Do we salute?

Discussion in 'ACF' started by papegojan, Mar 30, 2007.

Welcome to the Army Rumour Service, ARRSE

The UK's largest and busiest UNofficial military website.

The heart of the site is the forum area, including:

  1. Recently we have had a midshipman from the local UOTC assisting at our detachment. He's a good lad, ex 4star army cadet and enjoys helping us out. The question I am asking is should he be saluted,called sir etc. as all the info I can find on midshipmen is ambiguous. The general view seems to place them between O/cdt an 2Lt. Someone please help. :?
     
  2. A midshipman is the equivalent to a 2Lt, so all compliments are observed. Unlike the OTC, where they are officer cadets, the URNUs (University Royal Naval Units) are given the rank of midshipman - which is a bit confusing as it is an officer cadet AND a rank in it's own right - you can go to Dartmouth as a midshipman, pass out, go to a ship and still be a midshipman!

    If in doubt you can always ring up his PSI at the URNU.
     
  3. He's a decent lad and not likely to throw a wobbler either way, but I want to get it right to set the right example to the cadets, and because I respect this guy. He's doing a degree, his work with the URNU and he's helping us out in his spare time. Thanks for the advice.
     
  4. If you want to set the right example for the cadets, then salute him. Discipline and respect for rank is learned by example...
     
  5. The rank of URNU Midshipman is non-substantive. Navel officer cadets at Dartmouth use the substantive rank of Midshipman or Sub-Lieutenant depending on a number of factors after the first 7 weeks. Before this a blue bordered white square (Navel Student Officer) is worn.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Royal_Navy_officer_rank_insignia

    Midshipman however only has the NATO rank equivalent of OF-D whereas a Army Second-Lieutenant and a Royal Navy Sub-Lieutenant are both OF-1

    The rank of Midshipman is however still entitled to compliments from junior ranks and cadets. (meaning you salute him)

    However ask him, as he may feel embarrassed about this, or a single salute at the start of the evening often suffices for all officers peasant.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Template:UK_officer_ranks
     
  6. That's what I thought and what I have been doing, but got collared by a cadet's parent (ex forces, so he says) who says he never saluted middies, as he called them. That's why I posted here to get a professional, sensible answer. Thanks for the help, MBE, You've backed up what I thought.
     
  7. Tell cadets parent(ex forces) to wind his neck in, if he is such a stickler for the rules then ask him to prove that this guy isn't to be saluted.
     
  8. Inform parent (ex forces or not) that it is his son/daughter not him/her who is a member of the detachment, and that he/she follows your directions not his/hers.

    I used to work at a NATO HQ and knew most NATO & Foreign ranks, but used the simple rule "If in doubt, salute" if you are wrong they will soon tell you!
     
  9. Thanks evereyone. Will carry on saluting, as that seems the right thing to do. Feel daft, really. Been an instructor for nearly 15 years but never come across this before. Thanks again
     
  10. if it got more pips, more bar codes, is more shinier than you , salute it, worked ok so far :D
     
  11. The way that I have done it when i have worked with the ACF is that they call me Sir but do not salute as i am not a commissioned officer. I find this works just fine. If you get him to do an interest lesson on the OTC the the cadets will have a better understanding of what he does,

    hope this helps

    P_T_I
     
  12. Queens Commissiion = Salute, No Queens Commission = No salute easy
     

  13. Unless of course your Chief2, who thinks Brits should salute septic Warrent Officers!

    *Waits for the twat to jump on this thread*
     
  14. Who??, and why does he think that??, have you a link perchance, I can feel a heckling coming on........