Erosion of liberties

[old_fat_and_hairy]

We constantly observe signs that our basic civil liberties are being eroded, from smoking to driving. From what we may say to what we may think.
Not much is free from regulation or legislation, and it has permeated into military life in an enormous way.
Changes have been wrought in the infrastructure, even to the extent that the N.A.A.F.I at my place of work has changed from a traditional one to a 'Costa Coffee' bistro!
Equally sinister is the surveillance we are under, whether it be visual or audial. Print is not free, nor is the ether. Even Speaker's Corner in Hyde Park is minitored by the thought police. We are noe being told what subjects we may discuss, and how we may talk about them.

My question is; Are we over regulated? And does anyone care.

 

[boris7]

We constantly observe signs that our basic civil liberties are being eroded, from smoking to driving. From what we may say to what we may think.
Not much is free from regulation or legislation, and it has permeated into military life in an enormous way.
Changes have been wrought in the infrastructure, even to the extent that the N.A.A.F.I at my place of work has changed from a traditional one to a 'Costa Coffee' bistro!
Equally sinister is the surveillance we are under, whether it be visual or audial. Print is not free, nor is the ether. Even Speaker's Corner in Hyde Park is minitored by the thought police. We are noe being told what subjects we may discuss, and how we may talk about them.

My question is; Are we over regulated? And does anyone care.

times have changed!!!!

 

[suits_U]

welcome to communism.

Blairs legacy.........

 

[schweik]

The Grauniad (of all organs!!) had an article in its G2 section yesterday about how we are now bossed about to a ridiculous degree in almost every aspect of our lives. It cited numerous examples including a local authority's monthly "newspaper" which the residents' council tax money pays for and which appears to have the sole function of telling us what we should or should not be doing, despite the fact that most people are perfectly well aware of the advice without the assistance of the local authority ("don't eat too much salt" etc etc)

Then there's the edict that as of 1st July, the church has to put up A5 sized "no smoking" signs outside all of its churches - I mean who the fcuk smokes in church anyway?

The fact that you can't sit on a train/underground train for 2 minutes without some total knob-end telling you what to do with your luggage, not to leave it behind when you get off the train, mind the gap etc etc.

And now we are even to get camera equipped talking lampposts to harangue members of the general public: "don't drop that fag end" "did you know smoking kills?" "don't wear a red top with green trousers" ...

Fcuking hell it drives me mad!

 

[762baynet]

There was a piece on Sky news yesterday ref the new code of practice for the drinks industry. As I recall (and I may be wrong as I was watching my young girlfriend getting dressed for the office) the journo could not get all the info on the story as the minutes for the meetings (twixt the Govt and the drinks ind) were blocked by the freedom of information act!!!!

 

[Marc_St_Hilaire]

This is just the start. Number plate recognition cameras, face recognition cameras, black boxes in your cars for "road tolling": spy systems on every street corner. All linked up by the internet to one super computer. George Orwell's (Eric Blair) 1984 is a lot nearer than most people think. What can we do about it? Not much, I fear it is too late. The final push that was needed to get this through was 9/11 etc. and the anti terrorism histeria whipped up by the Government. Does anyone care? Too few and too late. Most people seem to be saying, "I dont mind being watched. I've got nothing to hide". Too bloody trusting. WAKE UP!!

 

[old_fat_and_hairy]

We are being regulated and moderated to such a degree that very soon there will be published a list of subjects deemed appropriate to talk about, but only if hte conversation is approved and to the standards imposed by the censor.
The same will apply in our work and leisure activities. Already there are 'recommended units' on just about everything we eat or drink. Councils employ '5 a day' co-ordinators. How does that work? Does this person visit and ensure that everyone in their area is eating the approved amount of fruit and veg per day?
What does a 'smoking cessation co-ordiantor' do? Arrange and approve of how you give it up?

We are already lectured and harangued by 'spokespersons' from every walk of life. Bernard Manning died a day ago, and although his humour was not my humour, there were ques of 'spokespersons' lining up to condemn his work.

 

[smartascarrots]

Times haven't changed much. I remember as a sprog going to work happy as Larry, when a large man blocked my path shouting at me to get a haircut and take my hands out my pockets.

Communism gone mad, if you ask me!...

PS I hope you filled in HMGF 1019 (Permission to be Mildly Scathing at the Expense of HMG) the requisite three weeks in advance of posting this?

 

[EX_REME]

Well here we are again.

I do wish people would not 'lump' all the bad things in with some of the good things.

Yes, there are loads of stupid laws and "they" are trying to put too many "laws" onto us.
But (i know), saying "And now we are even to get camera equipped talking lampposts to harangue members of the general public: "don't drop that fag end" "did you know smoking kills?" "don't wear a red top with green trousers" " does not help. I am sure that the people on the other side of the cameras are there to try and stop people breaking the law not looking at a fashion show.

Maybe if there were a few more cameras on the streets in Portugal, for example, there may have been a different outcome eh?

 

[old_fat_and_hairy]

I don't think most right minded people object to a level of surveillance, but we are the most watched and monitored country in the world. 1 camera to every 14 people, and an average is that we are caught on camera 300 times per day.
But that is not the worst. Do you believe you are an adult. and able to make rational decisions about your life and lifestyle? Wrong! Not your decision to make.

One quote; when there was an outcry for the restoration of the death penalty, and the subsequent suggestions that a public vote should be held to determine whether or not it should be restored, the Prime Minister ( yes, him.) said " it's too important a decision to let the public have a say'.

Presumably, a General Election is not that important.

 

[bobath]

BUt according to who you listen to it hasn't even worked. Apperantly violent crime and drunk related crime has gone up, despite us being the most recorded nation on Earth at the moment.

We are caught on camera about 300 times a day on average. This should be safest place in the world. Maybe more money and thought should be put in to getting coppers back on the streets.

 

[old_fat_and_hairy]

Incidentally, whilst on subject of laws; this goverment has passed an average of 3,368 new laws per year!

Now my maths is pretty crap, but that rounds out to about 35,000 so far. Much benefit felt from them?

 

[jagman]

Orwell saw it coming and wasn't far wrong.
What really get me is that very few people seem to care. Even the basic rights outlined in the Magna Catra have been overturned in recent years.
Government plans (legislative and regulatory reform act) read very much like Adolf Hitler's Enabling Act of 1933 and nobody notices.
Our every move is monitored and basic legislation is in place to regulate everything we do, if you argue that these laws are un-needed and wrong then you are accused of having something to hide.
A few more years of it and we shall become a nation shackled to a whole raft of legislation we don't want (European Constitution anyone?) and those of us who can be bothered to care will not have any options to overturn any of it.
We already on the verge of aquiring a PM that nobody has voted into office, an incredible abuse of so called democracy but sod all I can do to stop it.
We hear it blamed on a world that has changed since 9/11, so how come non of these measure were necessary for 30 years of the Northern Ireland problem, two World Wars or 40 years of cols war?

 

[jagman]

Just for clarification

http://www.cabinetoffice.gov.uk/regulation/reform/bill/

Democracy in Britain is dead, this act gives Ministers the power to change UK Law without recourse to Parliament (or the people for that matter)

 

[EX_REME]

BUt according to who you listen to it hasn't even worked. Apperantly violent crime and drunk related crime has gone up, despite us being the most recorded nation on Earth at the moment.

We are caught on camera about 300 times a day on average. This should be safest place in the world. Maybe more money and thought should be put in to getting coppers back on the streets.

Its not the cameras that havent worked. The punishments have been less and less, the crim now has the odds in his favour.

I have sometimes watched them programs, cops on the streets or whatever they are called, and the abuse that is given to the police with no recriminations is somewhat to blame for the attitude of today. Even when they are taken in they are usually let off with some caution. Total bollox.

 

[EX_REME]

Orwell saw it coming and wasn't far wrong.
What really get me is that very few people seem to care. Even the basic rights outlined in the Magna Catra have been overturned in recent years.
Government plans (legislative and regulatory reform act) read very much like Adolf Hitler's Enabling Act of 1933 and nobody notices.
Our every move is monitored and basic legislation is in place to regulate everything we do, if you argue that these laws are un-needed and wrong then you are accused of having something to hide.
A few more years of it and we shall become a nation shackled to a whole raft of legislation we don't want (European Constitution anyone?) and those of us who can be bothered to care will not have any options to overturn any of it.
We already on the verge of aquiring a PM that nobody has voted into office, an incredible abuse of so called democracy but sod all I can do to stop it.
We hear it blamed on a world that has changed since 9/11, so how come non of these measure were necessary for 30 years of the Northern Ireland problem, two World Wars or 40 years of cols war?

ARGHHH, stop it ffs. DO NOT LUMP IN THE CAMERA ISSUE WITH ALL THE OTHER SHITE.

 

[Bambi]

I've said it before on other threads, and it bears repeating so no apologies. If you haven't read 1984 yet, do so and prepare to weep. The comparisons between Orwell's imagined society and modern Britain are frightening.

The law should exist to keep us safe, not to tell us how to live our own individual lives. Yes, we are over-regulated. And if we don't care, God help us.

 

[762baynet]

EX REME, Fair enough but lets bear in mind one good point about surveillance, it prevents nothing. We have all seen CCTV footage of the london bombers but it failed to prevent the attack. Helps the investigation but sod all use to those who were maimed or killed.
ID cards helped track down the guilty parties of the Madrid bombing because they were presented in the purchase of mobile phones- sod all use to those that died.
Anything that is put in place eg cctv, id cards etc, is just an obstacle. Modern terrorists will always work around them leaving the rest of us to pick up the bill and suffer inconwenience.

 

[EX_REME]

EX REME, Fair enough but lets bear in mind one good point about surveillance, it prevents nothing. We have all seen CCTV footage of the london bombers but it failed to prevent the attack. Helps the investigation but sod all use to those who were maimed or killed.
ID cards helped track down the guilty parties of the Madrid bombing because they were presented in the purchase of mobile phones- sod all use to those that died.
Anything that is put in place eg cctv, id cards etc, is just an obstacle. Modern terrorists will always work around them leaving the rest of us to pick up the bill and suffer inconwenience.

What it does do is what you said "Helps the investigation". If this is helped the perpatrators are banged up (hopefully) so saves the lives of future victims......Now what were you saying?

 

[jagman]

You cant "bang up" suicide bombers EX REME.
And the camera issue is closely tied up with all the other issue's of the removal of civil rights.
Setting camera's aside (if you want it that way) then how do we address the Legislative and Regulatory Reform Act? already in place barely noticed by the nation at large and give Ministers the right to change any law as they see fit without Parliament or the publics consent. More or less how Hitler made himself dictator and set Europe alight