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Elizabeth Cross

napier

LE
Moderator
Kit Reviewer
#4
If her son was married the wife gets the cross, if he's unmarried the mother/father gets it. Just like medals, there can only be one recipient. It's sad, but once her son was married, she was no longer his 'owner'.
 
E

EScotia

Guest
#5
One of the biggest issues with bereaved families, its raised at all of the SSAFA Bereaved Families Support Group (BFSG) general meetings, and there was 200+ at our last one. There's not even any dispensation to award a medal to serving parents who are not listed as NOK (in my case not serving for long as I'm about to be Med Discharged). In our case the medal went to the ex wife who had it presented to their son and we weren't even invited to the ceremony nor to the Arboretum when his name went up on that beautiful but very sad monument.

As bereaved parents ourselves we have written to the boss (HM the Q) and were told its got nowt to do with us lad, try the MoD. We then wrote to the AG and he basically told us that the MoD sponsor SSAFA BFSG, you can get a paper scroll and that's yer lot pal.

In a nutshell parents feel as though their loss is not worth anything as the system can only respond to NOK and no-one with any authority can be bothered to either look at the reasons behind their dissatisfaction or look for a compromise.

As far as I can see, the cost of a second medal for the parents that request one would be minimal, even negligible and there would be no reason to present it at anything other than by a local dignitary or snr offr.

And I am aware that larger family dynamics post bereavement can muddy the waters somewhat.
 
#8
If her son was married the wife gets the cross, if he's unmarried the mother/father gets it. Just like medals, there can only be one recipient. It's sad, but once her son was married, she was no longer his 'owner'.
I think it is fair that someone who's daughter or son has died in conflict should have some sort of way of being proud of that commitment and loss. what would you suggest as an alternative? there are some very proud and grieving mums and dads out there.

PoGs

PocketComms - Language First Aid at your Fingertips
 
C

cloudbuster

Guest
#9
What would you suggest? They gave a child; what piece of bling could possibly compensate for that?
 
#10
its like the last few posts have hinted at, where would you stop issuing?

some tenatious family link? one medal makes sense. other family members can easily purchase a replica.

There will never be a solution that solves everyones issues but at least everyone knows exactly where they stand here! as ive said who would critisise a family member for purchasing a replica
 
#11
its like the last few posts have hinted at, where would you stop issuing?

some tenatious family link? one medal makes sense. other family members can easily purchase a replica.

There will never be a solution that solves everyones issues but at least everyone knows exactly where they stand here! as ive said who would critisise a family member for purchasing a replica

I know this sounds a bit w*nky and all american and all that, but surely a public and official recognition from a grateful nation is preferable to someone going to ebay and buying a copy to commemorate their sons or daughters life. I think that this respectful Elizabeth Cross scheme should be extended to Mums and Dads.

PoGs

PocketComms - Language First Aid at your Fingertips
 
#12
then brothers and sisters will feel hard done by, then sons and daughters, then causins and aunts and uncles!

will step parents count that raised them all their lives?

it just gets so so messy and its already a terrible situation! like i said there willl never be a perfect clean cut solution
 
#13
I would!

As has been stated, one death one medal. NOK is clear. If married, it is the wife. If not, it is whoever he nominated as his NOK. In theory, my NOK could wear my full rack of medals on the right at appropriate occasions should I be deceased, that doesnt mean I should get 25 sets made up so that every body vaguely related to me can walt about at their leisure.

Sounds harsh, I know. But thats the way I see it.
 
#15
I think that this respectful Elizabeth Cross scheme should be extended to Mums and Dads.
I disagree.

Sorry if it sounds harsh, but the rules is the rules! At the award of every medal there is always a section of 'nearly rans' who fail to qualify and think they're being hard done by. I'm certain that this is not a matter of cost - it is a matter of value. One death = one medal. With the strange and complicated families many of our folk come from, Her Majesty would do nothing but sign scrolls - I have a soldier who has at least 6 'parents', do you suggest they all should get one, if, God forbid anything happens to him?
 
#17
Personally, I disagree with the whole thing. If I die, my NOK, as previously posted, gets to wear my full rack with pride. They dont need another medal, and if there is to be one, it should simply be added to the end of the row like a full stop on my military career. The last thing we need is another oportunity for walting of an extremely tasteless nature.
 
#18
Rules are rules.

Could be a problem if there is bad blood in the family!

This rule has always been the same so i fail to see what the big deal is with this particular gong.

Never hear about arguments about the service person's other gong's.
 
#19
Rules are rules.

Could be a problem if there is bad blood in the family!

This rule has always been the same so i fail to see what the big deal is with this particular gong.

Never hear about arguments about the service person's other gong's.
I'm sure there are always arguments over medals of a deceased service person. Complicated families will cause no end of issues but fortunately most will resolve there differences or come to an amicable agreement - I have more than 1 kid so when I buy the farm I am sure there will be instances (Remembrance Services for example) where my rack will be a family point of discussion as to who wears it. I won't care because I'll be dead!

The service person gets to choose there next of kin and needs to ensure that any wishes are left clearly written in a will. If families want to argue afterwards then it is up to them but as institution it is not up to the MoD to pander to the wishes of everyone.
 
#20
Personally, I think that there should be a death plaque instead of a medal as they did in WW1. That way, there is none of this wanting to wear a medal stuff. However as it is not the case, I personally believe that the NOK should receive the medal. I know that it is hard on the parents if the soldier is married, but the medal should go to the one who is closest to the person. That is not to say that they are not close to their parents, just saying they are closer to their spouse.....or their NOK which is why they chose that person.
 

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