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Critically ill man 'former Russian spy'

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Well propose more simple explanation.
OPCW planted BZ to one of blood samples. It was confirmed.
Could specialists from Porton Down plant A234 to blood samples?
It can not be excluded.

Stop posting utter shite, you fawning Putin sycophant.

You've been shown the facts but refuse to acknowledge them because they ALL point directly at Russia's bastard leadership.

YFM
 
Planted is the incorrect use of words. It implies dishonesty. In fact , the BZ was introduced as a control sample. You know this. This is basic scientific methodology. Apart from anything else, it validates other results on the basis of false positives and lazy technicians. I would not expect to ever see lazy technicians at such a lab. but it covers the bases.
Well, OPCW experts secretly added BZ to the blood samples
Could Porton Down experts secretly add A234 to the blood samples.
In theory yes. Even if blood samples were taken by OPCW experts directly then A234 could be added later. It can not be excluded.
I do not know and neither do you. As a scientist, you would consider this . However, the OPCW maintains and I believe them, that the evidence chain was clean.
Let's not fool ourselves. OPCW is controlled by Washington through its numerous allies. Procedures in OPCW are not transparent. Who namely (representative of what country) ordered to add BZ to the blood samples? And why namely BZ? The picture of poisoning looks as BZ was used.
As a scientist I would like to say - if there are any doubts then a new experiment is needed to remove them. Ms.Skripal could be sent to Switzerland and blood samples could be taken directly in SpiezLab in presence of British and Russian experts. It would be correct, transparent experiment.
This therefore leads back to your argument that the British did it in the first instance. Again, you either discount the OPCW integrity or you don't. You provide evidence or you don't. Otherwise, it is merely an opinion.
Of course it is an opinion. OPCW procedures and decision making process are not transparent.
It comes down ultimately to who you believe. Within this is the integrity issue.
I believe facts established during fair, transparet procedure.
 
Well, OPCW experts secretly added BZ to the blood samples

I have explained this. There would be precious little point in adding BZ if they told everybody. Can you think why. You are a scientist.
Could Porton Down experts secretly add A234 to the blood samples.
In theory yes. Even if blood samples were taken by OPCW experts directly then A234 could be added later. It can not be excluded.

Opinion. We have been there throughout this thread.

Let's not fool ourselves. OPCW is controlled by Washington through its numerous allies. Procedures in OPCW are not transparent. Who namely (representative of what country) ordered to add BZ to the blood samples?

So, as I suspected, you do not accept the integrity of OPCW. There is nothing to add here.

And why namely BZ? The picture of poisoning looks as BZ was used.

BZ would be used as it has it likely has a similar spectrometry profile to the suspected agent. It would allow comparison but would need rigourous attention to detail. A theory but like so much else here, we need not place the people who put it there on the naughty step unless we wish to elaborate a conspiracy.

The picture of poisoning DOES NOT look as if BZ was used. The picture of containment and clean up DOES NOT look as if BZ was used. Hope that helps. I am not going to go into BZ. You know about it anyway.

Ms.Skripal could be sent to Switzerland and blood samples could be taken directly in SpiezLab in presence of British and Russian experts. It would be correct, transparent experiment.

How would that be then? You really do not get the rights of the individual do you?

I believe facts established during fair, transparet procedure.

No. No , you don't. You believe that by presenting untruths repeatedly, your version of events becomes the truth. The OPCW has conducted a fair and transparent procedure. You do not accept that . A couple of words would suffice.
 
Bearing in mind my "product improvement" hypothesis I think that the responders should begin to exercise their right to indulge in like for like wibble...
 
Bearing in mind my "product improvement" hypothesis I think that the responders should begin to exercise their right to indulge in like for like wibble...

I do not know if I can be of help with this.
I have left wibble far to my rear; I am now well into the realms blithering.
 
I have explained this. There would be precious little point in adding BZ if they told everybody. Can you think why. You are a scientist.
Yes, according to OPCW explanation BZ and its precursors were added secretly to verify analysis made by SpiezLab. It is a reasonable explanation.
BZ would be used as it has it likely has a similar spectrometry profile to the suspected agent.
Do you know what spectrometry profile does mean? How does it look?
Mass spectrometry - Wikipedia
Fourier transform mass spectrometry (FTMS), or more precisely Fourier transform ion cyclotron resonance MS, measures mass by detecting the image current produced by ions cyclotroning in the presence of a magnetic field. Instead of measuring the deflection of ions with a detector such as an electron multiplier, the ions are injected into a Penning trap (a static electric/magnetic ion trap) where they effectively form part of a circuit.
Detectors at fixed positions in space measure the electrical signal of ions which pass near them over time, producing a periodic signal. Since the frequency of an ion's cycling is determined by its mass-to-charge ratio, this can be deconvoluted by performing a Fourier transform on the signal. FTMS has the advantage of high sensitivity (since each ion is "counted" more than once) and much higher resolution and thus precision
What do you know about Fourier transform mass spectrometry?
Where have you read that BZ has similar 'spectrometry profile' to suspected chemical that was allegedly used as a poison?
The picture of poisoning DOES NOT look as if BZ was used. The picture of containment and clean up DOES NOT look as if BZ was used. Hope that helps. I am not going to go into BZ. You know about it anyway.
Why are you so sure the picture of poisoning does not look as if BZ was used? Are you an expert or have read about it somewhere? Where exactly?
 
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Yes, according to OPCW explanation BZ and its precursors were added secretly to verify analysis made by SpiezLab. It is a reasonable explanation.

Do you know what spectrometry profile does mean? How does it look?
Mass spectrometry - Wikipedia


What do you know about Fourier transform mass spectrometry?
Where have you read that BZ has similar 'spectrometry profile' to suspected chemical that was allegedly used as a poison?

Why are you so sure the picture of poisoning does not look as if BZ was used? Are you an expert or have read about it somewhere? Where exactly?

Product improvement fishing expedition.

There may be something to the Truxx Hypothesis.
 
What do you know about Fourier transform mass spectrometry?
Where have you read that BZ has similar 'spectrometry profile' to suspected chemical that was allegedly used as a poison?

I suggested it may have. Have a look. This was to avoid the idea of naughtiness which you were trying to introduce. Post 3138. A theory. As it was a suggestion, there was no need for me having read it now , was there Sergei?

There are a number of forms of spectrometry. One does not need to understand the Fourier transform to use one in the same way a man does not need to understand advanced chemistry to make a cake.

Why are you so sure the picture of poisoning does not look as if BZ was used? Are you an expert or have read about it somewhere? Where exactly?

You are the scientist , Sergei although I am a little confused that you do not realise that anyone with reasonable diligence from the teacher/supervisor could be trained to use a spectrometer to get data. You stated that the poisoning looked like BZ. The onus is on you to say why . I will give you a clue: tachycardia.

Do your own reading please. Then outline why the symptoms are similar to BZ.
 
You are the scientist , Sergei although I am a little confused that you do not realise that anyone with reasonable diligence from the teacher/supervisor could be trained to use a spectrometer to get data. You stated that the poisoning looked like BZ. The onus is on you to say why . I will give you a clue: tachycardia.

Do your own reading please. Then outline why the symptoms are similar to BZ.
It’s not fair to use the arch seeker of truth’s own tactics against him.
 
I suggested it may have. Have a look. This was to avoid the idea of naughtiness which you were trying to introduce. Post 3138. A theory. As it was a suggestion, there was no need for me having read it now , was there Sergei?

There are a number of forms of spectrometry. One does not need to understand the Fourier transform to use one in the same way a man does not need to understand advanced chemistry to make a cake.



You are the scientist , Sergei although I am a little confused that you do not realise that anyone with reasonable diligence from the teacher/supervisor could be trained to use a spectrometer to get data. You stated that the poisoning looked like BZ. The onus is on you to say why . I will give you a clue: tachycardia.

Do your own reading please. Then outline why the symptoms are similar to BZ.
It is detailed description of BZ, its properties and features
3-Quinuclidinyl benzilate
Agent BZ (3-Quinuclidinyl Benzilate): Acute Exposure Guideline Levels - Acute Exposure Guideline Levels for Selected Airborne Chemicals - NCBI Bookshelf
3-Quinuclidinyl benzilate - an overview | ScienceDirect Topics
In short BZ is not lethal CW. It disables a person for a period up to 4 days.
https://toxnet.nlm.nih.gov/cgi-bin/sis/search/a?dbs+hsdb:@term+@DOCNO+7533
3-Quinuclidinyl benzilate (QNB, BZ) is an anticholinergic agent that affects both the peripheral and central nervous systems (CNS). It is one of the most potent anticholinergic psychomimetics known, with only small doses necessary to produce incapacitation. ... Effects of QNB by any route of exposure are slow in onset and long in duration. The onset of action is approximately 1 hour, with peak effects occurring 8 hours postexposure. Symptoms gradually subside over 2-4 days.

Returning to Novichok, it should be said that
Novichok agent - Wikipedia
According to a classified (secret) report by the US Army National Ground Intelligence Center in Military Intelligence Digest dated 24 January 1997,[53] agent designated A-232 and its ethyl analog A-234 developed under the Foliant program "are as toxic as VX, as resistant to treatment as soman, and more difficult to detect and easier to manufacture than VX".
 
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It is detailed description of BZ, its properties and features

So how are the BZ symptoms similar to the A agent used in Salisbury? This is your statement, not mine.

I would postulate that they are not. Indeed, the only reason you made that statement in the first place is because one of your higher ups said the sample had been contaminated with Buzz which we now know was a plausible control.

Try action at muscarinic receptors.
 
What UK US EU condemnation, and how many diplomats will be expelled, for suspected Israeli sanctioned murder of a Hamas member in Malaysia on Saturday?

What does that have to do with the Salisbury incident?

You must try not to confuse separate incidents. Murder is murder but one murder in Malaysia does not make an attempted murder in Salisbury any less reprehensible.
 
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