English to pay higher Scots tuition fees

#1
This is not a "jock bashing exercise" it's about policies and principles but where the f*ck does the Scotish Parliment get off??????????? We're paying HIGHER fees to subsidise their education system.

BBC News - English, Welsh and N Irish 'face Scots degree fee rise'

According to the media to make things even worse the rest of Europe will also be able to study free of charge it's just the English, N/Irish and the Welsh who will have to subsidise them (Wales has offered to pay for their students). Sorry but it's just f*cking insulting!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

We're here taking a world of shite with riots in London while the Scotish parliment yet again goes in complete contradiction to policies South of the border (the nurses pay row being another example).

If they want to do their own thing fine lets crack on and do it properly. Lets off load the burden and go for independanceand then they can make these decisions without my taxes paying for them.
 
#3
Under the current agreement, right or wrong, it is up the the Scottish Parliament how they decide how they spend the money that has been allocated to it. They have decided that education, for Scots, that at the point of entry, with access to it based on the ability to learn, not the ability to pay.

Currently other UK students are paying around circa £1900 when they study in Scottish universities opposed to £3.9k in England.

Under the new proposals, this would rise to around £6k for other UK students and Scottish students pay a graduate tax. This would ensure that other UK students don't block the Scottish universities for home based students.

As for the Scottish parliament going in the opposite direction from Westminster, erm hello how amny Tories are there in Scotland and so there are two different parties in charge in the two places, I belive they call it Democratic Government.

To your final point, under the new proposals from the UK government, currently going through Parliament, it will do away with the Barnett formula.
 
#4
Quite right, London can do what they like with regards to their students. Scotland shouldn’t have to deal with hoards of free loaders seeking the cheap option and in doing so devalue the worth of Scottish uni’s. I am afraid Westminster has forced that hand on this one.
 
#5
I agree on this point that it is up to Scotland how they spend their money on Scottish people. So charging English people (in effect foreigners!) more to attend Scottish unis is fair.

I do however believe it is about time the economic & political relationships between England & Scotland/Westminster & Scotland were re-evaluated, specifically the Barnett Formula & West Lothian Question.
 
#6
I agree on this point that it is up to Scotland how they spend their money on Scottish people. So charging English people (in effect foreigners!) more to attend Scottish unis is fair.

I do however believe it is about time the economic & political relationships between England & Scotland/Westminster & Scotland were re-evaluated, specifically the Barnett Formula & West Lothian Question.
Any other UK student in England still has to pay, or in the case of the Welsh their Assembly, the same as an English student. So the English students in Scotland are saving money coming here for their university course by only having to pay circa £1.9k compared to £3.9k in England.

As for the Barnett Formula, the Prime Minister and his deputy have agreed to give ministers in Edinburgh responsibility for raising more of their own spending money, including setting and collecting income tax.

But Scotland’s public spending levels face dramatic reductions, with both the Tories and Liberal Democrats committed to scrapping the Barnett formula and replacing it with a system that distributes taxpayers’ money based on need.

A separate body will be set up discuss the West Lothian Question, whether it is right for Scottish MPs to vote on issues, such as health and education, that are devolved to Holyrood.

Meanwhile, Mr Cameron stressed his “commitment to devolution” in a telephone call to Alex Salmond, ahead of his visit to Scotland in the coming week.

A promise to implement the recommendations of the Calman Commission(See below), which reviewed the devolution settlement, was included in the Government’s coalition deal.

Commission recommendations include:

1. Cutting basic and higher rates of income tax levied by the Government in Scotland by 10p in the pound, with a corresponding reduction in the block grant, calculated using the Barnett formula.

2. Giving Holyrood the power to set a Scottish income tax rate, applying to all bands. A 10p rate would replace the reduction in the block grant.

3. Devolving Stamp Duty Land Tax, Landfill Tax, Air Passenger Duty and the Aggregates Levy paid on mineral extraction to the Scottish Parliament.

4. Giving Scottish ministers additional borrowing powers to cover the cost of capital projects, or temporary shortfalls in their budget.

5. Devolving powers for the administration of Scottish elections.

6. Devolving the regulation of airguns. The Scottish justice minister has said he will use this to ban the weapons.

7. Devolving power to set drink-drive limits. SNP ministers want the limit cut from 80mg per 100ml of blood to 50mg, the equivalent of consuming half a pint of beer or a small glass of wine.
8. Devolving the power to set speed limits.
9. Devolving responsibility for nature conservation at sea.
10. Improving relations between Holyrood and Westminster by creating mechanisms for regular meetings and discussions between ministers, MPs and MSPs.
 
#7
Johnboyzzz, an interesting post. I didn't realise just how much further the next stages of devolution could go. Presumably there would be similar plans for NI & Wales?

Which begs the question about English devolution.....
 
B

Biscuits_AB

Guest
#8
This is not a "jock bashing exercise" it's about policies and principles but where the f*ck does the Scotish Parliment get off??????????? We're paying HIGHER fees to subsidise their education system.

BBC News - English, Welsh and N Irish 'face Scots degree fee rise'

According to the media to make things even worse the rest of Europe will also be able to study free of charge it's just the English, N/Irish and the Welsh who will have to subsidise them (Wales has offered to pay for their students). Sorry but it's just f*cking insulting!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

We're here taking a world of shite with riots in London while the Scotish parliment yet again goes in complete contradiction to policies South of the border (the nurses pay row being another example).

If they want to do their own thing fine lets crack on and do it properly. Lets off load the burden and go for independanceand then they can make these decisions without my taxes paying for them.
Ahahahahahahahhahhahahahahhahahahahhahahahahhahahahahaha! Dry your eyes Princess.
 
#9
Johnboyzzz, an interesting post. I didn't realise just how much further the next stages of devolution could go. Presumably there would be similar plans for NI & Wales?

Which begs the question about English devolution.....
I would persume so, but not too clued up on the Welsh and Irish bits.

I agree the English should have their own form of devolution and the four countries coming together for national (UK) matters.
 
#10
I agree on this point that it is up to Scotland how they spend their money on Scottish people. So charging English people (in effect foreigners!) more to attend Scottish unis is fair.

I do however believe it is about time the economic & political relationships between England & Scotland/Westminster & Scotland were re-evaluated, specifically the Barnett Formula & West Lothian Question.
Fcuking What??? Have they already declared UDI .... or are we actually still all BRITISH? Statements like yours in bold above are a testament to the general thickness of the people of this country.

There is no fecking nationality called Scottish/Scots or whatever (not yet anyway!!!) .... they are British as part of the (semi) United Kingdom and so no other British national, whether English, Welsh or Norn Irish is a sodding foreigner. Please, please, please DROP THE SODDING P bloody C and diversity bollox!!!!


Rant over and breeeeaaaaattttthhhhe
 
#11
FrankIG, I am not generally thick.

the United Kingdom is a sovereign state that comprises of 4 nations. Hence why people, places, things (and indeed parliaments) can be described as Welsh, Scottish, Northern Irish & English. It is why for the Commonwealth Game each home nation puts in it's own teams. So actually, as Scotland is a nation, there is a nationality called Scottish.

But I digress, that wasn't my point. Due to devolution, Scotland and the Scottish Parliament have certain powers giving them jurisdiction over the Scottish people only on certain affairs. Education, and universities, are just one of these. So, given that the Scottish Parliament can only legislate the Scottish people & Scottish universities, and that the OED defines the word foreign as "of, from, in, or characteristic of a country other than one's own" it would be fair to describe anyone looking to come to a Scottish university from outside of Scotland as foreign.
 
#12
Universities are free throughout the EU then are they?
or why do only other british (excluding scots) people have to pay? just before i saw an SNP chap on the BBC say "english students wouldn't have to pay if we were independant".

now we're getting to the bottom of it eh.
 

Sixty

ADC
Moderator
Book Reviewer
#13
Universities are free throughout the EU then are they?
Jesus, here we go again. For the hard of thinking and with thanks to smartascarrots:

The Student Awards Agency Scotland will fund any student from an EU member state where they are able to reclaim the costs from the home nation. Because of the damned parochial English funding system which does not allow your students to apply for funding anywhere except their own home Local Education Authority, SAAS is not able to claim back from a student who's ordinarily resident in an English LEA area.
 
#14
FrankIG, I am not generally thick.

the United Kingdom is a sovereign state that comprises of 4 nations. Hence why people, places, things (and indeed parliaments) can be described as Welsh, Scottish, Northern Irish & English. It is why for the Commonwealth Game each home nation puts in it's own teams. So actually, as Scotland is a nation, there is a nationality called Scottish.

Sorry the UK comprises countries NOT nations. There is a race called Scottish or Scots... there is no Scottish nationality as accepted in international law. Not actually trying to nitpick as I'm Irish (from the South), but my father was British (born in 1910), and I'm also British being born in England despite my 'ethnic' (I hate that word actually) background being Irish

But I digress, that wasn't my point. Due to devolution, Scotland and the Scottish Parliament have certain powers giving them jurisdiction over the Scottish people only on certain affairs. Education, and universities, are just one of these. So, given that the Scottish Parliament can only legislate the Scottish people & Scottish universities, and that the OED defines the word foreign as "of, from, in, or characteristic of a country other than one's own" it would be fair to describe anyone looking to come to a Scottish university from outside of Scotland as foreign.
Which also shows the total cock up that so called devolution is. It was a ploy to pass on the responsibility from Westminster to Edinburgh/Cardiff et al when things went tits up. Devolution was, and remains, a con perpetrated by politicians on the peoples of ALL the constituent parts of the United Kingdom

PS My apologies, I wasn't actually intimating that you were thick. However I hear so many supposedly intelligent and educated people who refer to England, Scotland, Ireland and Wales as though they were totally separate nations I occasionally see red over it.
 
#15
Jesus, here we go again. For the hard of thinking and with thanks to smartascarrots:
fairplay sixty.

so how much do EU students have to pay?
this was all completely ignored by the news.
 
#16
fairplay sixty.

so how much do EU students have to pay?
this was all completely ignored by the news.
Heriot Watt Uni:

International students i.e. non-EU students, are asked to complete a detailed form which enables us to assess the fees payable by them. The fees payable by international students i.e. their 'fee status' are higher than those payable by a UK or EU national.

For example


ScreenShot.JPG

Compared to an English Uni plucked at random, including what Scots pay ;-P


ScreenShot.JPG


Uni of West Weedgie land somehwere

Fees - Non EU Countries
The University tuition fees for entry in January 2011 are £9,300 for an arts-based course and £10,050 for a science-based course.
For entry in September 2011 or January 2012, the tuition fees are £10,000 for an art-based course and £10,500 for a science-based course.
 
#18
This all the fault of that **** Blair. He created this mess just to ensure that people voted for his disgusting party in Scotland and Wales. Remember how those shits in his party were telling us that devolution for the Scots and Welsh was good for the UK, yet somehow a devolved government for England would be devisive.

This is typical of those Labour cnuts. Bugger about with stuff, never giving a toss about what might lead to.

Anyone who ever voted Labour at any timein their lives should be ashamed.
 
#20
FrankIG, I think we can both agree that devolution was a cock up, as well as been vastly unfair on England.
Christ I'll definitely drink to that one with you!! However I believe that it was unfair (if that's the word you want to use) to every part of the UK as it was a simple and total vote chasing con!! Badly conceived, not thought through at all and horrendously poorly operated!
 

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