Cry Freedom, mince pies and Chrimbo Trees - Moron’s charter?

[Dan Gleebles]

Its not the food that's the issue it the behaviour of people. Admitting you don't understand that makes you look a bit silly. I suspect you do understand it but it doesn't't suit your narrative to address the real issue.

I tend to agree on your second point.

You obviously don't look silly when you stand by the concept of going to the pub being safe.

Well, safe so long as you've got some scran in front of you.

 

[BuggerAll]

LordVonHarley said:

It's all about risk management and personal responsibility.

I agree. Personal responsibility includes your responsibility not to spread disease. Risk management requires you to understand the risks to you and others.

Most of the people who have spread the disease by irresponsible behaviour will never know how many people have become sick and suffered long term injuries or met an untimely death because of their irresponsible behaviour.

Indeed those who have behaved irresponsibly have also encouraged others to do so by their example.

Its the same as putting your lights on during the blackout.

 

[Nimbus]

We can't use our indoor lawn bowls centre, but you can go swimming, bowling and shopping and if you play singles or pairs you are distanced anyway.

My local swimming pool has drained alternate lanes to ensure social distancing.





...like Moses. With a sea saw.

 

[Dan Gleebles]

LordVonHarley said:

It's all about risk management and personal responsibility.

I agree. Personal responsibility includes your responsibility not to spread disease. Risk management requires you to understand the risks to you and others.

Most of the people who have spread the disease by irresponsible behaviour will never know how many people have become sick and suffered long term injuries or met an untimely death because of their irresponsible behaviour.

Indeed those who have behaved irresponsibly have also encouraged others to do so by their example.

Its the same as putting your lights on during the blackout.

Allowing pubs and restaurants to open isn't being responsible.

It's like putting your lights on during the blackout.

 

[BuggerAll]

What is the real issue?

Spreading the disease.

 

[Dan Gleebles]

Spreading the disease.

Isn't keeping schools, colleges and universities open help spread the disease?

 

[Ortholith]

Spreading the disease.

Being sat at a table drinking beer is incredibly different to being sat at a table drinking beer and eating chips.

Just for a bit of context:

Deaths registered weekly in England and Wales, provisional - Office for National Statistics

Provisional counts of the number of deaths registered in England and Wales, by age, sex and region, in the latest weeks for which data are available. Includes the most up-to-date figures available for deaths involving the coronavirus (COVID-19).

www.ons.gov.uk

 

[BuggerAll]

Allowing pubs and restaurants to open isn't being responsible.

It's like putting your lights on during the blackout.

Everything is a balance. If people behave responsibly there's not much of a problem. As I understand it there have not been many infections traced back to coffee shops and cafes.

The problem is the behaviour of people when mixed with booze. Not necessarily their behaviour in the pubs but we know about one idiot in Manchester who went on a pub-crawl after coming back from (IIRC) Croatia. 200 infections were traced to him. That doesn't count the untraced infections. The people who caught it were also behaving irresponsible and passed it on to all of their irresponsible friends. Great party! We don't know if anyone died or is suffering long term injuries as a result.

 

[Charlie4]

Or alternatively: tell people to stay at home, observe the rule of six, and celebrate Easter instead.

Lockdown until next year but with a week off in the middle? Where's the logic in that?

The same logic that locks the country down, but still allows flights in from all over the world and asks the passengers to quarantine for two weeks, as happend back in March.

 

[Dan Gleebles]

Everything is a balance. If people behave responsibly there's not much of a problem. As I understand it there have not been many infections traced back to coffee shops and cafes.

The problem is the behaviour of people when mixed with booze. Not necessarily their behaviour in the pubs but we know about one idiot in Manchester who went on a pub-crawl after coming back from (IIRC) Croatia. 200 infections were traced to him. That doesn't count the untraced infections. The people who caught it were also behaving irresponsible and passed it on to all of their irresponsible friends. Great party! We don't know if anyone died or is suffering long term injuries as a result.

That's just pompous boll0cks.

Going to the pub or restaurant during a pandemic is irresponsible.

Whether you're having a sweet sherry and a steak dinner or a pint and a packet of pork scratchings, you're at risk of catching and spreading the virus.

Either close them or open them, there's no halfway house.

 

[Ecosse]

"So when we visit my Mum on Boxing Day, what are the rules?"

Said I was not entirely sure and it's likely to change but as far as I knew:

1. Blood relatives only. That rules out, say, sons in law, so no "we" in it.

2. Anyway Rule of six applies. Six hours including return journey time and that is it.

3. No physical presents or cards: risk of viral transmission too great

4. Have to meet and eat outdoors with full social distancing, masks etc.

Doubtful looks

"Are you making this up?"

The very idea....

Is it safe to imagine.....Mum involves a return trip 2.5 hrs each way?

 

[BuggerAll]

Being sat at a table drinking beer is incredibly different to being sat at a table drinking beer and eating chips.

Just for a bit of context:
View attachment 524753

Deaths registered weekly in England and Wales, provisional - Office for National Statistics

Provisional counts of the number of deaths registered in England and Wales, by age, sex and region, in the latest weeks for which data are available. Includes the most up-to-date figures available for deaths involving the coronavirus (COVID-19).

www.ons.gov.uk

You're right. The food is not the factor. Its the behaviour. Unfortunately its a very inexact science. The governments where trying to strike a balance between public health and normal life. I don't think they realised quite how stupid a small but significant minority of people are.

I don't think it helps that the media have been relentlessly hostile to all public health messages. A lot of people really don't understand why they are being asked to do some things.

 

[Ecosse]

Isn't keeping schools, colleges and universities open help spread the disease?

Yes.
It's ripping through Police HQ (Training) college, and our local Forth Valley college of further education
Not heard what's happening at our local Stirling Uni, although they/it (Stirling) went into 4 from 3.

 

[Dan Gleebles]

You're right. The food is not the factor. Its the behaviour. Unfortunately its a very inexact science. The governments where trying to strike a balance between public health and normal life. I don't think they realised quite how stupid a small but significant minority of people are.

I don't think it helps that the media have been relentlessly hostile to all public health messages. A lot of people really don't understand why they are being asked to do some things.

Utter, utter boll0cks.

 

[BuggerAll]

That's just pompous boll0cks.

Going to the pub or restaurant during a pandemic is irresponsible.

Whether you're having a sweet sherry and a steak dinner or a pint and a packet of pork scratchings, you're at risk of catching and spreading the virus.

Either close them or open them, there's no halfway house.

Its not what you're eating. Its your behaviour. Alcohol is a factor in that behaviour. Everything carries a risk. Going to the supermarket carries a risk. Getting stuff delivered from Amazon carries a risk. If people behaved in pubs they way they behave in coffee shops there would be less of a problem.

I don't know what your view of all those people going to the beach in July was. My local beach is deserted. Its perfectly safe to go to. You can maintain your distance to the few other people who are there. Had it looked anything like the beaches we saw on the news I would have turned around and gone home. If I was stuck in a traffic jam on the way to somewhere I'd have gone home. I can't quite understand what goes through someone's mind when they decide to stay.

 

[Chef]

Everything is a balance. If people behave responsibly there's not much of a problem. As I understand it there have not been many infections traced back to coffee shops and cafes.

Edited for brevity.

Pubs are required to ban ordering at the bar and provide table service to stop the spread of covid. In coffee shops people are going to the counter to order their coffee while observing distancing requirements.

What's the difference between coffee shops and ordering a coffee or beer from a pub counter in this context?

You also say:

'I don't know what your view of all those people going to the beach in July was. My local beach is deserted. Its perfectly safe to go to. You can maintain your distance to the few other people who are there. Had it looked anything like the beaches we saw on the news I would have turned around and gone home.'

Implying that you're intelligent enough to make your own risk assessment but nobody else is,

 

[Charlie4]

LordVonHarley said:

It's all about risk management and personal responsibility.

I agree. Personal responsibility includes your responsibility not to spread disease. Risk management requires you to understand the risks to you and others.

Well I haven't got it, so can't spread it.

Most of the people who have spread the disease by irresponsible behaviour will never know how many people have become sick and suffered long term injuries or met an untimely death because of their irresponsible behaviour.

That could be 0!

Indeed those who have behaved irresponsibly have also encouraged others to do so by their example.

Its the same as putting your lights on during the blackout.

A student gets tested whilst at home and should have stayed there, but decides to go back to Uni'. Shares the house with 5 mates, and as students do go on the lash down the Uni' bar and party.

Results come through and she's positive. The others she lives with and has been partying with get tested, not one positive.

You can reserve the right to hide away and believe everything trotted out by the parasites in government and MSM, but personally, I can manage my own life.

One question, how are you catching it from these irresponsible people, if you are doing everything right?

 

[Truxx]

This is what happens when you have a Nanny State, people stop thinking and weighing up risks themselves. Once upon a time people would have been told the risks and expected to manage accordingly

Very true.

The only reason that there are dopey rules is because the MSM and legions of internet idiots have demanded them, and real life is just too complex to codify.

As the old saying goes, the trouble with common sense is that it is not very common.

 

[Nimbus]

Isn't keeping schools, colleges and universities open help spread the disease?

The second wave started around the beginning of September.
Kids went back to school around the beginning of September.
Nah... can’t see the connection.
Closing schools 2 weeks before the 5 day infectofest so the little brats can clear it out of their system? Nah... because Lazy Teachers grrr...

 

[BuggerAll]

Edited for brevity.

Pubs are required to ban ordering at the bar and provide table service to stop the spread of covid. In coffee shops people are going to the counter to order their coffee while observing distancing requirements.

What's the difference between coffee shops and ordering a coffee or beer from a pub counter in this context?

None. It's the other behaviour associated with alcohol. As I mentioned in the bit you edited for brevity. There are no perfect solutions.

At the end of the day it's about understanding the problem and trying to do you best to be part of the solution. Act as if you have the disease and behave in a way that spreads it as little as possible whilst going about your business.