Do soldiers need more direct fire explosive firepower?

#1
Hello all,

I'm an independent inventor who has several patents, mostly on military technologies. I would like some feedback from soldiers who have served in Iraq and Afghanistan whether there is a need for more pointable firepower.

For example, I was recently told by a mid-level RAF officer that grenade launchers were fitted to the SA80 rifles in Afghanistan, where engagement ranges of around 5m in jungles were surprisingly common. The grenade launchers apparently are effective even at such short ranges, although he didn't elaborate whether it was because one could shoot someone directly with the 40mm grenade to knock them down (some 40mm grenades have an arming range of 23m), or if you could shoot close to them if the grenade doesn't have a safe arming distance.

So may I please ask if soldiers on the ground need more explosive weapons that everyone can equip, are lightweight (no more than 1.5kg), have multiple rounds between reloads, have decent range (say up to 200m) and are direct fire (like LAW, rifle grenades or 40mm grenades, instead of mortars or hand grenades)?

Cheers!
 

Biped

LE
Book Reviewer
#4
mick4075 said:
I think he means bushes.

How's about a semi-auto 8 gauge shotgun? I dunno, perhaps something like the Benelli M4 perhaps, can you make one of those? :D

In all seriousness though. What about a full-auto shotgun with a drum mag?
 
#5
Biped said:
mick4075 said:
I think he means bushes.

How's about a semi-auto 8 gauge shotgun? I dunno, perhaps something like the Benelli M4 perhaps, can you make one of those? :D

In all seriousness though. What about a full-auto shotgun with a drum mag?
The South African "Protecta" 12 round revolving shot gun been around since the 80s
 

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#6
IndependentBoffin said:
Hello all,

I'm an independent inventor who has several patents, mostly on military technologies. I would like some feedback from soldiers who have served in Iraq and Afghanistan whether there is a need for more pointable firepower.

For example, I was recently told by a mid-level RAF officer that grenade launchers were fitted to the SA80 rifles in Afghanistan, where engagement ranges of around 5m in jungles were surprisingly common. The grenade launchers apparently are effective even at such short ranges, although he didn't elaborate whether it was because one could shoot someone directly with the 40mm grenade to knock them down (some 40mm grenades have an arming range of 23m), or if you could shoot close to them if the grenade doesn't have a safe arming distance.

So may I please ask if soldiers on the ground need more explosive weapons that everyone can equip, are lightweight (no more than 1.5kg), have multiple rounds between reloads, have decent range (say up to 200m) and are direct fire (like LAW, rifle grenades or 40mm grenades, instead of mortars or hand grenades)?

Cheers!
1.5 kg is barely above the weight of three L109 hand grenades.....

Are you thinking of a plastic revolver gun in 12bore firing Frag 12 cartridges and fitted with a miniature red -dot sight by any chance?
 
#8
Could have been RAF Regiment......

What about the USMC M32 MSGL? 6 shots in 3 seconds if required, with a reflex sight. Already in use by US marines in Iraq allegedly.
 
#9
The Russians do a 4 bore Three round rifled pump action the KS23M
 

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#11
Might be wrong but have frag and flechette been banned ? On the question from the "boffin" the answer must be yes,although a mid level RAF officer is probably not the best bloke to ask!! Anything that can suppress the enemy at ranges out to 200m is good, shotguns ,neat and tidy holes with maximum physhc damage to all those around the munt who gets hit :D
 
#12
I saw something on future weapons about a grenade round for shotguns and it seemed pretty sexy, although expensive. Something like that loaded into an AA-12 appears to be the perfect solution.
 
#16
Can you buy the canisters at all good tobacconists? i take it that they take bog standard lighter re-fill canisters. I also get the feeling your mind is a vast place Tech that needs massive stimulation!
 

OldSnowy

LE
Moderator
Book Reviewer
#17
Frags and Flechettes are certainly not banned - Apache Flechettes have been used on many occasions in Afghanistan recently.

As for the original quesiton - the answer is - and probably always will be - YES :)
 
#18
warrior8234mkIIIA2 said:
Can you buy the canisters at all good tobacconists? i take it that they take bog standard lighter re-fill canisters. I also get the feeling your mind is a vast place Tech that needs massive stimulation!
Actually my mind is a vast place that needs constant stimulation, i think i've got the attention span of a goldfish! ........... wait what was i talking about???
 
#19
revmodes said:
Might be wrong but have frag and flechette been banned ? On the question from the "boffin" the answer must be yes,although a mid level RAF officer is probably not the best bloke to ask!! Anything that can suppress the enemy at ranges out to 200m is good, shotguns ,neat and tidy holes with maximum physhc damage to all those around the munt who gets hit :D
The CRV7s fired by AAC Apache are "Flechette" with 80 to each rocket
 
#20
With regards to grenades and non-lethal force, is there any possibility in creating 'mohawk' grenades like i have seen advertised on the T.V that temporarily disable the enemy and inflict them with a Mr T type face and hair do for a period of time whislt running around shouting 'pity the fool' or 'i aint getting on no plane'
 

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