ELCAS Claim and University funding

#1
Hi, Im ex-forces studying for a degree at university. I applied for an ELCAS claim towards tuition fees of £1000 a year. However this has resulted in the university withdrawing a promised bursary of £900. According to them ELCAS is classed as a 'sponsor' making me ineligible for university assistance despite me being a self supported student in the lowest income bracket. Does anyone else have any experience of this situation or any advice?
 
#2
From what you've written.

The Uni were going to give you £900 (per year?), but you've got ELCs worth £1,000 (x3).

University Bursary schemes are governed by that individual University's rules on the matter. In this case, you are saying I'll have £900 notes, but look at this £1,000 wedge (x3) I chuck at the thing as well.

They have decided that perhaps their (no doubt) tight fiscal situation in this charitable area means this £900 should go else where.

You'd have to ask the Uni involved for advice. But I feel you aren't really being fcuked over.
 
#3
From what you've written.

The Uni were going to give you £900 (per year?), but you've got ELCs worth £1,000 (x3).

University Bursary schemes are governed by that individual University's rules on the matter. In this case, you are saying I'll have £900 notes, but look at this £1,000 wedge (x3) I chuck at the thing as well.

They have decided that perhaps their (no doubt) tight fiscal situation in this charitable area means this £900 should go else where.

You'd have to ask the Uni involved for advice. But I feel you aren't really being fcuked over.
Thanks for the reply CF. I asked for confirmation when I handed in my claim that this wouldn't affect my funding. This is now being denied by the university who are demanding proof in writing. If I was told I couldn't have both then I would simply not of put in the ELCAS claim and saved it to take an additional course.
The universities position is that putting in an ELCAS claim automatically classes someone as a sponsored student which seems to be stretching the deifinition somewhat. It also completely negates the intended effect of the ELCAS claim to lower the cost of resettlement. Id be interested to know if this applies to people taking the full tier claim as well. There doesnt seem much benefit in have your tuition fees paid for by the government if you lose out on the grant and bursary. A nice way for the university to save on paying out on government mandated bursaries though! Sorry for the rant, but its a bit of a kick in the teeth to find out in the run up to Christmas Im losing a sixth of my funding for the year!
 
#4
Thanks for the reply CF. I asked for confirmation when I handed in my claim that this wouldn't affect my funding. This is now being denied by the university who are demanding proof in writing. If I was told I couldn't have both then I would simply not of put in the ELCAS claim and saved it to take an additional course.
The universities position is that putting in an ELCAS claim automatically classes someone as a sponsored student which seems to be stretching the deifinition somewhat. It also completely negates the intended effect of the ELCAS claim to lower the cost of resettlement. Id be interested to know if this applies to people taking the full tier claim as well. There doesnt seem much benefit in have your tuition fees paid for by the government if you lose out on the grant and bursary. A nice way for the university to save on paying out on government mandated bursaries though! Sorry for the rant, but its a bit of a kick in the teeth to find out in the run up to Christmas Im losing a sixth of my funding for the year!
So, what your saying is that you want the government to fund you twice?? ELCAS is a benefit to promote lifelong learning, and so in that very statement I would suggest that the university are correct. Would you like some cake as well?



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#5
Why not D_S? It sounds like he was just trying to be smart with the money that was available.

The MoD will fund your first degree/higher education. You might still be able to pursue this avenue even though you have left.

If you can speak to an IERO at an education centre or check the ELCAS website, there should be some support there.
 
#7
You're right to be p1ssed if they told you it wouldn't matter. But without evidence, I think you're on a hiding to nowhere.

ELCs are not intended to lower the cost of resettlement though, they are t promot lifelong learning amongst forces personnel.

To th ebest of my knowledge bursarys are handled by the Uni, but there must be a mehtod of redress.
 
#8
Cake would be smashing, cheers! Dingerr I wasn't eligible for the higher tier claim of full tuition fees paid for so could only apply for £1000 off my tuition fees. D_S The bursary and the ELCAS claim are two different things. ELCAS is paid by the MOD. The bursary is paid for by the university to students who earn under a certain amount to help them meet living costs. Having a grand knocked off my tuition fee bill, which is covered by a student loan doesnt affect my present finances. Considering anyone earning less than 25k a year is eligible for a bursary it seems bizarre for the university to claim that having slightly less to pay back in the future means I am less in need of assistance now.
 
B

Biscuits_AB

Guest
#10
Sve your ELCAS for a nice NVQ or a City & Guilds teaching qualification. There are plenty out there still riding the gravy train of 'vocational education' who'll relieve you of your money. Mate, put it behind you. At least you've still got your ELCAS, so put it aside for something else and get on with your degree.
 
#11
I think the Uni have decided seeng as he has ELCs he now has to use them...
 
#12
D_S -whatever you've got. Can't afford to be picky this Christmas! ;) (yes- that is the sound of the world's smallest violin)

Cheers for the replies. If I find some way of using ELC with other funding sources I'll post it on here.
 
#13
Biscuits -CF is correct- they are stating once the claim is paid by the MOD then it can't be reversed. Of course losing a grand isnt the end of the world but right at the moment I'd really like not to!
 
#14
Bursaries normally come with some 'no recourse to other funds' caveat. They're there to give a helping hand to students who otherwise couldn't afford the full costs of their studies. Having someone else chucking dosh your way is usually automatic grounds for ineligibility. If that's not the case here, I think the institution in question is a) being remarkably free with the gelt and b) quite probably in breach of several of their funding obligations.
 
#15
Carrots, I might agree if we were talking about several grand given as a living allowance. But £1000 deducted from a tuition fee loan which is only paid back after the course does not affect my present circumstances. The other side of the matter is that I specifically asked whether this would affect my funding and was assured it wouldnt. Im pretty sure this is because they have changed the criteria for the bursary at a later date.
 
#16
Whether you agree or not isn't really relevant. Bursaries are a helping hand to those in financial difficulties and if you get additional funding from elsewhere then you're not entitled to a Bursary. There's only a limited amount to go round and you can't expect your institution to deny the money to another student who has nothing else to fall back on.
 
#17
Bursaries are mandated by the government to be handed out to all students falling under a certain income. Other students arn't going without if I receive one.

My opinion is entirely relevant as I'm the person who's just had funding cut without warning despite being told by the University that putting in the ELCAS claim would not affect other funding. Regardless of whether ELCAS should be classed as sponsorship or not, the university still has an obligation to inform its students of the conditions of the bursary so they can make a decision to apply ELCAS or not.
.
Look at it this way -the ELCAS scheme is designed to help offset the costs of education. Most ex-servicemen will be earning well under 25K so would be eligible for financial assistance such as the bursary. If by using an ELCAS claim they lose an equivalent amount of financial aid then ELCAS is effectively worthless to those for whom it matters most.
 
#18
Bursaries are mandated by the government to be handed out to all students falling under a certain income. Other students arn't going without if I receive one.
Nope.

[h=2]Bursaries, scholarships and awards[/h] Each university or college has their own rules about bursaries, scholarships and awards. For example:

  • who qualifies
  • how much you can get
  • how to apply
Bursaries are like grants and don’t have to be paid back. You get your bursary directly from your university or college.
My opinion is entirely relevant as I'm the person who's just had funding cut without warning
No it ain't and no you haven't. You've found out that the rules apply in a particular way that disdvantages you in that you were never entitled to the second batch of funding in the first place. That's not the same as 'unfair'.

egardless of whether ELCAS should be classed as sponsorship or not, the university still has an obligation to inform its students of the conditions of the bursary so they can make a decision to apply ELCAS or not.
And students have an obligation to caveat the old emptor and do some research for themselves. You got some bad advice - who did you check it with?

If by using an ELCAS claim they lose an equivalent amount of financial aid then ELCAS is effectively worthless to those for whom it matters most.
So what? ELCAS and the Bursary are two entirely different schemes woith different aims and different conditions. Why should they be deconflicted to give someone leaving a quite well-paid job two slices of cake when there are others in greater need who haven't had the same prior opportunity to save up?

Suck it up.
 
#19
You seem to have the wrong end of the stick. I've not stated anything was 'unfair '. Im not posting to have a drip sesh. I just wanted to know if other people were having the same issues and if there was a work around.
Having said that, theres a horse that needs flogging:
Firstly bursaries are government mandated, the Universities are run like businesses and if they could would not give out any financial aid. They have some small degree of control over who they give them out to which is where my own case comes in.

As it happens my emptors were well and truly caveated. The people I checked with were the University, ELCAS and student finance uk. Regardless of whether the rules regarding bursaries and ELCAS are correct or the University is bending them, they have an obligation to give out correct information.
They also didn't give any warning or even contact me after the fact to tell me my funding had been cut. If you don't want to believe that then I'm hardly going to convince you here.

As for the forces being a well paid job I guess we will have to disagree on that as well. But it doesnt matter whether you or I think soldiering is well paid though, what matters is what student finance uk think and judging by the threshold for financial assistance, I was paid poorly enough to warrent aid.

So I've actually left a badly paid job which has some fringe benefits such as the ELCAS scheme. I'm now finding that said scheme is of little use for higher education because of the way the University treats it. Do I want that changed? Of course.
Suck it up? Fall back in and toe the line? Why would I when I know I'm in the right?
 
#20
Niether scheme is at fault. They are just mutually exclusive.
 
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