Date-rape drugs not widespread

#1
BBC news link

A discussion ongoing on Radio 2 at the moment.

119 out of 120 alleged victims said they had been drinking.

10 were suspected drug-assisted assaults - but none were linked to the date-rape drug Rohypnol

I know this can be a touchy subject but the findings do indicate that it appears most cases appear to be from someone who has drunk too much in addition to almost 50% having taken prescribed or recreational drugs as well. In these cases an individual may prefer to say they have been drugged involuntarily than got so drunk that they don't know what has been going on.

I await incoming.
 
#2
You speak absolute sense.

For a while I have been cynical regarding rohypnol use, surely it's far easier for a potential 'date-rapist' to stick a treble in 'already slightly tipsy girl's' alcopop rather than source rohypnol, and risk being seen slipping pills into a drink.

Lasses need to be more aware of their limitations to avoid the risk of this kind of thing.
 
#3
I think Rohypnol has just been used as an excuse as after consuming nineteen pints of Newcastle Brown, popping Granny's hormone tablets and something they bought off some bloke in the bar, it is ALL too easy to say they've been date raped as by the time they can speak without slurring, the Rohypnol is out of the system.

The effects of the Newcastle Brown however last far longer, particularly noticeable to those who have to use the same toilet.
 
#4
This was reported on Radio 4's Today this morning, and featured a ridiculous American woman who represents Wimmin Against Rape (and lots of other things too, probably), who thought the report 'unhelpful, because it gives the impression that if a woman has a drink she's asking to be raped'. What arrant nonsense. Can these morons not see that a woman who consumes vast quantities of alcohol is increasing her vulnerability to all sorts of things, from spilling kebab sauce on her shoes, to being knocked over on the road, to engaging in sexual activity she later regrets as well as rape.

I don't imagine anyone is unsympathetic towards rape victims, but it remains fact that there are women who make false allegations, and that drunk and/or drugged women may not be fully in control of themselves, nor do they make the most reliable witnesses.
 
#5
It became a moral panic after it was suspected to have been used by Essex serial rapist Richard Baker and an alert went out to "assume" that any intoxicated female complaining of rape or sexual assualt might have been drugged and to test for Rohypnol.

So if you have to keep looking for something general assumption is it must be there. Bit like WMD in Iraq, really.

But as far back as 1997 studies have been showing that genuine drug induced rapes are rare in both the US and the UK.
 
#6
ViroBono said:
This was reported on Radio 4's Today this morning, and featured a ridiculous American woman who represents Wimmin Against Rape (and lots of other things too, probably), who thought the report 'unhelpful, because it gives the impression that if a woman has a drink she's asking to be raped'. What arrant nonsense. Can these morons not see that a woman who consumes vast quantities of alcohol is increasing her vulnerability to all sorts of things, from spilling kebab sauce on her shoes, to being knocked over on the road, to engaging in sexual activity she later regrets as well as rape.

I don't imagine anyone is unsympathetic towards rape victims, but it remains fact that there are women who make false allegations, and that drunk and/or drugged women may not be fully in control of themselves, nor do they make the most reliable witnesses.
Hoorah! And trebles all round! (Except for you women folk of course).
 
#7
I wouldn't know Rohypnol if it fell in my drink.

And I bet it doesn't make women look more attractive.

I'll stick with the meths and avtur.
 
#8
Complete f&*king minefield of a subject to debate just waste your breath and raise your blood pressure. There are so many factors no-one will be right and no-one will be wrong. This will make the Deepcut thread look like rational and reasoned debate.

Anyway my tuppence worth.

My house was also listening to said article on R4 this morning I was in lounge and wife was in Kitchen. when the woman was announced as a rep of 'Women Against Rape' which caused my wife to shout in derision "So is there is another group representing women in favour of rape?"

As for the old drugged drink excuse I was in Hong Kong years ago and it was the urban myth spounted by the US Navy who couldn't take the fact that their blokes could't hold their drink. Brits on the other hand also couldn't hold their drink, but accepted that they were put in jail because they were drunk and stupid.
 
#9
The two key points here which have been lost in all the noise, even in this Telegraph article, are those that have been picked up separately by VB and Cowshed.

1: Voluntary consumption of alcohol and other drugs increases your chances of becoming a victim of crime; any crime, whether you are a man or a woman.

2: Using alcohol to effect a rape is use of a drug, in exactly the same way as using Rohypnol or GBH.

Sadly, there are too many dinosaurs out there who might baulk at using sedatives to achieve the same effect but think that it's good sport to shag a drunk girl, whether or not they have taken part in getting her that way. This is, I think, what the Wimmin Against Rape were trying to say, but ended up attacking the authors of the report, not the perpetrators of the deeds.
 
#10
B_D_S I agree but there is a world of difference between:

1) a sexual predator spiking a girls drink with a drug that would not be noticed and would enable him to carry out a sexual assault or rape.

and

2) a bloke on the pi$$ and on the prowl who chats up somebody ends up buying them drinks, she gets drunk (knowing full well that she is getting drunk), they consensually end up in bed. She decides that she's been foolish and decides that instead of saying that she got blind drunk and did something stupid (the same could be said for the bloke), she says that her drink was spiked and therefore removes any responsibility for her own actions.

I know that there is no excuse for any rape but the responsibility for one's own actions still remain. I know its not a very good comparison but imagine the same girl lets someone buy drinks for her all night and then gets in a car blind drunk - she is still responsible for her actions if she knocks someone down whilst drink driving!
 
#11
I dealt with around 15 Rapes when I was serving, 3 turned out to be genuine, the rest were either malicious or women who were to embarassed to admit they made a mistake. This subject realy p*sses me off and I think anyone who does make a false allergation should get prosecuted as this completley recks a persons life when they are subject to a false complaint.
 
#12
western said:
As for the old drugged drink excuse I was in Hong Kong years ago and it was the urban myth spounted by the US Navy who couldn't take the fact that their blokes could't hold their drink. Brits on the other hand also couldn't hold their drink, but accepted that they were put in jail because they were drunk and stupid.
Ah! Was that before or after the trick of freezing vodka? Yanks like their drinks well iced.
 
#13
Horridlittleman said:
B_D_S I agree but there is a world of difference between:

1) a sexual predator spiking a girls drink with a drug that would not be noticed and would enable him to carry out a sexual assault or rape.

and

2) a bloke on the pi$$ and on the prowl who chats up somebody ends up buying them drinks, she gets drunk (knowing full well that she is getting drunk), they consensually end up in bed. She decides that she's been foolish and decides that instead of saying that she got blind drunk and did something stupid (the same could be said for the bloke), she says that her drink was spiked and therefore removes any responsibility for her own actions.
Very true, in which case the bloke on the piss becomes the victim of the crime of false allegation or defamation, i.e. posit 1: "Voluntary consumption of alcohol and other drugs increases your chances of becoming a victim of crime; any crime, whether you are a man or a woman". The crime of false allegation can have as far-reaching personal and psychological consequences for the victim as an actual rape can for its victim. That will be a contentious point for many but is valid nonetheless. There is then also the defence of "I was drunk and not aware of my actions", or even "I was drunk and therefore physically incapable". As has been said before, it's a minefield, and alcohol (or other mind-altering drugs not permitted in the Army) can make fools of us all.
 
#14
OldRedCap said:
Ah! Was that before or after the trick of freezing vodka? Yanks like their drinks well iced.
I wish someone had pulled that one on me. I used to think I was a real drinker downing 20 or so Bacardis a night until a bar manager explained the rip off of pouring a glass of coke wiped around the rim with rum. Went back to beers and was hammered on the usual pitifully small quantity and saved a fortune
 
#15
A mate of mine is convinced he was the victim of a date-rape incident. We haven't the heart to tell him what actually happened because it's such a wheeze winding him up about it...

SO1 arrives early at Christmas party, gets completely spannered and about 2130 falls down unconscious at hotel bar. 3 mates carry him off to his room, strip him naked, fill a condom with ice and place it gently between the cheeks of his arrse.

Next morning he wakes up to find soggy condom, a large wet patch and a very numb botty! It took 3 months before he actually told me his worst fears, my how we're still laughing Tee Hee!
 
#16
Only a bloke could come up with such an idiotic thread.

Am I correct in assuming that you consider every rape victim who has had a drink when the event occured, to be lying or deserving of rape?

What complete and utter rubbish.

Let me inform you of a few things;

Rape is difficult to prove, as most peoples idea of rape is a complete stranger dragging their victim down some dark alley and then leaving them for dead.

In most cases, rape is carried out by someone who is known to the victim

AND

Something like just 1 in 20 rape cases are even reported - because even the CPS have to feel they have over a 51% chance of getting a conviction. If the victim is considered to have a 50% chance, it doesnt even get to court.

Forensic evidence is useless in court if the accused simply says sex was consensual, leaving the victim the one who needs to defend herself.

Most victims look at the massive uphill struggle they will have to endure and hide away without pressing charges. The courage it takes for those that do go to the police is immense and pratts like you lot make me sick.

Quite frankly, to make assumptions that most rape cases are from women who regret drunken sex is ridiculous and insulting.

I do hope you never get butt fcuked after a night on the pop - hey, some may think you deserve it, eh lads.
 
#17
Moodybitch said:
Only a bloke could come up with such an idiotic thread.

Am I correct in assuming that you consider every rape victim who has had a drink when the event occured, to be lying or deserving of rape?

What complete and utter rubbish.

Let me inform you of a few things;

Rape is difficult to prove, as most peoples idea of rape is a complete stranger dragging their victim down some dark alley and then leaving them for dead.

In most cases, rape is carried out by someone who is known to the victim

AND

Something like just 1 in 20 rape cases are even reported - because even the CPS have to feel they have over a 51% chance of getting a conviction. If the victim is considered to have a 50% chance, it doesnt even get to court.

Forensic evidence is useless in court if the accused simply says sex was consensual, leaving the victim the one who needs to defend herself.

Most victims look at the massive uphill struggle they will have to endure and hide away without pressing charges. The courage it takes for those that do go to the police is immense and pratts like you lot make me sick.

Quite frankly, to make assumptions that most rape cases are from women who regret drunken sex is ridiculous and insulting.

I do hope you never get butt fcuked after a night on the pop - hey, some may think you deserve it, eh lads.
Cant remember seeing anyone saying that that people are lying, perhaps you need to take a chill pill before going off on one, my comments were based on 7 years experience as a Police Officer, yours?

Here are some facts that I learnt during that time:

FACT: Some women use rape as acover for their own embarassing exploits.

FACT: False allergations only reinforce the negative assumptions about victims.

FACT: Some women just do not remember so just cry rape.

FACT: Victims of false or malicious complaints often have their lives wrecked, loosing their jobs, famaily and friends due to the backward thinking there is no smoke without fire.

Yes Rape is one of the worst crimes a person can commit against another, but there should be strong action taken against those who make false or malicious allergations.

I may have missed it, but who said:
Quite frankly, to make assumptions that most rape cases are from women who regret drunken sex is ridiculous and insulting.
Who said this? and yes I have dealt with male Rape cases as well.
 
#18
ViroBono said:
This was reported on Radio 4's Today this morning, and featured a ridiculous American woman who represents Wimmin Against Rape (and lots of other things too, probably), who thought the report 'unhelpful, because it gives the impression that if a woman has a drink she's asking to be raped'. What arrant nonsense.
She pissed me off....spitting cornflakes over the radio.

"What can I get you sir"?
"Viagra for me, rohypnol for the lady please".

(er...that's a joke the last bit)
 
#19
Agreed, strong actions should be taken against those who make false allegations, but to assume that because a victim has had a drink that they must somehow be lying is quite frankly pathetic.
 

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