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CUOTC Subs

Should MTQ1 Certificates be framed?

  • Yes - its an achievement and it should be properly recognized

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • No - it is an acheivement, but just the paper certificate would do nicely. Put the money towards som

    Votes: 0 0.0%

  • Total voters
    0
#1
CUOTC Members (only please?!), as you will see on Summer Camp if you don't know already, a large proportion of the mess subs we pay (a reasonably substantial amount when added up) goes on "Picture Frames" including frames for pictures in the bar (fair enough in my opinion) and frames for MTQ1. This last year these were the cheapest (and fairly nasty) frames we could find and noone seemed particularly bothered anyway; its MTQ1 (hardly selection!) and is not really somthing to get all excited about. By the sounds of it most use the frame for something else. Would we rather the money went to something else?

At the same time, what could we spend the money on? Save the ideas for camp!
 
#2
Cheers uni-challenged, you took the poll right out of my... er... poll bag...

and with 100% of people going for no frames... we cant go wrong....

Now.... to ideas for the money!
 
#3
what is the annual spend on mtq1 frames? I know in AGM it came up about £700 but that was including other frames, apparently
I don't see how people can vote, especially newbies without their information

at say £1.50 a frame probably 100 people a year pass mtq1??? so that's £150... round it to £160 and we have 4 people's mess subs, out of 100 people...

so 4% of our subs goes on that?

Not totally sure of my numbers, obviously, but it's not like we're paying out for oak frames with extra thick safety glass and guilded edges etc
 
#4
We paid £4 a frame for this years certs apparently. It just seems to me a waste of money that would be better going on something like ents of subsidies for the cocktail party, or another party just for cadets, as suggested by frodillicus.
 
#5
The question about picture frames is a fair one. I personally felt proud to recieve a framed certificate. If you don't like it you are entitled to an opinion, but discussing it on arrse isn't going to change a thing. Bring the issue up at the AGM again.
I think people have failed to understand the working of the mess. If you want money for something you have to ask for it. If the money isn't asked for, it will be used on something else. I'm sure everyone will agree that displaying our units achievements such as the cambrian medals and certificates adds something to the mess..
 
#6
But when you ask for money and can't get it because there isnt enough to go round, you start to question what the money is going towards. Cambrian medals and things for the mess....yes absolutely, but MTQ1 certificate frames? I am aware of the workings of the mess and intend to bring it up, but wondered what other people felt.
 
#7
I have an idea; we could use the money to buy a collective sense of humour for CUOTC.

But alas, all the subs are spent on my rehabilitation back in to society which is going reasonably well. If you have any problems with that I and my friend baseball bat would be happy to discuss the issue.
 
#8
Dont you buggers take like 90% of the OTC budget anyway? Can't you use some of that to buy your terribly spiffing frames?
I last saw my MTQ1 certificate floating in several pieces in a sea of port. :cry:
 
#9
I really can not understand how any one can feel that they have gained a sense of acheivement from getting their MTQ1 certificate in a frame. I dont think that we should even get certificates, it's hardly a commision or a warrant.

You should be happy that you went to the right amount of weekends to get into the OTC properly, you are at the end of MTQ1 hardly a trained soldier and completing this training is merely the begining.

If you feel that for you to stay in the unit u need to get a framed certificate every year, you are there for the wrong reasons.

however on the otherside i do agree with getting somthing for your attestation, an important part of being indoctrinated into the Army and taking on its values. This is filed awaysome where next to my cycling proficientcy.
 
#10
it all seems a bit academic now really. the frames have rightly or wrongly been brought, and the new staff at the top may see fit to do different in the coming year. having said that, its worth bringing up at the AGM.

the majority of mtq1-ers seem fairly indifferent to the issue, happy to have got onto the ladder and get their new stable belts n rank slides.
 
#11
what do you mean "get"

surely you mean buy.

I have been in 4 years now and have only worn my stable belt when i absolutly had to.

As for rank slides i always got hand me downs. Mine is so old it could be put in the Uniform cabinet.

They are indifferent because they know no better.
 
#13
foxtrot.oscar said:
4 years in and bitter about it.

personally i prefer my stable belt- far more flexible n hence comfortable. a pain when 'emergency' toilet trips necessary tho.
No four years in and wiser than you. I aint boasting about my "trigger time" i was merely puting my stable wearing exploits into perspective.

If you want comfort and trouser droping ease you should get hold of a '58 pattern belt. St*** the storeman hides them behind the pro boots and the G10 watches in the stores.
 
#16
Some of the staff don't especially like seeing people wearing the pattern 58 belt.
Some may remember the old RSM having a go at the canadian prime minister for turning up on parade with a "sweaty belt"

Personally I'd hadn't noticed much difference in comfort, but the stable belt collects crap like a dyson and is hell to clean
 
#17
I pay the £40 subs - as does everyone in the unit - but I am unlikely to benefit from a framed MTQ1 certificate, as I am rather old. My view is that, as MTQ1 are mostly brand new to the army, there is a real feeling of achievement in passing the course that should be properly recognised. It is much more stylish - and thus an aid to retention - to mark this event with a framed certificate rather than unframed, stuffed in an envelope. Spreading this minor cost amongst all of us reduces the burden on the newer individual and reinforces our welcome at a time when some, historically, are thinking of sacking it for an easy life in the railway modelling society etc. Looking forward to the AGM. Narcosis out.
 
#19
I see your point, but are people who are wavering really going to be swayed by an MTQ1 certificate frame? Wouldnt the money be better spent on say, the christmas party? If people has a really good time there they would be more likely to come back!
 
#20
Narcosis said:
My view is that, as MTQ1 are mostly brand new to the army, there is a real feeling of achievement in passing the course that should be properly recognised. It is much more stylish - and thus an aid to retention - to mark this event with a framed certificate rather than unframed, stuffed in an envelope. Spreading this minor cost amongst all of us reduces the burden on the newer individual and reinforces our welcome at a time when some, historically, are thinking of sacking it for an easy life in the railway modelling society etc. Looking forward to the AGM. Narcosis out
Arguably the thing which needs addressing is the question of why these people feel the need to leave, rather than focussing their lives on the mates that they have made in uniform.

Swinging the lantern a little (okay, a lot), my experience of the OTC (not Cambridge btw) was that, even as a Regular Army Bursar, I had to go through one of the two selection weekends - which cut out a greater proportion of the applicants than RCB - in order to even go and attest at the TAC. Many OTCs (not all, I know) now hand out the uniform on the evening that the 'stoodents' turn up for a free curry. The selection process involves working out how to get on the transport - which is laid on - to take you to the recruiting evening. I have no doubt that the proportion of 'die hards' to 'drop outs' remains constant (always allowing for a generation's worth of cultural evolution) but if the die-hards are not positively selected, then you end up with a situation in which you have to actively retain the 'drop-outs' simply because they are in the majority, which is analogous to trying to get a grip of smoke.

The retention needs to take place on a variety of levels - for students the options are wider than for the TA in general - OTC OCdts always use to share houses in the day - there was no dropping out, it just didn't happen. There is only so much that OTC RHQs can do - including framing exam certificates, before the exercise becomes nothing more than a series of weekly bribes to get them off their ARRSEs in front of Coronation Street, or Big Brother. Some of responsibility devolves on the student body, both collectively and as individuals, to have an inclusive social group who will not let its members leave – nor want to leave.

Question: Is society in general now more fractured than prior to the advent of mobile communications?

My recent experience suggests that a group of OCdts will sit around a pub table texting their mates, girls, parents and organising separate social 'scenes' whilst supposedly on the lash with their mukkahs. It's all very well having the communication between social nodes, but if it is at the expense of a solid core social grouping then we are, as a wider society, in a whole heap of hole.

The council for the Devil rests.
 

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