Electronic targets

Discussion in 'Shooting, Hunting and Fishing' started by EX_STAB, Mar 22, 2010.

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  1. My club is considering getting electronic targets, possibly these by Kongsberg, supplied in the UK by these folks:

    http://www.etsys.co.uk/U6E.pdf (pdf)

    Anyone know how tight a group they can measure? Seems to be no data on the website unless I missed it.
     
  2. Have you considered ringing them on the phone number at the bottom?

    Or perhaps emailing them, at the email address at the bottom?

    Lazy cnut ;)
     
  3. msr

    msr LE

    Just email them direct.
     
  4. I have experience with the Sius system (http://www.sius.com/e_sport_uebersicht.aspx) and purely from experience I can say it's a very good system. I've heard that for 10 metre air rifle it's good for shot placement to better than 50 micron accuracy.
     
  5. An independent viewpoint would be useful at this juncture chaps ;)

    Thanks Comet. :)
     
  6. msr

    msr LE

    You asked for a technical specification, not an independent opinion.
     
  7. wot e said, innit
     
  8. I'm pretty sure that this is the manufacturer that Dorking & District RC used for their installation at Boar Hill (a 600 yard range).

    D&D's system gives group size reading in millimetres, and seems to be able to plot overlapping shots. Its sufficient for normal target shooting pedants at ranges 200-600+, but I'm not sure if it would be suitable for bench-rest types at 100 and under.

    I would warn that this type of targetry can turn into a major ongoing project for club staff: Dorking has been ironing out problems for about three years - in fact apparently providing much of the "in use" data for the manufacturer. Frequently, the system has gone tits-up over faults that have been a nightmare to track down - moisture in plug connections, damage to cable cores, bullet nick causing a short, etc.

    The targetry is also a semi-permanent installation, meaning that (a) it often need protection from the elements (Dorking have had to build a shed over the gallery frames); (b) it can make it difficult to use other types of target - or even see the fall of shot in the stop-butt.
     
  9. Electronic systems can measure very tight groups. As comet catcher says, Suis Ascor are very good - which is why they're the favoured supplier to ISSF sanctioned events (like the Olympics), and why pretty much all major events have gone over to electronic systems in favour of paper.

    There's quite a lot of "Megalink" units knocking around as well. Can't comment on Kongsberg as I have no experience with them. If they've got some half-decent engineers on the job, then there shouldn't be much wrong with them, there's enough different systems around that it's not just a black magic mastered by Suis and Suis alone! Try asking Don McIntosh at Edinkillie. He's the head coach for the GB squad, so knows his way around the various systems and the pros and cons of each.

    You'll notice he advertises Megalink units on his site. He doesn't sell them however, and AFAIK has no financial interest in Megalink so should be able to give you unbiased advice on the various systems. I assume he just lists them because he personally recommends them.


    From my experience, fixed installations are the way to go from a technical standpoint. Non-weather-proof, or semi-permanent units are a complete PITA to drag out every session (they're not light things. You'll be towing many types of system out one at a time on a trolley! Although I suppose that's not necesarily worse than dragging out frames for paper targets - it depends on what you're doing and how your range works).
    In this sense, the best way forward is a permanent installation. No faffing moving the targets all the time (which does them no good), you can get the units in place, properly waterproofed, seal all the electrical connectors, etc, etc.

    However, if you want the range for other disciplines and different targets that require the electronic units to be shifted out the way, then it all gets more complicated. How many electronics do you want? Is it practicable to dedicate a few lanes to a permanent electronics installation and leave the rest for multiple target types, etc, etc?

    Many factors to consider. Permanent is the way to go if that's what you want, with properly planned-out conduits and junction boxes that never fill with water or get submerged, well-sealed units and a cover befitting a permanent installation.
    Everything else will be a compromise, with the fact that the targets need to be moveable, but the connectors need to remain dry when unplugged, and the conduits musn't flood, whether the electronics are in use or not.
     
  10. About ten years ago, they used to reckon on >0.1mm accuracy for rubber-based systems (because smallbore rounds are subsonic, the microphone-based systems can't detect the "crack"; instead, they detect the sound of the bullet or pellet striking rubber (for smallbore) or paper (for airguns).

    Another problem is the consumables - you need an ongoing budget to replace the rubber strips; they can be expensive.

    There's a firm called Meyton who make a beam-break system. No consumables, rather nice to use. By way of example, there's a big club in Hanover who got rid of their SIUS-ASCOR and replaced it with the Meyton system; it's good enough quality that they run a fairly well-respected international competition there called ISAS...

    I've shot on an outdoor Meyton-equipped range; it had the targets in a purpose-built shed, but it was a warm/dry climate. The Megalink systems seem to do OK outside in the damp hanging from a target frame as a temporary setup (we Scots have a few of them), I don't know how well beam-break systems would do if they aren't sheltered from the rain ...

    PS Mac's in Australia at the ISSF World Cup right now - he won't be back for a few days. Edinkillie website is here
     
  11. A mate of mine shoots on a electronic-target (no idea which make) equipped indoor range in Rotterdam. Apparently they are rather old units, suffer from drift, and are rather sensitive to what you shoot at them.