Discussion in 'Current Affairs, News and Analysis' started by pombsen-armchair-warrior, Jun 16, 2007.

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  1. Since the Cold War ended the Services have been enmeshed in a seemingly inextricable paradox.

    From 1945 to 1989 the singular threat to the security of the West was that posed by the Warsaw Pact, a threat that required huge standing mil forces to be maintained for a considerable period of time.

    This required huge amounts of resource to sustain, resource that politically (although not always economically) was able to be found, as crucially the civil population felt this to be a tangible threat, and one that could at any moment be realised. Not only did this enable expenditure to be maintained it also made it easy to base nuclear weapons and elms of the 'Star Wars' project in UK. In addition, the 'Comprehensive Approach', recently highlighted by CGS, was embodied by a strong and resilient NATO (now damaged and weakened virtually beyond repair).

    There were of course elements of dissent against this policy, most notably Greenham Common. Arguably, this assisted the maintenance of standing forces and the nuclear deterrent in that it provided the oxygen of publicity to remind the public of the ongoing threat posed by the WP, kept the AF in the public eye, and the size of the standing forces meant a much greater awareness of defence amongst the civil population.

    In addition, NI was never far away and served to remind the populace, albeit through the terrible tragedies of the mainland campaigns, that the war literally was on the doorstep and needed strong mil forces to combat it.

    Paradoxically, since the end of the Cold War, the size of the forces has reduced in line with the removal of both the general war and NI insurgency threats. These threats have, however, been replaced by other threats, arguably just as great, and requiring a change from a linear near-home base posture, with a foothold in a benign environment, to an extended expeditionary posture, in multiple theatres, and in hostile environments. In addition, there is the emerging global threat posed by China, the next great superpower.

    You could argue therefore that current force levels, based on these current and future threats, be at least equal (in terms of capability and not just numbers) to that which existed during the Cold War.

    The problem however, is that the civil populace do not feel threatened by these significant risks. The conflict in Iraq and Afg are remote affairs, which apart from the odd home based terrorist incident, have hardly any effect on the home front. Equally, although China is building its forces to superpower levels its distance from Europe makes it inconceivable that they could pose that the same threat of invasion that the WP did.

    I would argue, therefore, that within this 'benign' environment, the appetite to increase mil spending, and therefore the size of our forces, in order to robustly sustain current threats, is extremely limited. Furthermore, unless we can win the info campaign with our own people the chances of garnering support to increase expenditure is virtually nil.

    Which brings me back to the original question: In order to provide a credible mil capability, and rebuild our forces from their current fragile state, "Do we need another Cold War?"

  2. We need something to take the taxpayer's mind off Celebrity Who's a Millionaire Joseph and focus it on why Governmants spend money as they do.

    It's been often noted that hardly any of CIVPOP know what the Armed |Forces actually do, so it's asking a bit much to expect that they know how much money it takes to keep tham in the Premier Division. Add in the lack of percieved threat as PAW says, and they can't fathom why things don't just carry on as they were in the good old days of the Soviet Union.

    People will always make their minds up on the basis of "What's in it for me?" even if it's on a subconscious level. Without dirty great hordes of faceless foe poised to sweep down Acacia Avenue, schools, hospitals, motorways, Easyjet flights to Prague for the weekend, Sky TV, little Tarquil's lacrosse uniform and sustainable hardwood flooring will all take priority bullets, blankets and beans in the minds of Joe public.
  3. Eh, the last cold war wasn't easy you know, FFS them Active Edge call outs were a pain in the arrse, one minute boozing then the next lining up against 3 Shock Army (a scary name for a mob), but we had naked women pictures to help us, thank you Miss Summer Sales 81.
  4. By the way the US and Russia are sabre rattling at the moment we may get a new cold war if we want one or not.
  5. Well a new cold war would be nice

    It would stop the pillocks in No.10 cutting funding

    Besides rumours have it our Russian "friends" are still active in the espionage game
  6. This will start all over again!

    Attached Files:

  7. Although I agree with much you say, do not kid yourself that 99% of CivPop give a flying **** about the threat or what the services do.

    Talk to civvies about the cold war and they think it is a special offer in Iceland.
  8. I thought they used cars that a feckin great "D" in the middle of the plate now?
  9. That was the worst thing from the Woods and Howes murders; seeing that quoted in the papers as they tortured them to death.
  10. No mate, way back then (pulls up sandbag) they had their own plate, nothing to do with Diplomatic Corps, they were just KGB bluffing the fact they were normal squaddies, it was good the fact that we could give them loads of grief if they kicked off. I actually got bust because of a border patrol incident involving the East German border guards, but thats for another day!
  11. Remember watching that on telly, fcuking appalling, plus the fact that knowing one of them didn't help. My mate was up in the heli-teli filming it and they thought it was provo on provo.
  12. Shame that isn't allowed to happen now

    Now any notice issues tells us not to "interfere" with them in any way, I guess that's because the vehicles are Diplo tagged
  13. China is a future problem for the US, Japan, RoK, Taiwan and Oz, not for us paricularly. Whilst Russia may rattle its sabre, they're nowhere near the threat they were 20 years ago, nor are they likely to be so again any time soon. The REAL threat is here in the UK already, we all know wha it is, the problem is, do we, or more specifically our politicians, have the balls to do anything about it?
  14. Cold War II - This Time it's Personal!

    Can't see it; Russia is basically run by the Ivan Mafia. A new Cold War would be bad for business.
  15. The way I see it, we in the UK and the rest of Europe are in a position anagolous to France in 1940. On paper of course we have the resources needed to beat our 'threat' from militant Islam, but we are confronted by an enemy more committed, more vigorous, more willing to die for the casue than we are. 40 years of cultural leftism (I hesitate to call it Marxism now, because Marxist Russia fought bitterly), cultural relativism and basically running down our own societies have made it that way.

    And in answer to 'Do we need another home insurgency?' - we've already got one, thanks.