Does the RAF regiment have a future?

Kefi

War Hero
Without labouring on i did apologise for the thread drift in the first line and as a body of men and women in that you are ALL the RAF. But this is why when you speak to non-Regt RAF types, they all have the same comment that you have massive chips on your shoulders and you are only seen when there is GDT to be done and you get a hard on because some one from SCAF didn't do forward assist on the WHT.

But as @Polyester has pointed out for every infringement of military good order & discipline made by the RAF the same or similar is made by the Pongos & RN. Just for balance you make a BIG deal out of some scruffy airmen who may or may not have been told to turn up in good order, I offer you this>>>>>


 

Class 66

War Hero
There’s a couple of problems with trying to counter rockets. Their range is beyond the range of the 81mm (and long gone are the days of supercharging it with a bit of petrol down the tube and a couple of extra augmenting carts jammed on).

Rockets were fired from angle iron laid on berms, sometimes they wouldn’t even bother with the angle iron. Fair enough this reduced the range, but even then still more than the 81mm mortar once they had become adept at it. A hole is pierced in the base of the rocket and a length of safety fuse pushed in. By the time the rocket has launched the enemy are far away. Assuming the FP is within range of mortars all you’d be firing at would be a few bits of angle iron.

I’m not saying there wasn’t counter fire, but it doesn’t make sense.
Well the range of the 81 is 5660 metres. The range of the 107 was 5 - 8 km depending on the ground etc.
 
Well the range of the 81 is 5660 metres. The range of the 107 was 5 - 8 km depending on the ground etc.

Lets, for argument sake, say you were within range. What did you think you were firing at? And to what effect?
 

Kefi

War Hero

No I did my sniping with the L42 in Cyprus in 1985. It was an in-house course run by an RAF Regt SNCO who had qualified as a sniper instructor with the RM. When the pongos found out they said any future sniper training had to be done with the army SASC. On the next course run at Epi 34 Sqn RAF Regt sent 6 guys to join the resident Bn who were the RRF. Long story short a member of 34 Sqn RAF Regt, & also a good mate who I'm still in contact with got top student. Now that you have raised the subject of sniping there is a thread on here somewhere titled " WHY WERE THE RAF Regt INVITED TO THE ARMY SNIPER COMPETITION BUT NOT AWARDED FIRST PRIZE FOR WINNING IT" the reasons why are priceless :D

Next question?
 

Class 66

War Hero
Lets, for argument sake, say you were within range. What did you think you were firing at? And to what effect?
It was basically Harrassing fire at the FP. The insurgents were probably long gone and as you mentioned the Rockets on the Berm on timers, however there were always 2 anomlies with a bank of rockets, 4 would go off together, another one 30 minutes later to harass or kill the follow up on camp Post attack recovery and one simply laying there booby trapped ready to take out people like yourselves EOD. So if they could be destroyed / disrupted all well and good. Not all were arranged like that but you obviously had to assume the last 2 points and be aware. But the return fire was basically sending them a message, at some time we will catch you out. It was also good for morale on camp knowing we were doing something rather than nothing.
 

Class 66

War Hero
No I did my sniping with the L42 in Cyprus in 1985. It was an in-house course run by an RAF Regt SNCO who had qualified as a sniper instructor with the RM. When the pongos found out they said any future sniper training had to be done with the army SASC. On the next course run at Epi 34 Sqn RAF Regt sent 6 guys to join the resident Bn who were the RRF. Long story short a member of 34 Sqn RAF Regt, & also a good mate who I'm still in contact with got top student. Now that you have raised the subject of sniping there is a thread on here somewhere titled " WHY WERE THE RAF Regt INVITED TO THE ARMY SNIPER COMPETITION BUT NOT AWARDED FIRST PRIZE FOR WINNING IT" the reasons why are priceless :D

Next question?
Have a look at this 22:00........https://charliecharlieone.com/2021/08/h-hour-podcast-141-simon-town-quickdraw-card-co-founder-former-royal-marine-sniper/
 

Polyester

War Hero
It was basically Harrassing fire at the FP. The insurgents were probably long gone and as you mentioned the Rockets on the Berm on timers, however there were always 2 anomlies with a bank of rockets, 4 would go off together, another one 30 minutes later to harass or kill the follow up on camp Post attack recovery and one simply laying there booby trapped ready to take out people like yourselves EOD. So if they could be destroyed / disrupted all well and good. Not all were arranged like that but you obviously had to assume the last 2 points and be aware. But the return fire was basically sending them a message, at some time we will catch you out. It was also good for morale on camp knowing we were doing something rather than nothing.
It’s a bit a drift here but I used to love seeing the phalanx at night when we got incoming. I was on VAS so on the airfield all the time and got great views at night.
 
It was basically Harrassing fire at the FP. The insurgents were probably long gone and as you mentioned the Rockets on the Berm on timers,


I can understand that if the enemy has launched a mortar attack and are in place feeding the mortar, but with rockets you are harassing no one because no one is there. It’s pointless and a waste of ammo.

however there were always 2 anomlies with a bank of rockets, 4 would go off together, another one 30 minutes later to harass or kill the follow up on camp Post attack recovery and one simply laying there booby trapped ready to take out people like yourselves EOD. So if they could be destroyed / disrupted all well and good.

You wouldn’t know whats at the FP, you can’t see it. To assume that is just nonsense. Trying to attack an IED with mortars is not, nor has it ever been within UK IEDD Philosophy. The chances are that vital forensics would be destroyed, the state of any IED would be altered making it an angry bomb and more hazardous to render safe. There’s also the possibility of leaving blind mortars in the vicinity of the FP, creating another hazard for the Operator.

So in short: Knowing the MO of the enemy when using rockets, it is a waste of time, effort and ammunition trying to counter them with mortar fire.

Now I know it’s not the lads on the mortar line’s fault, but somewhere further up there’s someone making decisions that appeared to be based on little more than wanting a cabby with the 81mm and big timing it.
 
The average RAF Regt gunner does not big time anything, he is well aware of his role and also well aware of the Armies role. We follow the Infantries syllabus in training, PDT and promotion courses with the aim of, if we ever get in the shit, we have been given the tools to sort it. So if he walks around with a bit of pride about him then good for him.
The army generally have the chips on the shoulders because deep down In their little bulled boots they know they are beneath the ROYAL AIR FARCE.
HIP HIP HUZZAH.
if they really believed in how super soldier they were they would not have to blow their own little trumpets
All the time .
As a rigger only the sky god's were above me .
 
But the return fire was basically sending them a message, at some time we will catch you out. It was also good for morale on camp knowing we were doing something rather than nothing.

Trouble is no one’s home to receive the message. You probably felt awesome chucking some bombs down range, but it was worse than doing nothing.
 

diverman

LE
Book Reviewer
Whilst it has jogged the little grey cells looking backwards at what the Rocks may or may not have been doing, I'd be interested to see if any poster recalls when the Regt lost the AD piece to the RA?

Specifically, when the Regt gave up Rapier FSC and the RA picked up the task, x-number of Regt Sqns stopped doing business. Presumably some re-roled to Field sqns and others got chopped. Did the RA pick up a commensurate number of posts to match those numbers or, was the whole task, including the Falklands job, just done within existing numbers of RA at the time?

The question is pertinent to the future of the RAF Regt I think, because if they come from within CAS's control total (budget) I don't think the chopping will see an equivalent amount of posts/funding go to the Army to do the job.
ashes
It makes me wonder as an aside why the rocks are such an emotive subject for some pongo types, their demise is unlikely to save a single (1 bn) cap badge as I doubt there would be a battalion of JPANs freed up by their being chopped.
Didn’t they give up Rapier around the time they stopped defending USAF air and cruise missile stations.
 
I can understand that if the enemy has launched a mortar attack and are in place feeding the mortar, but with rockets you are harassing no one because no one is there. It’s pointless and a waste of ammo.



You wouldn’t know whats at the FP, you can’t see it. To assume that is just nonsense. Trying to attack an IED with mortars is not, nor has it ever been within UK IEDD Philosophy. The chances are that vital forensics would be destroyed, the state of any IED would be altered making it an angry bomb and more hazardous to render safe. There’s also the possibility of leaving blind mortars in the vicinity of the FP, creating another hazard for the Operator.

So in short: Knowing the MO of the enemy when using rockets, it is a waste of time, effort and ammunition trying to counter them with mortar fire.

Now I know it’s not the lads on the mortar line’s fault, but somewhere further up there’s someone making decisions that appeared to be based on little more than wanting a cabby with the 81mm and big timing it.
Is @The Assassin back
 

Polyester

War Hero
The army generally have the chips on the shoulders because deep down In their little bulled boots they know they are beneath the ROYAL AIR FARCE.
HIP HIP HUZZAH.
if they really believed in how super soldier they were they would not have to blow their own little trumpets
All the time .
As a rigger only the sky god's were above me .
Is that an aerial in your avatar? Were you an aerial erector?
 

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