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Demise of the city centre

I find it strange that both Landlords and Councils cannot work out that:

a, Occupancy at a lower rate still equals income
b, Empty properties do not bring in income.
 
I do wonder how many of the smaller operations over on the continent survive. If anyone knows how the business model is different, it would be useful to know.
I can only speak about Italy, and only on a few occasions. I only saw one recognisable supermarket and that was a Spar. Do the Tallies keep the big boys out, limit where they go, or do they have others using local names? Mind you, most of our time was in rural areas, perhaps it's different in the big cities.
 

Cold_Collation

LE
Book Reviewer
I can only speak about Italy, and only on a few occasions. I only saw one recognisable supermarket and that was a Spar. Do the Tallies keep the big boys out, limit where they go, or do they have others using local names? Mind you, most of our time was in rural areas, perhaps it's different in the big cities.
Size matters - or dominates.

A quick Google tells me that the UK Big Four - Tesco, Sainsbury, Asda and Morrisons - take 70+ percent of the UK grocery market (and they now sell a lot more besides groceries).

The two main supermarket chains in Italy, Coop and Conrad, take about 25 percent (but bear in mind that there are other chains present in the market).

A problem is that every time you see a new development go up, the automatic solution seems to be such as a Tesco Local. Okay, they have the distribution networks and so on but what's wrong with there being a smaller independent (actually, probably lots from a risk and profitability POV)?
 

Cold_Collation

LE
Book Reviewer
I find it strange that both Landlords and Councils cannot work out that:

a, Occupancy at a lower rate still equals income
b, Empty properties do not bring in income.
My old local in Crawley used to have a hard core of regulars - good payers, who drank regularly and were no trouble.

In came the pub company man who said that this many square metres this close to the town centre should be earning 'X'.

A tidy but steady earner was suddenly 'under-performing'.

With change came an exodus of the regulars. You can guess the rest.
 
Size matters - or dominates.

A quick Google tells me that the UK Big Four - Tesco, Sainsbury, Asda and Morrisons - take 70+ percent of the UK grocery market (and they now sell a lot more besides groceries).

The two main supermarket chains in Italy, Coop and Conrad, take about 25 percent (but bear in mind that there are other chains present in the market).

A problem is that every time you see a new development go up, the automatic solution seems to be such as a Tesco Local. Okay, they have the distribution networks and so on but what's wrong with there being a smaller independent (actually, probably lots from a risk and profitability POV)?
This goes back to planning applications, and councils either getting hefty incentives to allow it. For example, the old Crocus pub is now a Tesco Extra, 400 yards away in either direction there are small independent shops. Now why allow that to happen when we already have a Waitrose, Large Tesco, an Aldi and a B&M store. Foe SW that is too much, especially for the smaller shops to compete with.
 

Cold_Collation

LE
Book Reviewer
This goes back to planning applications, and councils either getting hefty incentives to allow it. For example, the old Crocus pub is now a Tesco Extra, 400 yards away in either direction there are small independent shops. Now why allow that to happen when we already have a Waitrose, Large Tesco, an Aldi and a B&M store. Foe SW that is too much, especially for the smaller shops to compete with.
Yep. And it needs to be gripped.

Remind me - 'incentives'? Some of the less flattering synonyms apply.
 
I find it strange that both Landlords and Councils cannot work out that:

a, Occupancy at a lower rate still equals income
b, Empty properties do not bring in income.

In my experience, councils tend to be parochial, short sighted and greedy, as well as being a generation behind in their thinking.

What I do think though is that we will not go back to the way we were, even in the big town centres. There will be a sharp decline in the demand for business accommodation and the support/transport services that go with it, as more and more of the white collar industry remains working from home. By contrast, local demand is likely to rise, especially in secure and attractive areas. The rapid move to electric vehicles (and the commensurate cost of commuting over distance until the technology improves) will accelerate the localising trend.

Is this all bad? Of course not. From all this will arise the next generation of Bezos/Gates figures, who will identify the changing big picture whilst the rest of us scratch our heads, and modify our world to exploit it and enrich themselves...
 

Daz

LE
In my experience, councils tend to be parochial, short sighted and greedy, as well as being a generation behind in their thinking.

What I do think though is that we will not go back to the way we were, even in the big town centres. There will be a sharp decline in the demand for business accommodation and the support/transport services that go with it, as more and more of the white collar industry remains working from home. By contrast, local demand is likely to rise, especially in secure and attractive areas. The rapid move to electric vehicles (and the commensurate cost of commuting over distance until the technology improves) will accelerate the localising trend.

Is this all bad? Of course not. From all this will arise the next generation of Bezos/Gates figures, who will identify the changing big picture whilst the rest of us scratch our heads, and modify our world to exploit it and enrich themselves...
That's Bridgend council in a nutshell, a few years back they announced they were closing Sandy Bay Caravan Park and selling the land (reclaimed sand dunes) off for combined retail & housing development with the proceeds going to "deprived" areas in the area - as long as said areas voted the "correct" way, unlike the town where the caravan part was located. Despite the outcries by those affected, the council sent out eviction letters to the caravan owners, swiftly followed by the bulldozers to demolish everything that had not been removed from the site in time.

And that's when the scheme fell apart as it transpires that Bridgend County Borough Council was not the owner of the land, but it was in fact owned by the town council, now the town council was willing to cut a deal with Bridgend County Borough Council, they would get the bulk of the proceeds from the sale, less the cost of a small leisure centre for the town - not a bad deal on the face of it, Bridgend County Borough Council, however, rejected that, hence to this day, the area is still a wasteland slowly being reclaimed by the dunes.

A classic example of a council being parochial, short-sighted and greedy and ultimately losing out.
 

Inspectors here trying sneaky tricks to close pubs down. Lets hope when this is over, the snitches receive a lifetime ban from all licensed premises UK-wide. For their own good, as nobody will want to socialize with such back-stabbing rats, anyway. For any social interaction, their best bet is to join a strict religious order, where alcohol is taboo.
 
Can’t imagine there’s much long term future in selling paper stuff out of a shop. It’s another thing headed online that Covid will have accelerated.

I can’t remember the last time I read a newspaper, let alone bought one. Magazines? Why buy when you can get the headline content online free. Books? Isn’t that what Amazon is for. Top shelf; a dead hamster.

Twenty years ago, I guess I bought a paper every day, a couple of magazines a week and at least one book a month. I’ve got a month to buy my first of any of those in 2020.

I still buy books. I like the tactility of them.

Papers and magazines? Not for years. Probably the last one I brought was a Private Eye. Again? That's not happening soon.
 

Inspectors here trying sneaky tricks to close pubs down. Lets hope when this is over, the snitches receive a lifetime ban from all licensed premises UK-wide. For their own good, as nobody will want to socialize with such back-stabbing rats, anyway. For any social interaction, their best bet is to join a strict religious order, where alcohol is taboo.
I fail to see what "profit" there is in it for these people to carry out these set ups, bar perhaps below the line "plans" for the property development as yet to be laid bare. Just does not make any sense.
 

Mölders 1

Old-Salt
That's Bridgend council in a nutshell, a few years back they announced they were closing Sandy Bay Caravan Park and selling the land (reclaimed sand dunes) off for combined retail & housing development with the proceeds going to "deprived" areas in the area - as long as said areas voted the "correct" way, unlike the town where the caravan part was located. Despite the outcries by those affected, the council sent out eviction letters to the caravan owners, swiftly followed by the bulldozers to demolish everything that had not been removed from the site in time.

And that's when the scheme fell apart as it transpires that Bridgend County Borough Council was not the owner of the land, but it was in fact owned by the town council, now the town council was willing to cut a deal with Bridgend County Borough Council, they would get the bulk of the proceeds from the sale, less the cost of a small leisure centre for the town - not a bad deal on the face of it, Bridgend County Borough Council, however, rejected that, hence to this day, the area is still a wasteland slowly being reclaimed by the dunes.

A classic example of a council being parochial, short-sighted and greedy and ultimately losing out.
News Flash......Happy Valley Caravan Park has been sold to Property Developers. More Houses and fewer shops in Porthcawl/Bridgend again.
 
This goes back to planning applications, and councils either getting hefty incentives to allow it. For example, the old Crocus pub is now a Tesco Extra, 400 yards away in either direction there are small independent shops. Now why allow that to happen when we already have a Waitrose, Large Tesco, an Aldi and a B&M store. Foe SW that is too much, especially for the smaller shops to compete with.
Yep. Section 106 has a lot to answer for.
 

Daz

LE
News Flash......Happy Valley Caravan Park has been sold to Property Developers. More Houses and fewer shops in Porthcawl/Bridgend again.
There's bugger all shops in (un)Happy Valley
 

goodoldboy

MIA
Book Reviewer
The knock on of high property prices is higher wages. And the council demands business rates whatever your turnover and margin.

Plenty more like that over the previous 17 pages.
That's not what I meant mate.

Are business rates set by central Government and local councils just collect them? I genuinely don't know...
 

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