Energy Smart meters to be fitted in every home

Gout Man

LE
Book Reviewer
Having followed the above I would rather like to avoid getting a smart meter (I rejected the offer by my supplier EON to have one installed a while ago). However now I have been moved from an initial low rate dual fuel tariff to a variable rate tariff, at an almost 50% jump in cost. Obviously they can poke that so I am looking for a new supplier. Does anyone know of a supplier who do not specify a smart meter as part of the package?

Thanks
See my post above. Post 901. Visit U Switch.
 

Blogg

LE
Robin Hood Energy. (A not for profit energy company owned and operated by Nottingham City Council)

Not sure they are the cheapest but they're certainly not the most expensive. To date (about six months) no smart meter has been offered or even mentioned and it is the first energy company I have not thought to be a bunch of cnuts from month two onwards. I am on a fixed tariff with no exit fees should I change my mind about them.

Robin Hood Energy
Owned and operated by a Labour run council. What could possibly go wrong?


As in charged consumers but somehow not paid on. Now why would they do that....

 
Last edited:

moderator

Old-Salt
Owned and operated by a Labour run council. What could possibly go wrong?
Interesting... not something I was aware of but certainly one to watch now.

What could possibly go wrong? For me as a consumer, the worst is an enforced switch to an Ofgem appointed 'big six' which is an inconvenience but not the end of the world. (Ofgem, as far as I know, guarantees any account credit balances and the insolvency practitioners will collect any debit balance so little concern there- clear monthly billing leaves little room for doubt as to who owes who what).

I prefer the smaller suppliers over any of the majors but I suppose that alongside that preference sits the increased risk of supplier insolvency.
 
Not in mine they can fcuk right off.
To many errors & screw ups.
If you get one through company A & change to company B they do not recognize it as they did not install it.
To many complaints to BBC Watchdog & Martin Lewis Site.
 
Do they turn up to read your meter every quarter?
My lecky bill paid by fob is so low, they keep sending "Meter Readers" round to check the meter, check if we are suitable for a smart meter etc. They think I am defrauding them, I am just out at work all day, have an A rated fridge, a double A rated washing machine, telly, lights, radio, shower, halogen oven and air fryer, laptop, vacuum cleaner and a Dyson hot and cold to boost when it's cold. Rarely use the heating and never use the immersion heater.
 
OK I know I'm the obvious weirdo here as I have wanted smart meters for years, I just like the technology involved. When I enquired a few years ago one of the questions was "Are the meters (Gas and electric) more than 25 feet apart?" The answer is yes as the electric meter is in the kitchen and the gas meter is at the other end of the house, outside the lounge. That was that until my supplier started installing SMETS 2 and I asked them the question, "no problem" was the response so after a couple of failed attempts finally got an appointment (the installer came from Essex, they stay in hotels/B&Bs for a weeks worth of appointments). He came on Thursday, nice guy, happy to chat etc. Fitted both but slight problem, can you guess what it is yet kids? Yup the gas meter cannot communicate with the electric one (there are at least 6 brick walls in between, no plasterboard) and the electric one is the master. I got my smart meters but only 1 operates smartly, for the gas I will have to go outside and read it just like before. At least I got half of what I was hoping for :)
 

Rab_C

War Hero
Having followed the above I would rather like to avoid getting a smart meter (I rejected the offer by my supplier EON to have one installed a while ago). However now I have been moved from an initial low rate dual fuel tariff to a variable rate tariff, at an almost 50% jump in cost. Obviously they can poke that so I am looking for a new supplier. Does anyone know of a supplier who do not specify a smart meter as part of the package?

Thanks
I am also with EON, every year my contract will revert to the higher tariff unless I choose a cheaper one. I find the cheaper one by either calling them or using a price comparison site. EON called me once about getting a smart meter and I declined, that was over 2 years ago and I have heard nothing since. Isn’t it standard practice to move people to the default higher tariff when there present one runs out?
 
................... EON called me once about getting a smart meter and I declined, that was over 2 years ago and I have heard nothing since.............
Earlier on this year, the bastards were hounding me every couple of days by phone and e-mail to have a Smart meter installed even though I repeatedly told them I didn't want one. They stated that it was mandated by OFGEM that anyone refusing a Smart meter had to give valid reasons for their refusal.

I contacted OFGEM to asking them to confirm what Eon were claiming and their reply amounted to "complete load of bollocks". OFGEM asked for details of Eon's claims so I sent them copies of the e-mails. Haven't heard a thing from Eon since.

I suspect some little 2@t in Eon was trying to boost his bonus by getting folks to sign up to a Smart meter. Hopefully he's now out of a job.
 
Earlier on this year, the bastards were hounding me every couple of days by phone and e-mail to have a Smart meter installed even though I repeatedly told them I didn't want one. They stated that it was mandated by OFGEM that anyone refusing a Smart meter had to give valid reasons for their refusal.

I contacted OFGEM to asking them to confirm what Eon were claiming and their reply amounted to "complete load of bollocks". OFGEM asked for details of Eon's claims so I sent them copies of the e-mails. Haven't heard a thing from Eon since.

I suspect some little 2@t in Eon was trying to boost his bonus by getting folks to sign up to a Smart meter. Hopefully he's now out of a job.
He may be the one who told me that it was the law to have one fitted, in which case I agree with you. I hope he lost his job, the lying t**d.
 

Rab_C

War Hero
Earlier on this year, the bastards were hounding me every couple of days by phone and e-mail to have a Smart meter installed even though I repeatedly told them I didn't want one. They stated that it was mandated by OFGEM that anyone refusing a Smart meter had to give valid reasons for their refusal.

I contacted OFGEM to asking them to confirm what Eon were claiming and their reply amounted to "complete load of bollocks". OFGEM asked for details of Eon's claims so I sent them copies of the e-mails. Haven't heard a thing from Eon since.

I suspect some little 2@t in Eon was trying to boost his bonus by getting folks to sign up to a Smart meter. Hopefully he's now out of a job.
The guy I spoke to asked if I wanted to go on the not now list or never list, I replied never and that seems to have kept them away (to date)
 
The guy I spoke to asked if I wanted to go on the not now list or never list, I replied never and that seems to have kept them away (to date)
These are a couple of quotes from the e-mails Eon sent me.

We can opt you out for three to six months but we need a reason from you as to why you are against Smart meters. this is something that Ofgem have put in place before we can now opt you out.
I can see in your email you have mentioned you previously advised us you wouldn't like a Smart meter installed and I can see you opted you out of Smart back in October 2018. However as the Smart installation is a government initiative, we are only able to opt you out of Smart promotions temporarily.
This is part of OFGEM's reply to my enquiry to confirm Eon's claims.

......consumers have a right to refuse to have smart meters installed. It is not an Ofgem requirement that consumers should provide a reason for not wanting to have a smart meter installed.
I do wonder if it was one Eon office (Nottingham??) playing fast and loose in the drive to meet "targets".
 

moderator

Old-Salt
Owned and operated by a Labour run council. What could possibly go wrong?


As in charged consumers but somehow not paid on. Now why would they do that....

Update:

I have written to Robin Hood Energy (RHE) asking what the likelihood of it losing It's supply licence is as a result of its £9.5m overdue payment issue.

The answer is as expected: (quoted verbatim)
"I can happily confirm that the licence will not be revoked and that we, like many providers will be paying the balance in full by March 2020. I can assure you that there is nothing to worry about and the simplest way to look at the issue, is that we are making pro active steps to pay a bill by its first reminder and not on the actual bill generation date. Whilst we have the funds to pay now, it would leave us more vulnerable over the winter period and with brexit looming it is prudent to spread the payment into instalments and wait until the deadline day to make the final payment. This is something that is common practice with a lot of suppliers and it is not intended to wary or scare our faithful customers."​

On the basis of Ofgem protecting and carrying forward any consumer account credit values to a Supplier of Last Resort and me knowing at any given moment the precise credit / debit status of my account, I have decided to sit tight for now.

Hopefully they will weather this - the Which customer satisfaction survey has RHE in second place (78%) behind Octopus (80%).
 
Update:

I have written to Robin Hood Energy (RHE) asking what the likelihood of it losing It's supply licence is as a result of its £9.5m overdue payment issue.

The answer is as expected: (quoted verbatim)
"I can happily confirm that the licence will not be revoked and that we, like many providers will be paying the balance in full by March 2020. I can assure you that there is nothing to worry about and the simplest way to look at the issue, is that we are making pro active steps to pay a bill by its first reminder and not on the actual bill generation date. Whilst we have the funds to pay now, it would leave us more vulnerable over the winter period and with brexit looming it is prudent to spread the payment into instalments and wait until the deadline day to make the final payment. This is something that is common practice with a lot of suppliers and it is not intended to wary or scare our faithful customers."​

On the basis of Ofgem protecting and carrying forward any consumer account credit values to a Supplier of Last Resort and me knowing at any given moment the precise credit / debit status of my account, I have decided to sit tight for now.

Hopefully they will weather this - the Which customer satisfaction survey has RHE in second place (78%) behind Octopus (80%).
Interesting, the company has a policy of not paying invoices when due but at first reminder, and then in increments until deadline day. Wonder if they would accept the same payment practice from their customers.
 
The guy I spoke to asked if I wanted to go on the not now list or never list, I replied never and that seems to have kept them away (to date)
Who are you with? No one has really bothered me and I change every year
 
Checking around I saw that the technology is now SMETS2 which means it should be transferable between suppliers so I had a play a little further with the "Can I get a smart meter" test on my supplier. Turns out no because I generate my own lecky off the roof and am in receipt of FIT payments and they've not worked out how to meter that yet.
I'll wait, quite happy to read the meters old style
 

Blogg

LE
Update:

I have written to Robin Hood Energy (RHE) asking what the likelihood of it losing It's supply licence is as a result of its £9.5m overdue payment issue.

The answer is as expected: (quoted verbatim)
"I can happily confirm that the licence will not be revoked and that we, like many providers will be paying the balance in full by March 2020. I can assure you that there is nothing to worry about and the simplest way to look at the issue, is that we are making pro active steps to pay a bill by its first reminder and not on the actual bill generation date. Whilst we have the funds to pay now, it would leave us more vulnerable over the winter period and with brexit looming it is prudent to spread the payment into instalments and wait until the deadline day to make the final payment. This is something that is common practice with a lot of suppliers and it is not intended to wary or scare our faithful customers."​

On the basis of Ofgem protecting and carrying forward any consumer account credit values to a Supplier of Last Resort and me knowing at any given moment the precise credit / debit status of my account, I have decided to sit tight for now.

Hopefully they will weather this - the Which customer satisfaction survey has RHE in second place (78%) behind Octopus (80%).
Customers won't lose electricity supply but that reply is weapons grade bullshit. Might have cash but that doesn't mean they are solvent.

What they are sweating on is Nottingham Council giving them a "Letter of Comfort" as major shareholder in relation to their liabilities and those of the various partnerships with other councils.

Since Nottingham Council have already sunk £40m into RHE, that is a really big ask. And a lot turns on that.

Auditors won't provide Going Concern sign off on Statutory Accounts of RHE until that appears so they have missed their Companies House filing deadline of 31 July.

Which means in turn that Nottingham Council can't finalise it's own accounts either.

Grant Thornton bod thus told the Council Audit Committee:

"The fact is since the draft accounts were produced by RHE which were used to draft your own accounts, those (RHE) figures have moved by a number of millions of pounds. And not in a favourable direction either"

Also stated that point was approaching when he would be forced to issue a "Public Interest Report" in relation to Nottingham Council. At which point the the Minister for Housing Communities and Local Government is obliged to "take an interest"

Apart from which it's a really, really bad idea to piss any Regulator off (especially one facing difficult questions about 4 other suppliers going down the crapper this year alone) and is already muttering about customers being misled by Greenwash: if a non generating supplier does not have specific contracts and buys in wholesale market and has no Renewable Energy Guarantee of Origin Certificates, it ain't "Green" electrons coming out the plug.

To then trumpet that your policy concerning payments is to delay until the last possible moment evaporates supplier confidence and dries up Trade Credit Insurance availability for suppliers.

Stupid is as stupid does.
 

moderator

Old-Salt
Checking around I saw that the technology is now SMETS2 which means it should be transferable between suppliers so I had a play a little further with the "Can I get a smart meter" test on my supplier. Turns out no because I generate my own lecky off the roof and am in receipt of FIT payments and they've not worked out how to meter that yet.
I'll wait, quite happy to read the meters old style
Problem here is not that they haven't worked out how to do it. It is to do with how the FiT scheme is set up...

More fore those that may not know how it works... Under FiT, regardless of how much of our self generated (solar) energy we use ourselves, we are paid a per KwH tariff of 100% of actual KwH generated and then, on top of that, a per KwH export tariff for a presumed 50% of all KwH generated - all based on the quarterly reading of the steam driven meter attached only to the solar panels. That meter only measures KwH generated, not KwH used or exported.

Had you been in the now closed FiT's successor scheme, Smart Export Guarantee (SEG) a smart meter capable of measuring flow both ways (half hourly too I believe) is a requirement of the scheme* as you only get paid for precisely the number of KwH you actually export onto the grid.

It is widely believed that SEG scheme members will never actually break even on their roof top investments so long may us FiT scheme members be encumbered by any steenkin smart meters. I have about 14 years of FiT scheme payments left to collect - they more than cover my annual electricity bill. :)

*Some SEG payers have said they will continue to pay an export tariff of a presumed 50% of KwH generated until SEG scheme members get their smart meters fitted.
 

moderator

Old-Salt
Customers won't lose electricity supply but that reply is weapons grade bullshit. Might have cash but that doesn't mean they are solvent.

What they are sweating on is Nottingham Council giving them a "Letter of Comfort" as major shareholder in relation to their liabilities and those of the various partnerships with other councils.

Since Nottingham Council have already sunk £40m into RHE, that is a really big ask. And a lot turns on that.

Auditors won't provide Going Concern sign off on Statutory Accounts of RHE until that appears so they have missed their Companies House filing deadline of 31 July.

Which means in turn that Nottingham Council can't finalise it's own accounts either.

Grant Thornton bod thus told the Council Audit Committee:

"The fact is since the draft accounts were produced by RHE which were used to draft your own accounts, those (RHE) figures have moved by a number of millions of pounds. And not in a favourable direction either"

Also stated that point was approaching when he would be forced to issue a "Public Interest Report" in relation to Nottingham Council. At which point the the Minister for Housing Communities and Local Government is obliged to "take an interest"


Apart from which it's a really, really bad idea to piss any Regulator off (especially one facing difficult questions about 4 other suppliers going down the crapper this year alone) and is already muttering about customers being misled by Greenwash: if a non generating supplier does not have specific contracts and buys in wholesale market and has no Renewable Energy Guarantee of Origin Certificates, it ain't "Green" electrons coming out the plug.

To then trumpet that your policy concerning payments is to delay until the last possible moment evaporates supplier confidence and dries up Trade Credit Insurance availability for suppliers.

Stupid is as stupid does.
Read all of that (italicised part) of course before writing to RHE - as I said, the reply was as expected and you are right to say that customers won't lose supply - either RHE will continue to supply or they won't. If the latter then Ofgem will appoint a Supplier of Last Resort (SoLR) to maintain continuity of supply with account credit balances protected.

Based on all of the factors I am privy to, I have decided to stay put for the time being - the worst that is going to happen is a little buggeration if RHE goes tits up. It's one of those 50/50 things - if I jump now and didn't need to / if I don't jump now but do need to... We will see but in the meantime, whichever way it goes, nobody is going to die of it.
 
I'm actually quite keen to get a smart meter up and running, so I can keep an eye on my usage. Now on my third appointment. Hope the bigger turns up this time.
 

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