Cycle to work

#1
remember signing this petition ages ago.... here's the responce:

Details of Petition:


“At present, UK military personnel are being disadvantaged by not being able to be part of the Cycle To Work Scheme. MOD personnel are actively encouraged to take part in this scheme but this does not cover military personnel. Military personnel are expected to keep up high levels of fitness and one way of doing so is by cycling. Many military Units have limited car parking spaces and Commanders are encouraging personnel to cycle to work. Active participation for military personnel within this Cycle To Work Scheme would enhance personal fitness, cut down on emmissions and reduce traffic activity.”


Read the Government’s response
Thank you for taking the time to create an e-petition on the participation of UK military personnel in the Cycle to Work scheme.

The Ministry of Defence (MoD) is committed to promoting healthier lifestyles and reducing pollution wherever possible, and, although the MoD does not participate in the Cycle to Work scheme, it encourages greater cycle use with similar schemes.

The MoD operates two schemes to promote bicycle usage: one for Service personnel and one for Civilian staff. Eligible Service personnel can claim a non-taxable benefit in the form of ‘Home to Duty Travel allowance (Pedal Cycle)’ which reimburses them for commuting to work on bicycles. The allowance is paid at a daily rate based upon the distance cycled. An internal review has suggested that this allowance is already more advantageous than the likely benefits available under the C2W scheme.

MoD Civilians can apply for interest free loans of up to £1000 to enable them to purchase bicycles. The MoD continues to keep these policies under regular review.

So generous 8O
 
#2
sounds like a winner. TBH the C2W scheme is the dogs for small/medium companies (and should be heartily promoted) unfortunately with anythng bigger you start to get into credit schemes, tendering regulations etc and it gets complicated. Better to push for storage solutions, showers and such.
The alternative you're being offered-how much per mile?
 
#3
If I had my way people should have to pay to bring their bikes to work. They are a total hazard on the roads and then when they get to work they moan like hell about there not being enough space to park their precious bike or not enough 'things' to padlock them to

Tax the damn things I say why should the lefty lentil munching cyclists get away with contributing nothing. Tax the bike and charge them for parking it.

And those lycra shorts, so last decade......................
 
#4
Billy Ruffian said:
sounds like a winner. TBH the C2W scheme is the dogs for small/medium companies (and should be heartily promoted) unfortunately with anythng bigger you start to get into credit schemes, tendering regulations etc and it gets complicated.
the NHS, councils, LEAs, all seem to manage ok?

i've been around this buoy a few times - the official answer is a complete and utter cop-out which in reality = all a bit difficult so we won't be doing it.

the HDT rate is about 8p a mile or something punative - personally i'd rather have a brand new bike for half of the RRP price than claim my 30p a day, £1.50 a week, £50 a year.

A £1000 bike would cost around £500 under the scheme, so that's around 10yrs of commuting to just break even!!!
 
#5
VeryExMedic said:
If I had my way people should have to pay to bring their bikes to work. They are a total hazard on the roads and then when they get to work they moan like hell about there not being enough space to park their precious bike or not enough 'things' to padlock them to

Tax the damn things I say why should the lefty lentil munching cyclists get away with contributing nothing. Tax the bike and charge them for parking it.

And those lycra shorts, so last decade......................
shut it fatty...

the position of unit sports prevention officer is already filled in our unit....don't need your input too
 
#6
8p amile?!! Barely enough to buy a can of 3-in-1 over a year.

Dan, you're dead on. It is a bollocks way of fobbing people off. Properly thought out, there is no reason public bodies like the MOD/police/Civil Service cant get it together. It does'nt take much, the paperwork is dead simple once its set up and everybody wins. You get a half price bike, the company saves at least 200 quid. As we say in Egypt, you can't asay Pharoe than that.

But the how can such a pro-car state be seen to subsidise cycle use?
 
#7
Danny_Dravot said:
VeryExMedic said:
If I had my way people should have to pay to bring their bikes to work. They are a total hazard on the roads and then when they get to work they moan like hell about there not being enough space to park their precious bike or not enough 'things' to padlock them to

Tax the damn things I say why should the lefty lentil munching cyclists get away with contributing nothing. Tax the bike and charge them for parking it.

And those lycra shorts, so last decade......................
shut it fatty...

the position of unit sports prevention officer is already filled in our unit....don't need your input too
I hope your not taking too much on Danny?!
 
#8
Danny_Dravot said:
Billy Ruffian said:
sounds like a winner. TBH the C2W scheme is the dogs for small/medium companies (and should be heartily promoted) unfortunately with anythng bigger you start to get into credit schemes, tendering regulations etc and it gets complicated.
the NHS, councils, LEAs, all seem to manage ok?

i've been around this buoy a few times - the official answer is a complete and utter cop-out which in reality = all a bit difficult so we won't be doing it.

the HDT rate is about 8p a mile or something punative - personally i'd rather have a brand new bike for half of the RRP price than claim my 30p a day, £1.50 a week, £50 a year.

A £1000 bike would cost around £500 under the scheme, so that's around 10yrs of commuting to just break even!!!
i got the bike & bits for £575ish a few months back
get £42 took from wages
but after the tax/NI breaks the employer gets
i only feel £25 a month loss

i've been told that once the 12moniths is up
for a final months payment i get to keep the lot

so it'll have cost me around £325 for a £250 saving
sweet 8)
 
#10
Danny_Dravot said:
VeryExMedic said:
If I had my way people should have to pay to bring their bikes to work. They are a total hazard on the roads and then when they get to work they moan like hell about there not being enough space to park their precious bike or not enough 'things' to padlock them to

Tax the damn things I say why should the lefty lentil munching cyclists get away with contributing nothing. Tax the bike and charge them for parking it.

And those lycra shorts, so last decade......................
shut it fatty...

the position of unit sports prevention officer is already filled in our unit....don't need your input too

As it happens I do use a bike occassionally but I don't feel the need to become a pious twaat when I do. I also don't expect to be treated as 'special' when I use it.
For large numbers of people the car is the only practical means of transport especially in rural areas. I travel 19 miles to work and I go to work 2 hours before the first bus and finish about an hour after the last one home. No choice.

Those who can use bikes by all means carry on but don't expect society to pay for you to do it.
 
#11
It takes either 30 mins in a car (Central Brum) or 15 mins peddlin. I'm usually cut up on my journey at least once a day. Over taken followed by a swift left turn infront of my path, next minute I'm over taking them again because they're stuck in traffic. No*bers!
The gov needs to promote cycles as much as poss, especially in the cities by using both saftey and purchasing schemes. What a joke 8p per mile. I heard that it was just to complicated for JPA????

Agree with the shower coment. Where I work there's no shower facilities because it's rented offices. Work with about 30 other personnel from different services. Thank god there's Lynx!
 
#12
A fairly simple and straightforward approach could be to get rid of the cycle rate of hdt and just pay the car rate.
In a previous posting i used to cycle to work and am probably one of the few people to have claimed the cycle rate. It probably paid for a tyre over 2 years!
 
#13
Sometimes cycle, sometimes drive. Looked into this a couple of years back and made two discoveries.......

1. You have to declare that you are are driving or cycling, there is no mechanism for claiming for each method on seperate days. This leaves the individual effectively making a false claim as he cycles when in receipt of motor allowance or vice versa.

2. HDT requires a contribution to be made (9 miles?) before the individual gets any cash. A 9 mile cycle into work is about 35 mins, not a small undertaking and for no financial return. Incentive=nil.
 
#14
IIRC:

HDT traveling from forces accommodation (SLA/SFA/SSFA) requires a 1 mile personal contribution as it is what is reasonable to expect someone to travel to work.

HDT traveling from private accommodation requires the 9 miles as it is your own choice to live there.
 
#15
VeryExMedic said:
If I had my way people should have to pay to bring their bikes to work. They are a total hazard on the roads and then when they get to work they moan like hell about there not being enough space to park their precious bike or not enough 'things' to padlock them to

Tax the damn things I say why should the lefty lentil munching cyclists get away with contributing nothing. Tax the bike and charge them for parking it.

And those lycra shorts, so last decade......................
Well if better cycle paths where provided the cyclists would not be in your way. As for not enough space for bike storage, how much more room does a car take up? How do you work out that cyclists contribute nothing? If they are going to work they are almost certainly paying tax and how much damage to the roads do you think cyclists do compared to cars and trucks?

It is in your interests for more people to cycle to work. The more people that do that, the less congestion on the roads for people like yourself who don't have that option.
 
#16
1. A common misconception is that the C2W scheme permits employees to purchase the bicycle tax free, this is not the case. The C2W scheme is a Tax-efficient bicycle loan arrangement which allows the employer to purchase cycling equipment which is then hired to the employees through Salary Sacrifice.

2. Salary sacrifice schemes require an employee to contractually reduce the amount of their Gross salary in exchange for a non-cash benefit. Non-cash benefits may still be taxable unless there is a specific HMRC exemption. For the C2W Scheme this tax exemption has been granted, but only applies if all the following HM Revenue and Customs conditions are met:

a. Employees use the equipment mainly for qualifying journeys (i.e. for journeys made between the employee’s home and workplace, or for journeys between one workplace and another) - that means it cannot be used for your own enjoyment/racing/training it is service equipment.

b. Ownership of the equipment is not transferred to the employee during the loan period.

3. In addition to these specific conditions for the C2WScheme, it is a HMRC stipulation for all Salary Sacrifice schemes that, in order to comply with Tax Legislation, the employee’s contractual right to cash pay must reduce. Therefore salary sacrifice may have an impact on other pay-related benefits such as Maternity Pay, Working Tax Credits or Final Salary-linked pensions. Additionally HMRC states that the employer must not simply meet the employee’s own financial commitments or apply cash remuneration on their behalf.

4. In addition to the HMRC conditions which are central to the implementation of the C2W scheme, there are a number of other impacts which must be considered.

a. Capital Expenditure. As it is the employer and not the employee who purchases and owns the cycling equipment, it is MOD who would fund the initial outlay of Capital Expenditure (although this will be recovered from individuals over the duration of hire period). These costs are dependent on uptake of the scheme. However it is possible that each individual could procure equipment up to £1,000 in value . On this basis, an annual take up of 2,000 people would involve in year outlay of £2million.

b. Contract Tender and competition process. The total value of the business would exceed the EU threshold for advertising of the contract (circa £100K). This would require a full Contract Tender process with associated manpower and expertise requirements and costs. The duration of the process from writing of business requirement to signing contract could be in excess of 18 months.

c. Management and Audit. To operate a purchase, hire and disposal system will have a sustained requirement for management, audit and HR/pay action. This creates additional management overhead costs and headcount.

d. Consumer Credit Act (CCA) 1974. There should be no automatic entitlement for the employee to take ownership of the cycle equipment at the end of the loan period . If after the end of the loan agreement the bike is offered for sale, the employee must pay a “fair market value. ” If this is recovered from pay it must be from Net Salary. VAT must also be paid on the purchase price. This specific restrictions in the CCA complicates the issues surrounding the sale/disposal of bikes (eg what is the mechanism for valuation, should this be conducted by Disposals Services Agency).

e. Impact on existing allowances. Non-taxable benefits cannot be double paid for the same purpose. MOD currently enjoys a specific tax exemption from HMRC allowing the payment of a tax free allowance for commuting journeys. This takes the form of the Home to Duty Travel Allowance (HDT) which includes Motor Vehicle and Cycle rates or payment. HDT travel (Cycle Rate) contributes to the cost of owning, running and maintaining a bike. HDT travel could not be paid in conjunction with the Cycle Scheme as the scheme requires that at least 50% of the journeys on the bike must be qualifying journeys for work purposes.
 
#17
Lamster said:
MoD Civilians can apply for interest free loans of up to £1000 to enable them to purchase bicycles. The MoD continues to keep these policies under regular review.
Unless I've missed something, is there a similar scheme for military personnel? Granted that the majority will live on-camp, but for those commuting?
 
#19
My company has the C2WS. Basicly we can get a loan of about 600 quid to get a bike & all the gubbins. I looked at it & though what a load of tosh. You can get a decent enough comuter bike from Argos for about a oner. The only winner is the company.

LT
 
#20
LoneTree said:
You can get a decent enough comuter bike from Argos for about a oner. The only winner is the company.

LT
Do you drive the cheapest car you can find and only eat Basics food? Anything from Argos is dross and won't last the distance. Cheap rubbish.
 
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