ESTA advice for visiting USA

Fang_Farrier

LE
Kit Reviewer
Book Reviewer
#1
Does anybody know where I can get a good definiation of what consitutes a "Crime of Moral Turpitude" as is relevant to applying on the ESTA to visit USA later in year.

It would appear that Young Miss Fang's partner has a conviction which we are unsure comes under that or not. (It's nothing too serious but as it's ARRSE will not publish it on here but would PM it if you think you can help)

They tried the US embassy but were only told to come in and visit to discuss it without being asked any details. As it's at the other end, it would mean a couple of hundred quid to travel there when it is hopefully not necessary.
 

Fang_Farrier

LE
Kit Reviewer
Book Reviewer
#3
Well, why didn't I think of that!

Of course I'd looked there but unfortunately it does not give a precise definiation relevant to his conviction,
 

Fang_Farrier

LE
Kit Reviewer
Book Reviewer
#4
#5
I thought this bit was probably the clearest:

Travelers with arrests/conviction(s)
Under United States visa law people who have been arrested at anytime are not eligible to travel visa free under the Visa Waiver Program(VWP); they are required to apply for visas before traveling. If the arrest resulted in a conviction, the individual may require a special restricted visa in order to travel. The Rehabilitation of Offenders Act does not apply to United States visa law. Therefore, even travelers with a spent conviction are not eligible to travel visa free; they must apply for B-1 or B-2 visas. If they attempt to travel under the VWP, they may be refused entry into the United States.

Traffic offenses
Travelers with minor traffic offenses which did not result in an arrest and/or conviction for the offense may travel visa free, provided they are otherwise qualified. If you are not sure whether or not you are eligible to travel visa free, the only way to resolve this question is to apply for a visa.

If the traffic offense occurred in the United States, and there is an outstanding fine against you, or you did not attend your court hearing, it is possible there may be a warrant out for your arrest, and you will experience problems when applying for admission into the United States. Therefore, you should resolve the issue before traveling by contacting the court where you were to appear. If you do not know the address of the court, the information is available from the Internet at Court Locator.
 

FORMER_FYRDMAN

LE
Book Reviewer
#6
Does anybody know where I can get a good definiation of what consitutes a "Crime of Moral Turpitude" as is relevant to applying on the ESTA to visit USA later in year.

It would appear that Young Miss Fang's partner has a conviction which we are unsure comes under that or not. (It's nothing too serious but as it's ARRSE will not publish it on here but would PM it if you think you can help)

They tried the US embassy but were only told to come in and visit to discuss it without being asked any details. As it's at the other end, it would mean a couple of hundred quid to travel there when it is hopefully not necessary.
The Yanks have no sense of humour when it comes to immigration issues - I would be inclined to have a chat at the embassy rather than hope it will be alright on the night. Houston tends to be more relaxed because of the oil and gas business so a Nigerian visa is not an automatic rubber glove, everywhere else you get gripped in my experience and US passport control is not being assessed for it's willingness to play fast and loose with the regulations - anomalies will be turned back - at best. Pay your £200, accept it's because you're Scottish and remember that, unlike the Yanks, the English will let you into Carlisle with no questions asked...
 
#7
Hmmm not quite as simple as just ESTA. IIRC if you have ever been arrested (please note, that is arrested, not convicted) you are not entitled to travel to the US under the visa waiver programme and you have to get a visa from the US embassy in London.

My brother was convicted for drink driving 20 years ago, had to get a full visa entailing interview in Grosvener Square. Cost quite a bit too. Problem is, if you chance it and they turn you round at the border you lose the holiday, the lot. Not worth the risk IMHO. I'll see if I can dig out the link for you.
 

Fang_Farrier

LE
Kit Reviewer
Book Reviewer
#8
Thanks, must of missed that bit. I don't think the crime fits what they define as moral turpitude but I'm not a lawyer.

As bits of say that if not moral turpitude then not a problem and the declaration on the ESTA specifically sayamoral turpitude but that would appear to contrdict it as it says any arrest, not even conviction.
 
#9
Links

Visa Waiver Program | Embassy of the United States London, UK

Travelers who have been arrested, even if the arrest did not result in a criminal conviction, those with criminal records, (the Rehabilitation of Offenders Act does not apply to U.S. visa law), certain serious communicable illnesses, those who have been refused admission into, or have been deported from, the United States, or have previously overstayed on the VWP are not eligible to travel visa free under the Visa Waiver Program.
 
#10
Does anybody know where I can get a good definiation of what consitutes a "Crime of Moral Turpitude" as is relevant to applying on the ESTA to visit USA later in year.

It would appear that Young Miss Fang's partner has a conviction which we are unsure comes under that or not. (It's nothing too serious but as it's ARRSE will not publish it on here but would PM it if you think you can help)

They tried the US embassy but were only told to come in and visit to discuss it without being asked any details. As it's at the other end, it would mean a couple of hundred quid to travel there when it is hopefully not necessary.
FF, please PM me and I may be able to assist. Regards, H_M.
 
#11
If you were in doubt about moral turpitude, I'd guess the fella has been arrested and probably convicted. I'd not chance it. Time to bite the bullet and get the visa!

I suppose it just goes to show that what we do sometimes comes back to bite us in the most unexpected ways.
 

Fang_Farrier

LE
Kit Reviewer
Book Reviewer
#12
The Yanks have no sense of humour when it comes to immigration issues - I would be inclined to have a chat at the embassy rather than hope it will be alright on the night. Houston tends to be more relaxed because of the oil and gas business so a Nigerian visa is not an automatic rubber glove, everywhere else you get gripped in my experience and US passport control is not being assessed for it's willingness to play fast and loose with the regulations - anomalies will be turned back - at best. Pay your £200, accept it's because you're Scottish and remember that, unlike the Yanks, the English will let you into Carlisle with no questions asked...

Not my £200, so no real skin off my nose, just trying to make sure we don't have a ruined holiday. Bonus is that Miss Fang might realise the boy's been a twat and that there's no such thing as a conviction without consequences, even if it was for something trivial. And of course "he didn't really do it", his lawyer was an idiot who just told him to plead guilty as it was his word against several others.
 
#13
Not my £200, so no real skin off my nose, just trying to make sure we don't have a ruined holiday. Bonus is that Miss Fang might realise the boy's been a twat and that there's no such thing as a conviction without consequences, even if it was for something trivial. And of course "he didn't really do it", his lawyer was an idiot who just told him to plead guilty as it was his word against several others.
It was for exactly the "not wanting a ruined holiday" that my brother got the visa. Simply not worth the risk.
 

FORMER_FYRDMAN

LE
Book Reviewer
#14
Not my £200, so no real skin off my nose, just trying to make sure we don't have a ruined holiday. Bonus is that Miss Fang might realise the boy's been a twat and that there's no such thing as a conviction without consequences, even if it was for something trivial. And of course "he didn't really do it", his lawyer was an idiot who just told him to plead guilty as it was his word against several others.
I see where you're coming from and, in that case, I'd make as much of a song and dance about it as I could (I'd also take the family on holiday to Carlisle and make it clear why!). On a serious note, if it's going to cost money or cause grief if things go wrong, check it out with the embassy, don't chance it.
 
#15
I'd just tell the US to stick their country and the income. Stopped going stateside for business per 9/11 due to the buggeration factors generally. Shame as some nice folks there but if the welcome mat will treat you lie shit. . .


Doing it with a finger or two,eyes scrunched a bit near the screen, trying to make sure I don't make a mess or mistake in the process.
 
#17
My $0.02*:

A Brit friend of mine came over for a labor day weekend last year. He didn't have any issues with ESTA. He allegedly has a DUI conviction here in the U.K., from when he has 20 (he is 29 now). He allegedly just answered "No" in the prior arrests box. According to him, and a few conversations I had with a few others who were in a similar position (not same offense), the U.S. does not have automatic access to relatively minor crimes and misdemeanors in the U.K. Just the stuff which gets on criminal databases for international circulation.

However, if you ever plan on living/ working in the U.S., you're pretty much fucked. Because from what I know, they will ask for police certificates from countries you've previously resided in, will also look at all your prior entries into the U.S. And that's where your previous lie gets caught.

So yeah, just tourism and no further working future in the U.S. = You might get away with the lie

All in all, might be better to just to get a visa.



* - Highly suspect opinion. Also, who the **** know what they share and don't share. Things keep changing all the time.
 
#18
Hate to piss on your chips, but I guess it must be country-by-country. I did not have to produce certificates from the UK when I went through that system. However, I assume they check, because a guy I know who did the same had to go through the wringer because of a prior arrest for something very bad (although he wasn't convicted).
You could be right. This all hearsay from people who moved over.
 

Fang_Farrier

LE
Kit Reviewer
Book Reviewer
#19
Is it not possible to apply for the ESTA, and if ineligible, then you HAVE to get the B2. If on the other hand, the ESTA is granted, then it's a non-issue. I don't have experience of this, ESTA came in after I went through the visa system.
Have no idea how much data is exchanged. Would suspect that a minor fine issued in a small Sheriff's court would probably go un-noticed but in this instance I ain't the one making the choice, am just collecting information so that daughter's boyfriend can make choice (or more likely she'll make choice for him!).
However am aware that the offence, whilst minor may be classed as moral turpitude due to the nature of it, even if no damage done.
 
#20
If you want to be on the safe side he would be best to get a visa but then he is cooked because he will be on their database as such in the future.For ever

US is on my no fly zone after two visits of being held in the tank and subjected to all sorts of stupid shit.One of those I was in transit from Mexico on my way home and didnt leave the airport nor have access to my bags.

The ridiculous thing is that their security is totally crap and run by some inept and ignorant people who have piss poor attitude.

That Miami is my regional hub airport gives you some idea of how f'd off they made me feel.Then again I am knocking on presumably he has a long life ahead.
 

Similar threads

Latest Threads

Top