Discussion in 'RAC' started by pandaplodder, Mar 24, 2009.

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  1. Just a question about the FV102 Striker and Sabre (not a wah) just interested in AFV's.

    Is the Striker being converted from Swingfire to fire the FGM-148 Javelin or are they going to be scrapped? I can't find any definite answers as one site says Swingfire was discontinued in 2005 but says the Striker is still in service?

    I've seen on one website ( where they referred to the old Sabre as the Porsche Carrera of Tanks

    What was official reasoning for taking them out of service? As they seemed better armed than the Scimitar (although not as well armoured?).

    They are currently selling ex MOD Sabres in the US for $79,000
  2. AlienFTM

    AlienFTM LE Book Reviewer

    I cannot comment on Striker / Swingfire.

    WRT Sabre, I think you have your wires crossed.

    Scorpion, at one time the army's primary recce vehicle, had a 76mm gun as opposed to a 30mm cannon, but was otherwise essentially identical (Scimitar was a close recce vehicle, filling a different role). In the mid-90s, Scorpion was scrapped because the pen-pushers didn't like the 76mm gun flooding the turret with carbon monoxide after every round fired.

    This left a shortfall of CVR(T)s to fill its primary recce role. Because the hulls were essentially identical, a temporary solution was to take obsolete Fox CVR(W) - armoured car - 30mm turrets and mate them to Scorpion hulls.

    The Fox turret was smaller than that of the Scimitar but again, essentially identical.

    The recce vehicle shortfall went away, leaving the Scimitar entirely filling the recce role that had once been Scorpion's and the Sabre was retired.
  3. Sabre was armed the same as Scimitar the difference being Sabre had an L94 Chain Gun as its co-ax rather than an L37 GPMG, other than small cosmetics no real difference.
  4. The old chestnut about the smoke from the gun being the reason for withdrawing Scorpion rises again. I'm pretty sure we bottomed this out before and that the reason was to comply with the Conventional forces in Europe Treaty at the end of the Cold War.
  5. I meant surely a L94 Chain Gun is better than a L37 GPMG?
  6. God no! you couldn't fire it unless the engine was running, you couldnt ground mount it, it was mounted upside down, to clear a stoppage you had to take it apart, you'd end up with a glowing barrel in your lap if you weren't carful when changing the barrel the hot barrel caused its stowage containg to lock solid as it radiated the want me to go on? had to unbox the ammo as the link had to be on the underside of the link when loading it....a slower rate of fire, apart from all that yeah alot better.
  7. ^^^ :D FFBox Got it in a oner :D ^^^ L94 heap of shit why do you think the yanks offloaded it onto us :evil:
  8. AlienFTM

    AlienFTM LE Book Reviewer

    I know of this story. I like it and it makes a lot of sense. Commies: "We want to see a reduction of x tanks armed with guns of calibre in the range 75mm - 105mm." (Because the Commies had gazillions of obsolescent T62s they could scrap in this calibre.)

    The Septics had moved to 120mm-armed Abrams by then? And the Salmon Trouts to ditto-armed Leo2? So they had M60s and Leo1s respectively to bin.

    But our Cent gun tanks were long gone. "How can we join in? I know: Health and Safety are whingeing about the toxicity of the 76mm gun in Scorpion. Let's kill two birds with one stone."

    As it happens I have a very good friend who was a lot closer to the decision than I was, who swears that the PRIMARY reason for ditching Scorpion was the toxicity. Good enough for me. And as someone who spent more than a few afternoons suffering from carbon monoxide poisoning whilst firing Scorpion in the 70s and 80s, I know where my money is.
  9. I'm not a tanky, but still, sounds like a 76mm gun would be no bad thing to have about. If the fumes issues could have been resolved in some way.

    I notice the Warrior is due to have an upgrade to a larger (40mm?) gun, stabilised too.

    Whilst Scimitar must be getting on so's it'd be a bit of a waste fitting new guns to them, can we expect larger guns (57mm, 76mm?) for the CVR(T) replacement? I imagine it'd be a bit over-the-top for the recce role, but would fit in with the Medium Armour role and direct fire support for inf well.
  10. AlienFTM

    AlienFTM LE Book Reviewer

    Scimitar may be getting on, but, main armament aside, Light Dragoons have just (if I have my dates right) taken delivery of a tranche of brand new Scimitars upgraded for the Sandpit. At last year's reunion a Tanky sergeant I spoke to could not enthuse strongly enough about the "new" Scimitar.

    The thing he liked best was the day-friendly night sight (that he was demonstrating to me) that was better than the day sight. I dunno if the specs about the laser rangefinder are classified, but I did enjoy his demo.

    And a lot of people have suggested recently that a recce vehicle with a gun around 76mm could come in useful in the sandpit.
  11. I suppose it'd allow you to switch from a recce role to a 'recce in force' role a lot easier, better for supporting inf, probably better chances when taking on enemy AFVs should it come to that.

    Thing is I sort of equate larger guns with larger vehs, look at the American 'Stryker MGS', 105mm but mahoosive! French AMX10RC, 105mm, probably not as bad as the US one but still looks pretty chunky, which wouldn't be ideal for recce I'm thinking. I suppose I need to realise that when it comes to CVRT, 30mm vs 76mm comes in the same size package. And if you can get more out of it for no decrease in sneakiness, why not?

    This new Scimitar sounds pretty interesting, wonder if they are newly built, or refurbished old ones? You're right, I expect that we will have CVRT around for awhile yet, seeing as FRES is not going to be around the corner.
  12. Didn't they fit a 90mm to a scorpion back in the 70s?
  13. About the new upgraded scimitar what is the reason for the spoiler like thing at the back ?Or is it need to know?
  14. I wouldn't be surprised if there was a prototype 90mm CVRT - I think they fitted a 90mm to Warrior and flogged them to some Middle Eastern country as a recce veh, probably they had seen the M3 Bradley and wanted something similar.
  15. I think it was to go to Iran when we were still friends but got cancelled