Despite horrible allegations I still respect HM armed forces

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#1
I don't wish to discuss the allegation made by The People and Daily Mail. According to the rules, we must not discuss it.

However, maybe the final dicision made in Baha Mousa case was wrong? Maybe it was a message to potential (and real) thugs?
 
#2
KGB_resident said:
I don't wish to discuss the allegation made by The People and Daily Mail. According to the rules, we must not discuss it.

However, maybe the final dicision made in Baha Mousa case was wrong? Maybe it was a message to potential (and real) thugs?
then why bother to post unless to highlight and draw attention to the incident? apart from playing a petty nationalistic point scoring game of course.
 
#4
pvtePile said:
been wondering if KGB sole duty/mission in life is to urine everyone off..?

I think i now have my answer.
No thats Sven!
 
#5
DrStealth said:
KGB_resident said:
I don't wish to discuss the allegation made by The People and Daily Mail. According to the rules, we must not discuss it.

However, maybe the final dicision made in Baha Mousa case was wrong? Maybe it was a message to potential (and real) thugs?
then why bother to post unless to highlight and draw attention to the incident? apart from playing a petty nationalistic point scoring game of course.
OK. British army is the best in the World.

Let's stop on this point.
 
#6
KGB_resident said:
According to the rules, we must not discuss it.
So basically it's a post about...........
 

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#7
On a different matter...

In February, The ****** revealed that two recruits in the same regiment had tissue paper forced up their backsides and set alight in an initiation ceremony.


Our evidence was handed to the Ministry of Defence.
What evidence was left then? Was it non burning tissue paper that was set alight and if so how?
 
#8
Spank-it said:
KGB_resident said:
According to the rules, we must not discuss it.
So basically it's a post about...........
Funny picture. I like it. I recalled Soviet times when we used to unzip our mouths in the kitchen - traditional Russian place for free discussions.

I wholeheartedly agree the ban to discuss individual incidents that are under investigation. Though agree or disagree... it doesn't matter. I try to obey the rules anyway.

I would like to incourage (or provoke if you like) a broad discussion about methods and means to exclude anything that damage positive image of armed forces (and not only British ones).

There is a lot of similar problems in many armies (including Russian one). So I'm interesting in your suggestions and propositions (of course without any direct reference to the case).
 
#9
Dear KGB Resident,

I would like to know what methods and means the Russian government is using to exclude the following allegations which have damaged the positive image of the Russian armed forces:

http://hrw.org/reports/2004/russia1004/

Report from Human Rights Watch on initiation rites in the Russian military

A gruesome case of hazing on December 31, 2005, which resulted in a conscript needing to have his legs and genitals amputated, once again pushed violent hazing in Russia’s military into the spotlight. The Ministry of Defense belatedly took steps to address this case, but it maintains that violent hazing is not a widespread problem in Russia’s military. In fact, though, the practice of hazing has resulted in the death of dozens of young soldiers every year, and serious damage to the physical and mental health of thousands of others.
Yours sincerely,

Yellow_Devil
 

oldbaldy

LE
Moderator
#10
#11
Closet_Jibber said:
pvtePile said:
been wondering if KGB sole duty/mission in life is to urine everyone off..?

I think i now have my answer.
No thats Sven!

Damn, how could i forget that man.. sorry KGB you will have to work harder for that title... you have got stiff competition...something u might not be familier with in Russia.
 
#12
Yellow_Devil said:
Dear KGB Resident,

I would like to know what methods and means the Russian government is using to exclude the following allegations which have damaged the positive image of the Russian armed forces:

http://hrw.org/reports/2004/russia1004/

Report from Human Rights Watch on initiation rites in the Russian military

A gruesome case of hazing on December 31, 2005, which resulted in a conscript needing to have his legs and genitals amputated, once again pushed violent hazing in Russia’s military into the spotlight. The Ministry of Defense belatedly took steps to address this case, but it maintains that violent hazing is not a widespread problem in Russia’s military. In fact, though, the practice of hazing has resulted in the death of dozens of young soldiers every year, and serious damage to the physical and mental health of thousands of others.
Yours sincerely,

Yellow_Devil
Dear Yellow_Devil, this sad case is well known. There was a big fuss around it. The abuser got 4 years in the jail.

As I'm aware step by step punishments for crimes committed by servicment are becoming more and more severe. In 2007 two soldiers were jailed for 4 and 7 year. They were beating their subordinates, one of the abused committed suicide (though it was not proved that it happened as a result of the beatings).

Regards!
 
#13
KGB_resident said:
DrStealth said:
KGB_resident said:
I don't wish to discuss the allegation made by The People and Daily Mail. According to the rules, we must not discuss it.

However, maybe the final dicision made in Baha Mousa case was wrong? Maybe it was a message to potential (and real) thugs?
then why bother to post unless to highlight and draw attention to the incident? apart from playing a petty nationalistic point scoring game of course.
OK. British army is the best in the World.

Let's stop on this point.
i never said that, or had that as any intention of my post. so just what on earth makes you think i did?
Sergy, try and remember that other users on here are not posting for the same reasons you are.

we all work to our own ulterior motives.
 
#14
DrStealth said:
KGB_resident said:
DrStealth said:
KGB_resident said:
I don't wish to discuss the allegation made by The People and Daily Mail. According to the rules, we must not discuss it.

However, maybe the final dicision made in Baha Mousa case was wrong? Maybe it was a message to potential (and real) thugs?
then why bother to post unless to highlight and draw attention to the incident? apart from playing a petty nationalistic point scoring game of course.
OK. British army is the best in the World.

Let's stop on this point.
i never said that,...
However, I hope you agree with the statement.

DrStealth said:
...or had that as any intention of my post. so just what on earth makes you think i did?
It is merely a supposition. You can express your opinion on the matter and I would accept it unconditionally.

As for Russian army then it is to far from being called the best (even one of the best) in the World.

DrStealth said:
Sergy, try and remember that other users on here are not posting for the same reasons you are. we all work to our own ulterior motives.
Of course. I understand (and understood) it pretty well. However, human nature is the same in different corners of our World.

Sometimes reading posts here I have a strange feeling that I understand myself, my perception of the World better. It is like a mirror. It helps to see own image.

For example, previously (few years ago) I sincerely thought that crimes and problems in Russian army have deep roots in traditions, in history. But now I'm absolutely sure that mainly Russian politicians (to begin with Putin) were to be blamed. But the situation is improving (though very slowly).

Have the politicians a political will to make their armies the best in the World? In Russia I feel it. In the UK... not sure.
 
#15
I continue previous post

Let's regard this example

http://www.ynetnews.com/articles/1,7340,L-3245593,00.html

35 soldiers at Air Force base suspected of raping, sexually assaulting 14-year-old girl
...
Meanwhile, army officials told Ynet the events in question are grave.

"It's even more severe because it happened inside a military base, and the way it looks now we'll be serving indictments against many involved in the affair," one IDF source said.
Who should be blamed for it? Of course the commander of the base and his subordinates. It looks that our Israeli friends regard the incident very seriously and there is a political will to exclude something like this in the future.
 
#16
Sometimes reading posts here I have a strange feeling that I understand myself, my perception of the World better. It is like a mirror. It helps to see own image.
some rules i find help me when i'm reading politics or political opinion -

read everything, even if it upsets you.

whats the ulterior motive? its human nature, there allways is one.

who benefits? even if the benefit is unintentional.

Follow The Money.

Have the politicians a political will to make their armies the best in the World? In Russia I feel it. In the UK... not sure.
I agree.
 
#17
Naughty BOY Sergey
remove trousers go bend over in corner of room, brace up and await boarding party.
john
Yes Jolly Jacks cumming ta town.
 
#18
Sergey. When you hold your own Government to the same rigorous standards you hold others (particularly the Israelis for some reason) I will accept lectures from you.

Until then do your Sermon on the Mount in another direction. Baha Mousa died in terrible circumstances and the truth WILL out.

How many Russian Soldiers have been jailed for Murder vis a vis the number of Victims to "Hazing" every year?
 
#19
jonwilly said:
Naughty BOY Sergey
remove trousers go bend over in corner of room, brace up and await boarding party.
john
Yes Jolly Jacks cumming ta town.
Hi Jonwilly! How many bottles of vodka should I prepare? 3 or 4 per bloke from boarding party?
 
#20
DrStealth said:
some rules i find help me when i'm reading politics or political opinion -

read everything, even if it upsets you.
Yes, it's right.
 
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