Creationism, A question according to King James account

Discussion in 'The Intelligence Cell' started by ghost_us, Jun 13, 2007.

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  1. Since there is another thread discussing religion that has sort of morphed into a discussion of creation, I thought of a question that I've asked several times and was curious on others takes on it.

    I asked this question of a Roman Catholic priest, in a very genuinely curious manner as to what his take on it was, and his reply was "A complete and utter fabrication, a story and nothing more".

    So, I'll be paraphrasing from King James version.

    The first two humans on the planet were Adam and Eve. From them, 3 sons were born. Cain and Abel, and later Seth.

    Anyway, Cain kills Abel and for which, is "sent away, where he married".

    Um, correct my math but if Adam and Eve were the first two, then Cain and Abel, the first 4, then subtract Abel and Add Seth, still 3 Men, 1 Woman.

    Who did Cain marry? Where did she come from? What city outside of eden are they suggesting existed?

    Anyhow, I would like to know your thoughts on this.
  2. Load of old tosh. Evoloutionism is the way to go. Bit of a poor post that, so I'll expand.

    In religion, they are never striving to improve and expand their theories. In science, the theory is rarely the same for a few weeks. New bits are continually being added on to improve it, make it easier to comprehend etc etc
  3. Haven't got a bible to hand (that me condemned to purgatory...), but I seem to recall that, after Seth, Adam & Eve went on to have dozens of other offspring, if not hundreds. I guess that a bit of incest was considered o.k. for the first few generations, and after that they were onto second- and third- cousins and so forth.
  4. How about the story of Lilith? the supposed first wife of Adam.

    lilith myth

    so the first man was violent, and the first woman was a feminist.
  5. And where were the dinosaurs in the Bible? You would have thought they might have got a mention?
  6. Nehustan

    Nehustan On ROPs

    Is it possible that there were other bipedal life forms with DNA similar enough that interbreeding was possible? Could Adam and Eve be the first of a lineage, but not the first beings on the planet? As to how they were created and by whom i.e. how it came to pass...big questions again...
  7. I read a couple takes on lilith. One was that she was an ethereal demoness created by satan to temp Adam to his side. Interesting stuff.
  8. Nehustan

    Nehustan On ROPs

    As an Aside, do you guys know the concepts and correspondences of Adam Kadmon (Keterim), Tree of Life, IHVH/Jahweh, Macrocosm/Microcosm etc.? Kinda interesting if you don't?
  9. creationism is just trying to prove that the bible is fact not fiction, if you read it like any other book looking for the threads of the on going story it is a quite violent and pacy novel, it's got everything from the first page when the world was created thro family life,sex, incest,jealousy,rage,war conquest,mysterious stories and even the very first bloggers, mathew, mark, luke and john, letters, romans and a myth that is still to this day celebrated as if it really did happen, grippin stuff!!! step aside Hammond Innes,Stephen King and Co!
  10. I'm familiar with the Jahweh concepts but not the others you mention.

    Also, along the same lines. There is a fictional fantasy type series from author piers anthony called Incarnations of immortality where he took certain religious and mythos figures and proposed them as jobs that a human would perform. In the books, he explores what their job would be, how do they get it, how do they lose it, who is their boss. There is a lot of fantasy rolled in, and some books in the series were a little too out there for me, ie: rolling around in a giant flying invisible fish, and that sort of thing but others were extremely interesting to me.

    The first in the series, On a pale horse, was about the grim reaper being a job held by a human. I don't want to spoil it for those that want to pick it up but definitely worth the read imho.

    For love of evil was by far the most interesting of the series.
  11. Let me recommend 2 books called "A Test Of Time" and "The Lost Testament" by David M. Rohl.They give an interesting take on the Bible
    and it`s chronology.
  12. One of the best explanations I ever heard was from my mother .
    FirstlyThe Bible is a way of explaining the inexplicable to ignorant people and Secondly it is a code of conduct to enable people to live in harmony.
  13. say what!! it's not real it was elevated to the level of how life should be lived as a way of controlling the masses by the roman church and so on through history, the victorians were the most corrupt people in history,supreme hypocrits preaching to the masses to live life according to the good book!!! whilst drinking whoring and in-breeding in the upper classes!! don't forget the church is one of the richest organisations in this country.
    Religion is the biggest cause of conflict through the ages, the bible is the koran is the torah, ect.....
  14. Ahh, the good old days.

    Seriously however, the major concern I have about creationism is that people who believe the Bible word for word tend to only selectively believe the bits that they like.
  15. Nehustan

    Nehustan On ROPs

    Ok, this is a bit of a mission to get this into a succint post, but hopefully with google images it will make it a bit easier...

    Tetragrammaton (meaning four lettered name/word) is used to describe God after Moses' experience, and is usually defined as IHVH/Jah'weh/Jehovah. The fact that when the voice spoke to Moses it said 'Eheieh Asher Eheieh' (I am what I am) and instructed Moses to tell the bani Israel to call him 'Eheieh' (I am) raises questions as to the origin of tetragrammaton, but not something we need to cover immediately. It was, I believe, after this point in the Torah that God is known as Jahweh.

    Adam Kadmon, in simple terms means 'The first man', but he is symbolically represented by an image called 'Keterim' which places the tetragrammaton upon the 'tree' of life to symbolise Adam, let me find some images....

    [align=center]k...first tetragrammaton...[/align]


    [align=center]then the tree of life...[/align]


    [align=center](the snake is Nehustan by the way ;) )[/align]

    [align=center]then Adam Kadmon...[/align]


    [align=center]...and finally the Keterim...[/align]


    [align=center]This explains the idea of Macrocosm/Microcosm 'made in the image' part of the bible with Adam as the word manifest in flesh...which would be later applied to the second Adam, Jesus.[/align]

    (edited as a result of image changes)