Critically ill man 'former Russian spy'

Chemical markers would be due to the particular precursors used to make the agents ( their sourcing, purity and so on) AND the unique physical effects the equipment had on them, e.g. temperature variation due to glass/steel purity in a particular boiling vessel etc The former is more common in detection.

Sergei seems to be implying that they are attached purposefully during manufacture. Whilst they could be if needed for quality control etc ( and are), in practice, they would be present by accident as I have implied above.

Biological markers are post exposure. To give a brief idea, the amount of Acholinesterase inhibition after a stated number of minutes/hours/days would indicate type of weapon or degree of exposure. If fine enough it could indicate NA batch number. As far as I understand it, a similar thing can be done with nuclear isotopes of the man made type.

Sergei is slipping here. Really I should say the Sergeis are slipping here.

I suspect the markers are proof positive of a particular agent made in a particular place at a particular time. At this moment, any right thinking person would go with the first option and demand contrary proof which Mr Putin should supply. Mrs. May seems to be doing this.

Ifs and buts are dangerous and frankly disgusting in this context.

There are some things I would not do, one of them would be to be a mouthpiece for the unacceptable. There are always ways out such as feigning incompetence. At least one of the Sergeis appears old skool. Think of a way out m8.
I confess, I'm not a specialist in artificial (or natural) markers. So I'm open to critical arrows. The most known example is a marker odorant that is added to natural gas just to smell its leakage. Sometimes indeed isotopes (harmless ones) are added to recognised presence of some chemicals, to determine exact place and time of manufacture.
In 1977 being 20yo student of Moscow university I returned home by Metro. But the train stopped and then after long delay passed Pervomayskaya station without stop. That day Armenian nationalists staged explosions in Moscow Metro and Central Shopping Center. Soon all terrorist with their leader Stepan Zatikyan were captured. My late Father KGB colonel that time (military counter-intelligence) told me that markers helped to establish exact place where explosives were stolen. It appeared to be Armenian quarries. It helped to spot the terrorists.
In this case complete information about markers was at the disposal of KGB.
In the case with mr.Skripal, hardly British specialists are aware about specific markers (artificial or natural, functional) that point to Russia as a place of production.
Let's recall that Ukraine has chemical laboratories, plants where such poisonous gas can be manufactured. Ukrainian agents (at least in theory) could use the gas to poison mr.Skripal to harm Russian interests.
Btw Skripal is Ukrainian surname. It means Violinist.
 
At it again I see, you admit that you have limited knowledge of "markers" spin a story about an entirely different subject that involves an entirely different set of "markers" then state categorically that British specialists have no knowledge of the "markers" that you know nothing about, then just to keep things straight you blame it on the Ukranians.
 
A hugely revealing remark was made by a Russia Today representative - Andrei something- on BBC news: “I’m not an investigator, I’m a journalist.” He said.
Because of course, it’s dangerous to be an inquisitive reporter in Russia. So Andrei is both right and wrong at the same time: he’s not an investigator, which means he’s not a proper journalist either.
Then he wibbled on about the burden of proof.
It is due to problems with translation. In English it is possible to be criminal investigator, scientific investigator, naturalist investigator, journalist investigator but in Russian word SLEDOVATEL means only criminal investigator. In other meanings another word is being used - ISSLEDOVATEL. It looks similar but the meaning is different.

In Russian expressions Vegetable oil and Mineral oil are translated as MASLO and NEFT - quite different words.
Once in Vienna, in restaurant we found this description of a dish (in Russian) - Decisively roasted chiken strips with vegetables collect mineral oil.
 
At it again I see, you admit that you have limited knowledge of "markers" spin a story about an entirely different subject that involves an entirely different set of "markers" then state categorically that British specialists have no knowledge of the "markers" that you know nothing about, then just to keep things straight you blame it on the Ukranians.
OK. Enlighten me please, what do you mean by markers and how British experts could use them to establish Russian origin of the chemicals.
 
1. Revenge. Smersh Spionam.
2. Election sunday. Putin Stronk.
3. Pour encourager les autres...
The Bot's saying WE copied the nerve agent and carried the hit ourselves ?
That's why I asked what possible motive we could have in killing him , his daughter and anyone unlucky enough to get in the way .
 
I confess, I'm not a specialist in artificial (or natural) markers. So I'm open to critical arrows. The most known example is a marker odorant that is added to natural gas just to smell its leakage. Sometimes indeed isotopes (harmless ones) are added to recognised presence of some chemicals, to determine exact place and time of manufacture.
In 1977 being 20yo student of Moscow university I returned home by Metro. But the train stopped and then after long delay passed Pervomayskaya station without stop. That day Armenian nationalists staged explosions in Moscow Metro and Central Shopping Center. Soon all terrorist with their leader Stepan Zatikyan were captured. My late Father KGB colonel that time (military counter-intelligence) told me that markers helped to establish exact place where explosives were stolen. It appeared to be Armenian quarries. It helped to spot the terrorists.
In this case complete information about markers was at the disposal of KGB.
In the case with mr.Skripal, hardly British specialists are aware about specific markers (artificial or natural, functional) that point to Russia as a place of production.
Let's recall that Ukraine has chemical laboratories, plants where such poisonous gas can be manufactured. Ukrainian agents (at least in theory) could use the gas to poison mr.Skripal to harm Russian interests.
Btw Skripal is Ukrainian surname. It means Violinist.
Have you ever heard of Miranda ?
 
To use it for political purposes, to demonise Russia and its leadership - classical false flag operation.
Going to all that life-threatening trouble, involving many conspirators, to demonise Russia despite the fact that its own govt had already mastered that & that the average UK voter cares more about what happens on Deadenders or Abdication Street than the c*ntishness of the Russian govt.
Why do you even bother?
 
I thought this thread was about the (alleged) poisoning of a former Russian spy, his daughter and a British Police Officer?
It is, but its also a thread whereby USN ships with CWS are vulnerable to cruise missiles, but undoubtably Russian ships with CWS would shoot down cruise missiles easily :)

Perhaps if we started a thread about Syria, or the Turks shooting down an invincible Russian aircraft then the Russian posters might suddenly want to talk about nerve agent poisoning hahahahahahahaha
 
John O'McDonallski made it sound like it was the fault of Russian exiles who bankroll the Tories wot did it not his mates in the kremlin. nosiree bob.
How can certain Labour Politicians have 'mates' or anything else in the No Longer Socialist/Communist/Marxist/Leninist but Extreme Capitalist/Criminal State, you can't have it both ways, they're either Socialists or not.
 
I believe that terrorists, jihadists, their sponsors in the KSA and other countries are to be blamed. Not Russia anyway.
.
Bien sur

Its worth noting however that you dont think Russia is to blame for invading Poland or to blame for Katyn . Of course you acknowledge Putin admitted Russia did it - but it was the Wests fault Russia ended up in that position*.

*The position of being forced into signing a secret treaty to invade and then divide up a sovereign nation (who considered you an ally if not friend) then of being forced to round up and murder its surviving officers.

You will forgive me if I consider claims of Russias innocence to be lacking in veracity**


**Any one know the CA approved term for absolute Bullsh1t

Edited because the sweary word stopper didnt
 
About time too!
In the case with mr.Skripal, hardly British specialists are aware about specific markers (artificial or natural, functional) that point to Russia as a place of production.
You’ve read the Porton Down report? Are your hackers that good?
Let's recall that Ukraine has chemical laboratories, plants where such poisonous gas can be manufactured. Ukrainian agents (at least in theory) could use the gas to poison mr.Skripal to harm Russian interests.
Btw Skripal is Ukrainian surname. It means Violinist.
More disinformation. I’m sure the ‘useful idiots’ will lap it up.

Pity one of your citizens and a Police Officer are collateral damage. Are the sins of the father foisted onto the daughter?
 
OK. Enlighten me please, what do you mean by markers and how British experts could use them to establish Russian origin of the chemicals.
I have no idea as to what the "markers" may be it is a subject beyond my knowledge. If you are interested I suggest that you do some research, you could use Google if you have access or you could even contact a chemical weapons specialist to whom I am sure you would be allowed access in these circumstances.

I however am not making up stories to obfuscate the issue, we have had self inflicted, MI5/6 etc and Ukraine being responsible from you and a refusal to contemplate the hypothesis that it s a revenge attack enacted by the Russian authorities. In fact I am not even speculating as to what happened
 
I love the way St Jezza attacked Tories for taking Russian money, while he repeatedly appeared on Russia Today and for all we know took their money too for different reasons.

Having watched him today, my anger and abject contempt for that third rate scumbag knows no limits. The sanctimonious prick who finds no cause too worthy, no cause too obscure to campaign for and defend, except it seems the attempted murder in the United Kingdom through an act of aggression by a rogue gangster state that he adores and for all we know could have allegedly worked for in the 80s. Is he really the best we can do as leader of the opposition?
If Russia is a rogue gangster state and no longer a Socialist/Communist State why would he adore it, he after all he is a Socialist unlike the Russian Federation. The Soviet Union is no more and Corbyn/Mcdonell et al are certainly not Capitalist Gansters.
 
It is, but its also a thread whereby USN ships with CWS are vulnerable to cruise missiles, but undoubtably Russian ships with CWS would shoot down cruise missiles easily :)

Perhaps if we started a thread about Syria, or the Turks shooting down an invincible Russian aircraft then the Russian posters might suddenly want to talk about nerve agent poisoning hahahahahahahaha
Dont' forget the whole series of Standard Missiles and ESSM used to defend against incoming missiles, not to mention all the EW gear as well.

Still waiting for the Donald to Respond about Russia, or let Mattis and McMaster handle it.
 
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I hope hawks who want us to splurge on cyber warfare don't get listened to as it is most unwise to take on somebody who might just win, and who might do incredibly costly damage to our infrastructure which I doubt its various management have ever taken its protection sufficiently seriously.. .
You would be wrong there
Every Government Department has its own computer system non of which is compatible with anyone other departments - thus preventing a system wide attack, Furthermore the systems are so complex, unreliable and over budget that everyone's pretty much resorted to written records.

Therefore a cyber attack on HMG is probably the last thing the Soviet Union Russia should initiate it would improve efficiency no end

This is replicated across industry with airbus taking the extra step of ensuring computers working on the same project at different offices were not compatible*

*Within the same office they took the added step of ensuring computers with compatible systems working on different projects couldn't access the same data.
 

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