progressing with its helicopter work. The Helicopter Tactics Programme is proving that in some cases training can provide additional capabilities in the short-term. Improving ESDP capabilities does not always require new equipment”, said Alexander Weis, EDA’s Chief Executive.
Ministers also took stock of the progress made on the Agency’s work on upgrading helicopters, with the aim to offer a detailed menu with upgrade options by spring 2009.
Germany and France informed the Steering Board of their intent to bring their bilateral initiative for a Future Transport Helicopter into the Agency in the near future, opening up the project to other interested Member States. The project aims at developing intra-theatre transport helicopter for the 2020+ timeframe.
European Defence Research and Technology Strategy

Ministers endorsed the European Defence Research and Technology (EDRT) Strategy to enhance and develop more effective research collaboration to deliver timely the right technologies in support of military capabilities. The Strategy defines “ends” (key technologies to invest in), “means” (how to invest better, such as through improved R&T collaborations) and “ways” (roadmaps and action plans). Four of the 12 priority actions of the Capability Development Plan have been chosen for identifying potential R&T projects: Counter-Man Portable Air-Defence Systems (C-MANPADS), Mine Counter- Measures, Counter-Improvised Explosive Devices (C-IED) and Chemical, Biological and Radiological or Nuclear (CBRN) - specifically detection of biological weapons.
The EDRT Strategy completes the EDA work on its strategic framework. With the CDP as the overall strategic tool this framework consists of the EDRT Strategy, the Armaments Cooperation Strategy (endorsed in October 2008) and the European Defence Technological and Industrial Base Strategy (endorsed in May 2007).
Innovative Concepts and Emerging Technologies

Ten Member States (Cyprus, France, Germany, Greece, Hungary, Italy, Poland, Slovakia, Slovenia and Spain) plus Norway signed the Programme Arrangement for the Joint Investment Programme on Innovative Concepts and Emerging Technologies (JIP-ICET). The Programme aims at promoting basic research cooperation, for example on an integrated navigation architecture and on nanotechnologies for soldier protection.
Forum for Military Airworthiness Authorities

Ministers decided to create a European Union-wide Forum for Military Airworthiness Authorities. This Forum will be used to harmonise the different national military airworthiness regulations within the European Union in order to stop duplication of work, to reduce costs and to shorten timelines for multinational procurement.
Work Programme

The Steering Board approved the Agency’s Work Programme for 2009. The focus of the Work Programme is on concrete projects, in particular related to the 12 prioritised actions stemming from the Capability Development Plan. The Agency will have a 2009 budget of € 30m, including € 8m operational budget for studies, and will recruit ten new staff. The budget was adopted by the General Affairs and External Relations Council in Defence Ministers formation.
Defence Data 2007

Ministers were informed on the results of the Agency’s defence data-collecting for 2007 and on the assessment of the collective benchmarks for Defence R&T and equipment procurement. A dedicated brochure has been released.
http://www.eda.europa.eu/newsitem.aspx?id=422


Ok seeing as this will raise some heckles aroud here, and I'm not opposed to the idea/s and I think the EDAs a good idea, I'll get me coat......runs off
 
#4
jagman said:
Another great big steaming pile of shite of an idea.
Thats all I have to say about that.
Why? As long as they dont take it to far.. well.. yeh...

But the joint air transport idea seemed pretty solid to me. I cant see the down side to getting supplies to Afghan faster.
 
#5
Whiskey_60 said:
The first step of my Battalion becoming the 23rd Battalion UK Infantry Regiment (V).

I think not. More smoke and mirrors like the 'European Rapid Reaction Corps' Just a planning team with NO troops dedicated and no politocal will to actually do anything with it.

I might have missed it, but I could find no reference to UK air assets being involved anyway. Ultimately no country will give up a veto on the employment of its aircraft and aircrew in any given theatre of operations so all pretty meaningless anyway.

Fear not, and besides, the EU wouldn't want your battalion anyway. If there was a Euro army it would be multi-national, multi-lingual, diverse, gender free and would surrender or run away at every possible opportunity.
 
#6
jagman said:
Another great big steaming pile of shite of an idea.
Thats all I have to say about that.
http://www.eda.europa.eu/ebbweb/
Probably shouldn't go to that link then, lot's of British money going to Johnny foreigner companies :twisted:
 

Alsacien

MIA
Moderator
#8
Karl_uk said:
jagman said:
Another great big steaming pile of shite of an idea.
Thats all I have to say about that.
Why? As long as they dont take it to far.. well.. yeh...

But the joint air transport idea seemed pretty solid to me. I cant see the down side to getting supplies to Afghan faster.
You crazy fool how can it be a good idea?
It has the dreaded abbreviation of "EU" in it, it must be bad.. :wink:
 
#9
Bullshot! said:
Whiskey_60 said:
The first step of my Battalion becoming the 23rd Battalion UK Infantry Regiment (V).
. If there was a Euro army it would be multi-national, multi-lingual, diverse, gender free and would surrender or run away at every possible opportunity.
Slightly insulting to all those Danes/Czechs/Poles/Dutch/Germans/French ect ect who have died in Iraq and Afghanistan there chief.....
 
#10
Bullshot! said:
Whiskey_60 said:
The first step of my Battalion becoming the 23rd Battalion UK Infantry Regiment (V).

I think not. More smoke and mirrors like the 'European Rapid Reaction Corps' Just a planning team with NO troops dedicated and no politocal will to actually do anything with it.

I might have missed it, but I could find no reference to UK air assets being involved anyway. Ultimately no country will give up a veto on the employment of its aircraft and aircrew in any given theatre of operations so all pretty meaningless anyway.

Fear not, and besides, the EU wouldn't want your battalion anyway. If there was a Euro army it would be multi-national, multi-lingual, diverse, gender free and would surrender or run away at every possible opportunity.
Yeah you're right.

They'd probably frown on great social acts such as tea-bagging and naked bar.

The bunch of Jessies.
 
#11
heard_it_all_before said:
Haven't read the full post. But I guess that the entire set-up will be funded by the British Tax Payer...?
Is there any British taxpayer money left?...I kid I kid :wink: .....and no


but we also won't mention the huge amount of EU cash under the 6th/7th framework programmes that have gone into British companies and universities....no that would be wrong.....
 
#12
petergriffen said:
Bullshot! said:
Whiskey_60 said:
The first step of my Battalion becoming the 23rd Battalion UK Infantry Regiment (V).
. If there was a Euro army it would be multi-national, multi-lingual, diverse, gender free and would surrender or run away at every possible opportunity.
Slightly insulting to all those Danes/Czechs/Poles/Dutch/Germans/French ect ect who have died in Iraq and Afghanistan there chief.....
Not at all. A product of the EU would be precisely that. It says nothing about the competence and bravery of soldiers from the constituent parts of the EU. That said, national caveats on employment of troops - which is a political, not a military matter - ARE a major issue in Afghanistan.
 
#13
Bullshot! said:
petergriffen said:
Bullshot! said:
Whiskey_60 said:
The first step of my Battalion becoming the 23rd Battalion UK Infantry Regiment (V).
. If there was a Euro army it would be multi-national, multi-lingual, diverse, gender free and would surrender or run away at every possible opportunity.
Slightly insulting to all those Danes/Czechs/Poles/Dutch/Germans/French ect ect who have died in Iraq and Afghanistan there chief.....
Not at all. A product of the EU would be precisely that. It says nothing about the competence and bravery of soldiers from the constituent parts of the EU. That said, national caveats on employment of troops - which is a political, not a military matter - ARE a major issue in Afghanistan.
aIndeed, but "surrender" and "run away" are not, politicians of any country are usually the weasly whiny ****'s who put the troops in the shit in the first place, I don't think any country is blessed with exceptional amounts of talented dedicated sensible politicians.
 
#14
petergriffen said:
Bullshot! said:
petergriffen said:
Bullshot! said:
Whiskey_60 said:
The first step of my Battalion becoming the 23rd Battalion UK Infantry Regiment (V).
. If there was a Euro army it would be multi-national, multi-lingual, diverse, gender free and would surrender or run away at every possible opportunity.
Slightly insulting to all those Danes/Czechs/Poles/Dutch/Germans/French ect ect who have died in Iraq and Afghanistan there chief.....
Not at all. A product of the EU would be precisely that. It says nothing about the competence and bravery of soldiers from the constituent parts of the EU. That said, national caveats on employment of troops - which is a political, not a military matter - ARE a major issue in Afghanistan.
aIndeed, but "surrender" and "run away" are not, politicians of any country are usually the weasly whiny *'s who put the troops in the s*** in the first place, I don't think any country is blessed with exceptional amounts of talented dedicated sensible politicians.
PG - you disappoint me, I thought you weren't a cynic :D
 
#15
Bullshot! said:
petergriffen said:
Bullshot! said:
petergriffen said:
Bullshot! said:
Whiskey_60 said:
The first step of my Battalion becoming the 23rd Battalion UK Infantry Regiment (V).
. If there was a Euro army it would be multi-national, multi-lingual, diverse, gender free and would surrender or run away at every possible opportunity.
Slightly insulting to all those Danes/Czechs/Poles/Dutch/Germans/French ect ect who have died in Iraq and Afghanistan there chief.....
Not at all. A product of the EU would be precisely that. It says nothing about the competence and bravery of soldiers from the constituent parts of the EU. That said, national caveats on employment of troops - which is a political, not a military matter - ARE a major issue in Afghanistan.
aIndeed, but "surrender" and "run away" are not, politicians of any country are usually the weasly whiny *'s who put the troops in the s*** in the first place, I don't think any country is blessed with exceptional amounts of talented dedicated sensible politicians.
PG - you disappoint me, I thought you weren't a cynic :D
Just about politicians mate, I rank them somewhere down there with rapists/child molestors and insurance salesmen :wink:
 
#16
petergriffen said:
but we also won't mention the huge amount of EU cash under the 6th/7th framework programmes that have gone into British companies and universities....no that would be wrong.....
Cough, splutter, choke. Keyboard of the DECwriter terminal we use for web surfing here at the Home for Bewildered Matelots is now covered in Sanatogen Tonic Wine.

I stand ready to be corrected, but last time I looked, Britain was one of only 4 net contributors to the EU. The others were Germany, Italy and, IIRC, Holland. All other member states are net recipients of the 'EU' cash that we generously provide.

So that huge amount of EU cash would be a small fraction of the UK cash that we give the EU each year.
 
#17
Hello,

as Ancient_Mariner pointed out,in 2007 the United Kingdom contributed £4,700 million pounds more to the European Union than it got back.
Our net contribution will increase over coming years,see here:

http://www.global-vision.net/perspectives11.asp

Perhaps petergriffen can how much that "huge amount of EU cash under the 6th/7th framework programmes" is as a percentage of the £12,600 million we gave to the European Union last year?


tangosix.
 
#18
Ancient_Mariner said:
petergriffen said:
but we also won't mention the huge amount of EU cash under the 6th/7th framework programmes that have gone into British companies and universities....no that would be wrong.....
Cough, splutter, choke. Keyboard of the DECwriter terminal we use for web surfing here at the Home for Bewildered Matelots is now covered in Sanatogen Tonic Wine.

I stand ready to be corrected, but last time I looked, Britain was one of only 4 net contributors to the EU. The others were Germany, Italy and, IIRC, Holland. All other member states are net recipients of the 'EU' cash that we generously provide.

So that huge amount of EU cash would be a small fraction of the UK cash that we give the EU each year.
Easy skipper!! you'll give yourself a coronary....the framework programmes don't count into contributions/rebates or anything like that, they are the multi year R&D programmes, billions upon billions spent developing everything from medical treatments/equipment to computer technology to green energy and fusion research and everything in between you just have to look through the list of approved project's that have British universities/research groups and companies 100 of million if not billions in research grants,
I'll give you a few, Reaction engines based at the Culham science center in Oxfordshire, they have some far out stuff they are working on, real sci-fi shit, a hypersonic airline to get you from London to Sydney Australia in 2 1/2 hours! REs bit is the SCIMITAR engine for it., their SABRE 1 stage to orbit engine

how about Rolls Royce aero engines the EU's funding a chunk of their work on next gen engines..

how about Digital freeview TV that the UK got a head start in and helped define and develope, well that was in no small part helped along by a programme called VALIDATE...gues where that was funded from?


How about something that was annouced 2 Days ago by Cardiff university, they have research a way to design white blood cells to detect and perhaps destroy the HIV-1 virus...cooly they have named it the "assassin cell"

I'm probably boring people now so I'll leave off with this, sure there are plenty of thing's to bitch at the whole EU idea/implementation I know I do, but there are things it also does right...whteher people think so or not....

climbs off soapbox........ throws megaphone away
 
#19
tangosix said:
Hello,

as Ancient_Mariner pointed out,in 2007 the United Kingdom contributed £4,700 million pounds more to the European Union than it got back.
Our net contribution will increase over coming years,see here:

http://www.global-vision.net/perspectives11.asp

Perhaps petergriffen can how much that "huge amount of EU cash under the 6th/7th framework programmes" is as a percentage of the £12,600 million we gave to the European Union last year?


tangosix.
Yeah it was a sizable chunk, but if that's the game of marbles here's the deal, the UK can have it's 12 billion back, while all the UK companies ect can sign over the patents ect they got with the EU money....that's worth a bit of loose change....agreed?



I'm sure the British Government will be more then happy to fill in the funding gaps caused.........
 
#20
Can I go on one of the French planes please? I hear the in-flight catering is far superior and you get your own bottle of wine with it, as well.
Then again, maybe a Danish one for the in-flight movies.
 

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