Cyclohexanone and tetrachlorethylene

Discussion in 'The Intelligence Cell' started by knockknee, Sep 29, 2008.

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  1. I have no knowledge of this area. If someone with expertise could PM me I would be grateful.

    I have received a reply to an FOI request of Thanet District Council in which they confirm a chemical spillage (threat to water table) incident at a local company. The problem was historical and reported in the early to mid 90s.

    Treading carefully the FOI request has been forwarded by the Council to the Environment Agency who I hope can answer from their inquiries of the time how much chemical went to ground. I gather that the suspicion was that the leak was cover for theft of a volume of the chemical.

    This the council tells me was Cyclohexanone.

    We already know that an associate of the suspect had a quantity (twenty to thirty gallons) of tetrachlorethylene.

    The suspect was it seems given severance in 1998 when inquiry allagedly found his engineering qualifications (to be senior site fire safety officer) were forgeries.

    In 1988 an associate of his gained work with Reliance Security at Deal Royal Marines Barracks. It appears that he cleared vetting with a similarly doubtful set of REME Records.

    This associate featured in our breach of security warnings in 89 to Kent Police.

    My mate in his statement stated that he had been approached as a Betteshanger Colliery worker about obtaining mining explosives and dets.

    One of these men founded the British Army Association. With it seems a man who was a member of the IRA supportive right wing group League of Saint George.

    Whether Walt or not ? How good an idea would it be for them to have the above named chemicals ? Given that their other mate has a degree in chemistry.

    I have emailed the Kent Chief constable.

    But chemistry and explosives I know nothing about. I gather that one chemical can be used to make drug pusher drugs and the other can make pipe bomb filler. And the first is explosive with nitric acid. So it does not sound like an awfully good idea that Kent Police failed to investigate this in the months before 11 Royal Marines lost their lives at Deal Barracks. And it certainly does not look good that at the very least Kent Police did not tell the Marines you have walts guarding you which is worse than no security at all ?

    Kent Police had information in 88 that the man's engineering qualifications were forgeries. They left him in place at a chemical company as chief site fire safety maintenance engineer for ten years. During which cyclohexanone appears to have gone walkie.
  2. My wife, who is pharmacist and with background in chemistry, told me that neither of those chemicals are really useful for making bombs etc. Both are quite toxic but just basic industrial chemicals.
  3. Is this not a scene from dragnet?

    I can´t even pronounce those words, so they must be bad....
  4. The second ones a cleaner/degreaser, will probably be harmful if heated and you inhale the vapours and will also be flammable, but apart from that i doubt it's got anything to worry about and will be about as dangerous as trike (trichloerethane if i got the correct spelling), the first one i haven't a clue what that stuff is.
  5. One is cleaner, other is commonly used in making nylon.
  6. General Melchett

    General Melchett LE Moderator

    They might have been going into the dry cleaning business?

    Were you thinking of Trichloroethylene? That's different to tetra.

    Cyclohexanone is a solvent and can be used in oxidation.

    I don't think either would be used to manufacture explosives. Just nasty chemical solvents.

    Maybe you are thinking of cyclotrimethylene trinitramine ie PE 4.
  7. TheIronDuke

    TheIronDuke LE Book Reviewer

    Flixborough back in the 70's. Lax protocols, big air effect bang, many dead.
  8. cyclohexanone: Reacts with strong oxidants such as nitric acid causing fire and explosion hazard.


    tetrachlorethylene: illicit drug manufacture, could be used as an accelerant/catalyst

    Best bet is to pass this on to others better equipped and having the authority to deal with this
  9. That was caused by cyclohexane (C6H12). Cyclohexanone is different stuff (C6H10O), it's not even listed as risk to be flammable.
  10. How odd! I am currently sat on the very same site in Flixborough! Still a sh!t heap.....
  11. Thanks for the comments I emailed Kent Police Authority (who are dealing with these matters at present) with a Tet bomb recipe I found on web in a Terrorist cookbook type site. So I have found that Tetrachlorethylene is an IED substance. (two parts aluminium to one part tetra)

    The other one I found is explosive on contact with nitric acid (as above thanks) but a little on it being used in IEDs with hydrogen peroxide and nitric acid.

    I am in touch with authority over this.

    I am treading carefully. What I am seeking to do is get Environment Agency to state a volume they measured or calculated to have gone to chalk strata and the volume the company records shew as missing. If there is a discrepancy between the two figures that would represent a guide as to the amount nicked.

    I am also interested in the cyclohexanone electrical characteristics. I have figures for conductivity and so I can at some point get the calculator out and do some calculations.

    Kent Police Authority clerk is drawing up a report going back over twenty years to include the 1989 bombing of Deal Royal Marines barracks.

    I have just got this information from FOI requests to add to his woes.

    On the electrical sabotage aspects I am pleased to say that the Police Authority member sitting on their Standards Board is a Brigadier, ex NI Office civil servant and Chartered Engineer who is also KPA Special Branch liaison (this is all on KPA website). So I welcome that as it enabled me to go into the meths of the sabotage technqiues in the hope someone reading it has the engineering background to understand.

    On the explosives and chemistry I have no knowledge. So all I could do is feed in what I am finding out but also to try to get some idea from those with the expertise so I can keep a a more informed eye on what Plod are doing.

    Basically Kent Police provided Bob Ayling for the Stephen Lawrence Inquiry. Now he is retired and investigating for the Rosemary Nelson Inquiry. His buddy Sir David Phillips was sent off to supervise the Rosemary Nelson murder case. (But soon came home). And this is the sort of sh-t they failed to investigate in Kent.

    So whereas I support the rights to justice of Stephen Lawrence and Rosemary Nelson I want to see equal rights accorded to 11 murdered Royal Marines.

    Thanks for your answers. I am off doing captions again on NAAFI now. Any further PMs gratefully received.
  12. Sounds like you're making some progress, good luck with this
  13. TheIronDuke

    TheIronDuke LE Book Reviewer

    Sorry. I just got past the first three syllables and assumed it was the same stuff.

    So, I kinda know what drug cyclohexanone might be used to manufacture, but tetrachlorethylene is a new one on me in this context. Just idle curiosity. Feel free to PM me rather than post it?

    As for cyclohexa(whatever) being an accelerant when mixed with flaked ally? So are many things more readily available.

    Maybe your Muppets just wanted to do their dry cleaning on the cheap?