Eu head wants an EU army

It was essentially the same troops. Just a different chain of command and different rules of engagement in a rapidly evolving environment.
I don't recall saying otherwise. The point was 'how long did it take NATO action to take' and we're talking less than a month. The better question would be 'how long did it take for the UN to pontificate and authorise ground troops to be sent in'?
 
Military forces are deployed for political reasons. Who would be the decision makers on the political front-end?
 
You never answer a question yourself and dissect commentary in a forensic zeal to be always right, by finding an inconsistency and wrapping up your investigation. Its all very novel an approach to debate and shows the respect you have for other people.

Your constant lies about my authenticity, only shows up your own lack of judgement and I am left no option.
You on another fibathon? So, where do you get your lexicon from then?
 
I don't recall saying otherwise. The point was 'how long did it take NATO action to take' and we're talking less than a month. The better question would be 'how long did it take for the UN to pontificate and authorise ground troops to be sent in'?

It took ages, as you well know. Then they were deployed in under adequate numbers (my TAOR in Tuzla had one company and a line on the map about 200km long) and with a very limited mandate which people like me and many others were obliged to exceed on many occasions.
 
We established before your dislike for me and my views, but I still gave you a modicum of respect when you asked me my experience to backup my pontificating and an explanation, which I gave.
I don't recall saying otherwise. You just went off and did some more baseless accusations such as I don't answer questions.
Your response to my show of respect in answering your question, on a serious thread was simply: "You do think IFOR/SFOR was a waste then. Thanks", I would call that dismissive and disrespectful.
You said:
Now with distance, you think of the pointlessness of it all and trust me you will eventually have those same doubts... You I assume are still serving and lets talk again 10 or more years after you depart the services about the rights and wrongs of a particular mission or war.
Does "Now with distance, you think of the pointlessness of it all" to which I replied "You do think IFOR/SFOR was a waste then. Thanks" not mean it wasn't a waste then? What did you mean by 'pointlessness'?

You then decided to lecture me and said I'd regret it all in time which I decided to ignore.
 
One assumes our spineless government have already informed the EU, we will be providing no support to a potential future EU Army and our present commitments post-brexit, will see a withdrawal from EU Missions.

Of course not, we are the pushovers of the world.
 
One assumes our spineless government have already informed the EU, we will be providing no support to a potential future EU Army and our present commitments post-brexit, will see a withdrawal from EU Missions.

Of course not, we are the pushovers of the world.

PMTM has already assured the EU that the UK will continue to support European security. This is only sensible.

Come on now, Comecon.
 
It took ages, as you well know. Then they were deployed in under adequate numbers (my TAOR in Tuzla had one company and a line on the map about 200km long) and with a very limited mandate which people like me and many others were obliged to exceed on many occasions.
Between Dayton being signed and IFOR going in? Or are you talking about the UN? Or are you saying IFOR wasn't big enough during initial deployment? In which case, you've moved away from the original question I believe.
 
Between Dayton being signed and IFOR going in? Or are you talking about the UN? Or are you saying IFOR wasn't big enough during initial deployment? In which case, you've moved away from the original question I believe.
I was answering your question about UNPROFOR.
 
PMTM has already assured the EU that the UK will continue to support European security. This is only sensible.

Come on now, Comecon.
I think you need to recalibrate what contributes to 'European security'
 
One assumes our spineless government have already informed the EU, we will be providing no support to a potential future EU Army
We will shortly have no say in any future EU Army, irrespective of our views on it
..and our present commitments post-brexit, will see a withdrawal from EU Missions.
Nope, as above Op Althea. Maybe the UK govt sees a bigger picture?
Of course not, we are the pushovers of the world.
Either you believe in alliances or not?
 
I don't recall saying otherwise. You just went off and did some more baseless accusations such as I don't answer questions.

You said:

Does "Now with distance, you think of the pointlessness of it all" to which I replied "You do think IFOR/SFOR was a waste then. Thanks" not mean it wasn't a waste then? What did you mean by 'pointlessness'?

You then decided to lecture me and said I'd regret it all in time which I decided to ignore.
So you think that an old soldier expresses an opinion on the pointlessness of a peacekeeping mission and all sides been rather nasty and that equates to it been a waste. I meant exactly what I said 'Pointlessness'.

Northern Ireland was another example of pointlessness, would you care to suggest that it was waste as well ?
 
So you think that an old soldier expresses an opinion on the pointlessness of a peacekeeping mission and all sides been rather nasty and that equates to it been a waste. I meant exactly what I said 'Pointlessness'.
If you didn’t mean ‘pointlessness’ was a waste, what did you mean it as?
Northern Ireland was another example of pointlessness, would you care to suggest that it was waste as well ?
I’m not calling it ‘pointlessness’. You are. If you don’t mean ‘pointlessness’ was a waste, what did you mean it as?
 
In chats with my neighbours in France - usually after a few drinks - the Second World War is an interesting topic. Last June the 6th a few of us happened to be having a few glasses of rosé when I mentioned it was the anniversary of D-Day. Only one of them showed any understanding, and he was from Normandy. He had to elaborate for the others.

WWII just does not evoke the same response in France - e.g. Armistice Day is an event, but nothing to do with WWII. Difficult to know whether it is collective guilt, but it is a very different mentality to the British one.
of course it's a different feeling. As collectives (obviously there were fascist in Britain, the resistance in France and some very brave folk in Germany) the nation's of Europe have differing outlooks.

Germans don't like mentioning it because of atrocities(numerous) committed by them. And they're the baddies. Their true heroes forever stained by the blood spilt by others. There is little difference between the fire fighters of the London blitz, Coventry or any number of places and those of Dresden, Hamburg or Berlin.

France don't like that they were defeated and saved. I have never worked out why they didn't fight for la belle France, rather than not only surrender but work with the boxheads. And that is, perhaps, what stings them the most. Other countries were completely overrun. Only France had a rump government ruling 2/3red of the country on behalf of the occupying nation.

Britain is an eternal reminder. When alone we stood. We sent our children to the safety. We sheltered in our cities. Churchill and the King (or the remainder of the royal family) stayed in London. We eat less. We collected pans, church bells and railings and made weapons. Regardless of the realities we can look to our few, our magnificent little ships, our firemen. Our home guard and auxiliaries. When the Dutch were starving our bombers swapped out bombs for food. We based troops from America and ferried them to Normandy.

we relied upon our empire and, for Europe's freedom, paid a hefty financial prove and lost an empire.

And afterwards?

with worn out tools we stooped. Rebuilding broken things we'd given all for. We'd staked one heap and lost it, forced to start again.

that's a little too much to bear when your country were the baddies or were the liberated.
 
I've heard comments like that in Germany, I think from Merkel. It struck at the time that the statement is rubbish and that it was more of an attempt to sell a successful EU to a reluctant audience.
Careful. The intellectual remaINers will be along to tell you that the Euro did indeed bring leave to Europe, vanquish communism , bring down the iron curtain, and world poverty and break up right said Fred.
 
Don't forget the purpose of the United Kingdom as a permanent member of the security council is to automatically get involved in every conflict going, we have certainly doled out commitments to half the world with an ever decreasing ability to actually operate with the necessary forces at great cost in both blood and treasure.

This European guarantee that May has given to the EU, without anything in return. Is the very reason why I believe that the world has been taken the p**s out of us for so long and trump is perfectly correct to highlight its way past time for the p**stake party to come to an end.

Always thought we should have offered the P5 seat to the EU as a pointless imperial heirloom in return for something tangible from them.
 
Don't forget the purpose of the United Kingdom as a permanent member of the security council is to automatically get involved in every conflict going, we have certainly doled out commitments to half the world with an ever decreasing ability to actually operate with the necessary forces at great cost in both blood and treasure.
Which has what to do with the proposed EU Army? Or are you just ‘grandstanding’ again?
This European guarantee that May has given to the EU, without anything in return. Is the very reason why I believe that the world has been taken the p**s out of us for so long and trump is perfectly correct to highlight its way past time for the p**stake party to come to an end.
Fine by me. All pay 2% or leave the club. Or are you in favour of Trump’s 4%?
Always thought we should have offered the P5 seat to the EU as a pointless imperial heirloom in return for something tangible from them.
I thought that was France’s job? What do you think we should get from the EU for ‘gifting’ them a P5 place?

Ireland thinks they should be there btw. Do you want to give it to them?
 

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