Do your duty and give TA a fortnight off to train, employers told

Discussion in 'Current Affairs, News and Analysis' started by cavemandave, Oct 7, 2012.

Welcome to the Army Rumour Service, ARRSE

The UK's largest and busiest UNofficial military website.

The heart of the site is the forum area, including:

  1. Do your duty and give TA a fortnight off to train, employers told
    Employers should do their duty for Britain's Territorial Army by offering reservists two weeks of paid leave for training, the Defence Secretary has said.


    Philip Hammond wants companies to give reservists more time off, after he unveiled plans to let civil servants have at least ten paid 10 days for Territorial Army duties a year.
    The Defence Secretary said it would send a “clear message of how much we value our reserves" as the Government tries to increase membership of the TA.
    “In the future, the reserves will form an integral and integrated part of the armed forces so it is essential they have time to train," he said. "The Government is showing its commitment by taking the lead as an employer of reservists and we hope other employers will follow suit.”
    He also pledged to give an additional £5 million to refurbish the centre for injured soldiers at Headley Court.
    Ministers need to attract new recruits to the Territorial Army under plans to increase the number of battle-ready reservists from 20,000 to 30,000 over the next few years.

    The Ministry of Defence is dramatically shrinking the size of the armed forces, meaning Britain will have to rely much more heavily on TA reserves in future.
    However, ministers have been warned that the TA is suffering recruitment problems as some employers are reluctant to hire reservists who may be deployed overseas at short notice or have to take time off for training.
    Many reservists have to spend their holidays training as there is a requirement for them to spend at least 15 days in a row at an annual army camp.
    The Duke of Westminster, the former head of the TA, last month told The Daily Telegraph that reservists are suffering “outrageous” discrimination from “despicable” British employers.
    He said that foreign firms were much more likely to release staff to serve with the Army Reserve than English companies.
    The Duke suggested it may even be necessary to offer new National Insurance tax breaks for companies that employ reservists.

    Do your duty and give TA a fortnight off to train, employers told - Telegraph
     
  2. Why should the employers pay when the TA are paying anyway? Don't get me wrong I'd love another 2 weeks paid leave I just don't ever see it happening
     
  3. When I finally quit the Army I intend to open a business. With all of this I would be loath to employ someone in the TA. Why should I, as a small business owner, be expected to stump up money, in addition to normal holiday pay, when one of my staff isn't in work, and is being paid by the State? Bad enough that I may have to find temporary cover for 9 months whilst he's off on some Op somewhere.

    Utterly barking.
     
    • Like Like x 3
  4. Lets face it Legs, the average florist isn't going to join the TA is he ?
     
    • Like Like x 3
  5. Who is this cock-tard Hammond? Does he know nothing about his own department?

    The CS already gives special paid leave for reservists and his he not aware that the reserves isnt just the TA?
     
  6. Hard enough covering maternity leave, then as a small business you're the cover.
     
  7. So have I got this right? The government wants to get rid of regular trained full time professionals, and use the TA to partially paper over the cracks a little army will leave. They won't be paying towards any sort of TA pension, which would be a joke anyway, they won't stop classifying TA service as anything other than 'casual labour', and they won't do much to protect a TA serviceman's civilian career. This will all save money.

    As the cherry on the cake, they want all businesses to do 'the right thing' and give an extra helping of paid leave. But surely businesses fund defence through taxes? Still, more money saved.

    There was a time, not so long ago, when I'd have been proud for my son to join the TA, or the Regs. I'd still be proud, but I'd worry about its effects; on his employment in civvy street, and his long term employability if he went regular.

    If I was running a small business, I don't think I'd employ a member of the TA these days.
     
  8. Leading by example- The CS usually get 8 days paid leave for Reserve /TA training. It's a big firm, so can easily afford the extra 2 days for a full camp. It's not like there's the Civil Service Rifles any more, so it's a relatively small concession for a small number of people.

    What he isn't doing is making it more attractive for the employer. Probably the best way to do this would be to make changes to the tax system so that wages paid to employees on Reserve service would be deducted in some form from the company tax bill, or companies getting a tax break for employing a proportion of Reservists-but I don't see that happening.
     
    • Like Like x 2
  9. meridian

    meridian LE Good Egg (charities)

    The employer will be paying twice, first through employers NI and corporation tax etc and then as a cherry on top, they will have to pay to cover the TA soldier with a temp and/or swallow the impact whilst on training.

    What a great idea that is

    As the TA soldier will be getting paid through the MoD's budget, which is of course funded by tax revenue, the employers of this country are being asked to pay twice.

    Am sure the SME's up and down the land will be queuing up to do their patriotic duty

    Of course, if the reservist is employed by the public sector outside of the MoD then its the other department that subsidises the MoD operating costs
     
  10. MOD usually gets 10-15 days paid leave for Reserve duties, and I suspect wider CS is similar. Not quite sure why Hammond is spinning this as its just reannouncing what already exists.

    Now, the more interesting debate is whether the CS will be willing to lose its employees one year in five as they patriotically volunteer to stag on as part of the full time Army. Will CS manning be increased to cover the fact that some staff will only be there for four years in five? Thought not!
     
  11. The whole thing would require a massive culture shift in HMG. They keep harping on about how other countries manage with a large proportion of their service being part time. They forget to say that they are also funded differently and have a much greater level of protection and the employers are given more help too.

    I guess it's hard to have an army on the cheap if you keep paying people to serve. I'm sure HMG would do away with all wages for TA personal if they could.
     
  12. I can't see many SME's welcoming this suggestion, if the Gubmint wants to attract more reservists especially those with any sort of career prospects; then I would suggest doing away with the Tax free "Bounty payment" and make all reservist pay Free of tax. This way they can send a very clear message that service on behalf of the country IS valued. It would encourage maybe more mid level career individuals for whom any significant raise in earnings will tip them into higher tax rather than the no hoper unemployable dross that often comes knocking at the TAC gates.

    The Regular element no doubt will point out that they pay tax like everyone else - however I would counter that Reservists
    don't get the Pension, the healthcare, housing and other allowances; and on ops at least taking the same risks as Regs.

    I could expand , but I'm due on Shift this evening and trying to pack gear my for a deployment.

    TTFN PP
     
  13. What do they do at the moment, gap the post & pocket the salary saving or get a temp in and charge the MoD the extra cost of agency rates?
     
  14. Andy - get a temp in. MOD pays not only the difference in salary for the mobilised chap, but also personnel costs for the temp too.

    Fine for a large organisation, damn site more difficult when you are in small companies where the reservist is a critical post which cant easily be covered.
     
  15. I employ a handful of people. If one wants 10 days paid leave, that's going to cost me their day rate (say £120 once employers NI is paid) plus the cost to replace them through an agency (probably twice that) plus the inevitable business interruption that having somebody away for 2 weeks straight will cause. In all, I'd estimate the cost for one employee to be just under £4,000.

    No ****ing chance.

    That's TA blokes binned before the interview stage, as far as I'm concerned.
     
    • Like Like x 2