David Kelly evidence released

Discussion in 'Current Affairs, News and Analysis' started by Snoreador, Oct 22, 2010.

Welcome to the Army Rumour Service, ARRSE

The UK's largest and busiest UNofficial military website.

The heart of the site is the forum area, including:

  1. Post-mortem report seems reasonable but why hide it?
  2. All points to suicide to me......but I'm not a doctor.
  3. Precisely, and as Lord Hutton says that this report was available to the public throughout the inquiry it is doubly mystifying as to the reasons for the secrecy, and the duration of its secrecy.

    Im pretty sure this will not do anything to lessen the doubts over his untimely death, until there is a full and proper inquest.
  4. Must be something missing and it'll be something beginning with Blair
  5. The official story is that he didn't want this being bandied around in the press for the next 70 years over and over again and being a constant reminder to the family of the details of Dr. Kelly's death.

    So he had cut wounds to his wrist, of the direction and pattern to indicate suicide. He had taken a load of co-proxamol. He had gone to a quiety pretty spot in the woods. He had removed his own glasses and watch to prepare himself. He was also under immense immense (unfair) public pressure and scrutiny because of the briefings against him.

    Still, a copper said he didn't see much blood. So, it must have been foul play then.

    I do wonder what Michael Powers pay off is in all this? I wonder what his personal agenda is?
  6. Im pretty certain that had a full and proper inquest taken place at the time, this matter would have been brought to a close years ago, thus not becoming an issue which is being picked over and over again. Neither you nor me were present at the scene, so we can only go by the statements of the witnesses who were, and if there are questions about the findings of the inquiry, these will be answered only by having a FULL AND PROPER INQUEST.

    I dont believe there are any personal agenda involved in this, simply people trying to find the truth of the matter. The handling of this investigation by the last government left a number of questions open, not least of which was Lord Falconer's decision to dispense with the coroners inquest. Hutton added to the clamour for this to be re-opened by the lengthy time by which the post-mortem and other details would be kept secret.
  7. Oh wow. Can I come and live in your head? The world must be a much lovelier place there.

    Everybody has an agenda.

    Everybody sees it how they want.

    Everybody lies.

    Personally, I think that a huge number of mistakes were made with the handling of the whole sorry bloody drama. But I think these came from a government that had become so desperate to control every item of media exposure that they disappeared up their own arrse. And I think this particular incident shows this.

    But I also think that generally now we know the truth of the matter. Dr. Kelly was hounded and had his reputation and integrity besmirched by the vicious labour party press machine. He folded and killed himself. The labour party then made a hash of things trying to control the media. I am not sure that having an inquest now is really going to change any of those things being true. What questions remain outstanding? I mean questions that would really, really make a difference?
  8. People with greater knowledge and understanding of medical facts are unhappy (and still remain unconvinced by the post mortem), I am no doctor or pathologist, neither are you, however a number of the medical profession, and witnesses to the scene remain sceptical of the suicide verdict (a verdict that was not reached in a coroner's court), for that reason alone, this needs to be fully investigated and a full and proper coroner's inquest held.

    If the government have nothing to hide, whats the problem?
  9. Working backwards,

    I don't think the government have anything to hide. I think the previous leaders and press office of the Labour Party may have something to hide.

    I think they were trying to hide the fact that they hounded a man to death and were guilty of trying to manipulate the media.

    I actually agree that in the first instance this should have been a coroners inquest. But it wasn't and I don't believe that would help now.

    Those that remain sceptical are a couple of first responders, a copper and I think a group of (I am being too lazy to look it up) about 7 doctors? Man, on any given day you could probably go out and find 7 doctors who believe in the tooth fairy, smoking is good for you and that Roy Hodgson is a decent manager.

    Again, my original challenge stands, what questions would a new investigation ANSWER that haven't already been asked and answered? The doctors who disagree with the findings of suicide know the evidence, they just don't agree with the interpretation. Nothing is going to change that. So, you have to wonder, why are they so wedded to an alternative ending? And what alternative ending do they see?

    I am paraphrasing here I think, but do you know what makes a good conspiracy theory? One that can never be proven.
  10. 59kg and his heart weighed 412gm? That's just over a 100gm more than i'd expect.
  11. Personally it makes no difference to me either way, Dr Kelly will not be brought back whichever way things go, however the responders and some medical opinion are justifiably concerned that they did not see evidence that would have led them to come up to a clear opinion of suicide. If there are any doubts in professional or medical opinion, or in the minds of those who attended the scene, it justifies investigation, if only to put this matter to bed once and for all. Like I said earlier, if this had been handled correctly throughout these questions and doubts would have never arisen. This farce has only led to more hurt for the family of Dr Kelly, not less.
  12. The PM seems to be fairly straightforward. However without an inquest, which is being advised by at least one other eminent Pathologist, how many of the public will be wondering whether a suicide where a very heavy dose of analgesic and a slashed wrist were involved, was beyond the capabilities of a professional 'body' to fake that same suicide? If not beyond the said capability, why expect the PM to appear other than straightforward?
  13. It just doesn't add up why an educated man would kill himself in this fashion and I do find the size of that heart most odd.
  14. Indeed. And in terms of hurt to his family, do you think the constant throwing around of wild conspiracy theories and keeping this story running is, from their point of view, a positive thing or a negative thing?

    The Govt. of the day cocked up how it handled it. But this is now being kept at the top of the news agenda to give people a chance to give them a kicking, irrespective of how that impacts on this mans family.