Cpls. Derek Wood and David Howes

#61
Had they ever taken military personnel prisoner, other than Robert Nairac?
They would have been the first, the IRA never released a single prisoner.
Given the amount of media exposure and real time footage of the incident, I suspect it would have been difficult for the IRA to whisk them away only to murder them later and dump the bodies down a quiet country lane without it having a detrimental affect on their cause as they saw it, and they would have been far more valuable as a propaganda tool. So they may well have been the first to be released (unless they 'got shot trying to escape') .
All sadly hypothetical of course.
 
#62
Had they ever taken military personnel prisoner, other than Robert Nairac?
At least 4 UDR soldiers, a lad from the QLR and a cop that I can think of off the top of my head. Plus at least one more UDR soldier after Howes and Woods. All of them were murdered.
 
#63
https://www.arrse.co.uk/community/threads/cpls-howes-and-wood.130799/

Thanks to @Fiona_TG for flagging up the anniversary of this tragic event, but for further awareness/interest (not a @jarrod248 type dig!), :smile: it has been covered quite extensively previously in the Royal Signals Forum.
Having served with one of the two lads and knowing him very well, I still can’t bear to watch any of the video clips out there in the public domain.
Awful, awful incident, which vividly demonstrates what bastards the human race can be to each other.
 
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ugly

LE
Moderator
#64
Had they ever taken military personnel prisoner, other than Robert Nairac?
I don't know but the recent book on special branch was quite clear on the IRA no release of prisoners policy
 
#65
It is a good and a bad thing that the young people of Ireland, the UK and NI know little of NI terrorism. The GFA was 10 years ago.

What’s the bad thing I hear you say? They don’t realise how important it is to prevent a return to violence on this scale because they haven’t experienced it. It will also be easier to radicalise them (as violent republicans/loyalists).
Agree completely. There will undoubtedly be a few youngsters who see the murals, hear the stories and sing the songs and feel that they missed the glory days.
Had they ever taken military personnel prisoner, other than Robert Nairac?
Yeah, I remember a UDR guy. Although they usually skipped the prisoner bit and cracked straight on with the murder.
 
#66
For a kickoff bb the standard of weapon handling that I personally witnessed was terrible. Many people who were issued a PW for the day were more interested in posing around a visiting camp with shoulder holsters. This is just for starters.
WTF has that got to with NI security policy? Do you think the policy demanded sub standard weapon handling?

You're going to have to do better.
 
#67
At least 4 UDR soldiers, a lad from the QLR and a cop that I can think of off the top of my head. Plus at least one more UDR soldier after Howes and Woods. All of them were murdered.
Plus they had a habit of attaching boobytraps to the dead bodies as a little present for whoever was supposed to remove the remains from the scene.
 
#68
Had they ever taken military personnel prisoner, other than Robert Nairac?
In a sense - a Kingsman I think it was (L.I.?) was left behind by his patrol in a "situation" during the 70's and contained by the local womenfolk until one of the heroes arrived to shoot him.
Accounts vary as to whether the women genuinely tried to look after him or just said soothing words while they waited for the murderer.
I remember some PIRA supporter in W. Belfast in the mid 70s claiming that PIRA had let a squaddie go instead of killing him but memory fails, I can't remember details of that claim.

Edit - not Kings, not L.I., QLR.

Murder of soldier Gary Barlow marooned in Belfast's Divis flats after 1973 raid may be reviewed by police - BelfastTelegraph.co.uk
 
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#69
Carrying on the sombre note of this thread, today is the anniversary of another despicable act, the murder of Jonathan Ball (aged 3) and Matthew Parry (aged 9) in the Warrington bombings.
 
#70
In a sense - a Kingsman I think it was (L.I.?) was left behind by his patrol in a "situation" during the 70's and contained by the local womenfolk until one of the heroes arrived to shoot him.
Accounts vary as to whether the women genuinely tried to look after him or just said soothing words while they waited for the murderer.
I remember some PIRA supporter in W. Belfast in the mid 70s claiming that PIRA had let a squaddie go instead of killing him but memory fails, I can't remember details of that claim.

Edit - not Kings, not L.I., QLR.

Murder of soldier Gary Barlow marooned in Belfast's Divis flats after 1973 raid may be reviewed by police - BelfastTelegraph.co.uk
My first tour was in the Divis in 1973. I only did the last six weeks because of my age. I wasn’t aware but my battalion must have taken over from the QLR because we were there in late 1973.

It was an absolute craphole.
 
#71
Carrying on the sombre note of this thread, today is the anniversary of another despicable act, the murder of Jonathan Ball (aged 3) and Matthew Parry (aged 9) in the Warrington bombings.
I read a few days ago that Tim Parry's father wasn't aware that the Cranberries "Zombie" was written about the Warrington bombings.
The old Zombie video looks dated now but makes more sense when you realise it was inspired by the deaths at Warrington.

Colin Parry learns of Cranberries' IRA Warrington bomb song on Dolores O'Riordan's death - BelfastTelegraph.co.uk
 
#72
It wasn't solely "them" when I served there. Nearly every cap-badge, in the army was represented - plus a couple of floating matelots and booties.
 
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#73
First of all.
Thank you to the posters who placed the card on the grave and the two poppy appeal poppies on the gravel.

I was thinking of this incident only yesterday, and thinking how to a certain group of ARRSErs this is a very bad incident with memories that can't be erased of of some horrific images.

To some this incident is vivid and fresh like it was yesterday, while to a growing section of the population it's ancient history and not at all relevent to their lives.

Who would have thought 30 years ago that an annoying and snivelling back bench labour MP who supported the PIRA cause and invited convicted terrorists into the house of commons would today be seen by many as a peace loving chap with ALL the answers?
 
#75
It wasn't solely "them", when I served there. Nearly every cap-badge, in the army was however represented - plus a couple of floating matelots and booties.
And ladies, never forget their tasking within JCUNI.
 
#76
I remember watching it unfold in the bar that evening on the news. Just silence from the crowd and quiet muttering as the situation got worse and worse. 30 years go by in a flash and it's still shocking in it's brutality now.
 
#77
BBC 2 Northern Ireland just aired a programme on this very subject


They also Extended that rule to Horses by all accounts
BBC 2 on the mainland yesterday.

The ability of Republicans to try and have their cake and eat it on every possible occasion is still extraordinary.

Not sure anything new came out of it. Very thin on the military perspective. Though Danny Morrison (doing something of a Van Morrison impression in a felt hat) has finally twigged that Herford is somewhere in Germany.
 
#78
Plus they had a habit of attaching boobytraps to the dead bodies as a little present for whoever was supposed to remove the remains from the scene.

Part of the equipment we carried on the EOD team was a pulling rope and meat hook, to try to eliminate such a risk by pulling the body from a distance. Fortunately for us in Bessbrook the local priest had moved the bodies when dumped on the roads local to XMG and FKL as he gave last rights. Still not a pleasant task.[/QUOTE]
 
#79
Part of the equipment we carried on the EOD team was a pulling rope and meat hook, to try to eliminate such a risk by pulling the body from a distance. Fortunately for us in Bessbrook the local priest had moved the bodies when dumped on the roads local to XMG and FKL as he gave last rights. Still not a pleasant task.
[/QUOTE]
Yes, When based at Bessbrook in the late seventies every body recovery was a major op with a full cordon and clearance up to and including the body. The SOCOs used to get a bit snotty that we had moved the body before they had recovered evidence. They calmed down a bit when invited to go ahead before the clearance was carried out.
 
#80
I have a friend who is a friend of the Wood family. I asked her if the family were ok with the card I made up (the one on the headstone there in the photo) and this is what she replied;

"...all ok they love him being remembered it means so much to them x"

That makes me feel humbled and quite choked up, thank you for those replies here that have been kind which I shall also ask my friend to pass on which I guess will also help.
 
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