Covid Passports - Yay or ney?

Should we have have Covid passports?


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Tool

LE
This all reminds me of when HiD and I came across to the UK. We had (still have, Mrs Doctor) two kids. They had their own passports as per, brecause they were over two years old. We had tremendous problems when the sprogette was supposed to go to France on a school trip. The Seffrican government had not cleared Child passports with other countries outside of southern Africa, so having a passport recognised by your won (home) nations is not a guarantee of international acceptance.
 
This all reminds me of when HiD and I came across to the UK. We had (still have, Mrs Doctor) two kids. They had their own passports as per, brecause they were over two years old. We had tremendous problems when the sprogette was supposed to go to France on a school trip. The Seffrican government had not cleared Child passports with other countries outside of southern Africa, so having a passport recognised by your won (home) nations is not a guarantee of international acceptance.
And it could all change tomorrow!
 
Fully-vaccinated people are still at risk of carrying - and themselves being - infected.

I find it bemusing how glibly people rattle this line off now. Was this ever a concern with any previous vaccine you've ever had? I must have had about 10, as an adult, and this is the first time anyone has mentioned it. Are you fretting about everything else you've ever been vaccinated for as well?
 

Blogg

LE
At what point did you realise this slight error?

Before or after briefing the Prime Minister?

I am going to say after, because you spent a lot of time shitting on about how such a figure was to be "expected"


 
I concur.

but it’s an effective way of not foisting a passport on your own population. You get to blame the other guys for wanting it.

I know there’s kick back about Covid passports domestically (something I personally don’t have a problem with. I need a driving licence to drive a car for example) but I doubt even the usual suspects who are against vaccine passports will be able to sell the idea of HMG allowing untested and unvaccinated people into the country.

Problem with that. Whilst most EU countries will accept the NHS app as proof of being vaccinated, UK won't accept the EU covid passport as proof. Only those who go abroad and have been vaccinated on the NHS will be allowed back in without self isolating. Those who have had the same vaccine but given outside the NHS will still have to quarantine. Therefore the covid passport for those nasty foreigners only is a moot point.

Edit. Sorry, England won't accept the EU covid passport. Apparently Wales will.
The disunited Kingdom marches on.
 
Edit. Sorry, England won't accept the EU covid passport. Apparently Wales will.
The disunited Kingdom marches on.
Only because England won't. If England has accepted it Twatford would have opposed it. The only thing he accepts from England is money.
 

ancienturion

LE
Book Reviewer
UK won't accept the EU covid passport as proof.

That is only to be expected knowing that all foreigners start at Calais and are not to be trusted.
I think the same was also said about their water.
 

Tool

LE
I find it bemusing how glibly people rattle this line off now. Was this ever a concern with any previous vaccine you've ever had? I must have had about 10, as an adult, and this is the first time anyone has mentioned it. Are you fretting about everything else you've ever been vaccinated for as well?
The issue is about an infection that is less than two years old. My son's girlfriend had COVID in December. She works in health care and has had lateral flow tests twice a week since then, On Sunday, she tested positive again. She's just waiting for a "professional" test to confirm.

The the vaccines are still very new and the testing was very short-term. I do not need the Government or science to tell me that there will be higher risks and false reactions to the vaccines for some time yet. Every vaccine I've received in my life up until now has had years of testing and perhaps decades of use in live environments to iron out issues we are still to eperience with the latest batches.
 
I find it bemusing how glibly people rattle this line off now. Was this ever a concern with any previous vaccine you've ever had? I must have had about 10, as an adult, and this is the first time anyone has mentioned it. Are you fretting about everything else you've ever been vaccinated for as well?

Quite. It's bemusing as we're track and tracing the double jabbed (plus the disparity between non and essential workers regarding isolation) and making them submit to twice weekly testing etc.

What does it matter if there are 50'000 or 100'000 infected daily when virtually all of them are either 1) single or double jabbed (so typically asymptomatic), or 2) at so little risk they don't need to be i.e. the under 18s.

I'd actually contend the bigger concern this winter will be flu if you wanted to switch 'track and trace' to something more meaningful now, but we'll be in lockdown well before the autumn regardless.
 
The issue is about an infection that is less than two years old. My son's girlfriend had COVID in December. She works in health care and has had lateral flow tests twice a week since then, On Sunday, she tested positive again. She's just waiting for a "professional" test to confirm.

The the vaccines are still very new and the testing was very short-term. I do not need the Government or science to tell me that there will be higher risks and false reactions to the vaccines for some time yet. Every vaccine I've received in my life up until now has had years of testing and perhaps decades of use in live environments to iron out issues we are still to eperience with the latest batches.
Slightly incorrect. The testing that the vaccines have gone through is pretty standard. Oxford were already about to implement rape vaccine development. It’s mainly because the tricky part is at the start getting the vaccine to do what it’s meant to do. It doesn’t really need huge amounts of testing once the initial trials have been done. They manage to push out different flu jabs each year as they’re merely modifications of an existing vaccine.

look at any drug that’s out on the market. Once they get to the stage 4 testing (approved for use) they monitor its performance. There’s statistical fliers happening all the time. Nobody for example bothers to make a big news story about the people who die from taking aspirin, paracetamol or the birth control pill. (And people do die from those)

I can’t help but feel that the need to feed the news cycle has resulted in less than capable journalists scratching around for fame hungry scientists to blow Tricia out of all proportion.

when was the last time the media put huge efforts into reporting Mrs Smith from Dunstable had a flu jab and still caught flu? acme pharmaceutical company have modified an existing flu vaccine to deal with a new strain in only 4 months?

Covid is new. It’s not been around before. Because it’s not been around before people haven’t been exposed to it every year like they have with the flu to build up a natural immunity.

i can’t help but feel that there’s sinister forces at play here who don’t want to see an ‘not for profit’ vaccine succeed.
 

Tool

LE
Covid is new. It’s not been around before. Because it’s not been around before people haven’t been exposed to it every year like they have with the flu to build up a natural immunity.

i can’t help but feel that there’s sinister forces at play here who don’t want to see an ‘not for profit’ vaccine succeed.
Mostly what I wrote. I had the OAZ jabs, and do not think they are any better or worse than the other western vaccines. The issues seem to be from the Indian manufacturers not having a handle on quality control, and this is being used as you say for political reasons.

The EU, and by implication Pfizer-Biontech, are definitely dabbing. It is only partially because O-AZ is 1/4 the price oc the others. It is also a Brexit-related knock on. Perfiduous Alba doing what the Mighty EU cannot, would have caused a lot of spluttering over cafe et crossante.

I would be much less confident if I were to have received the Sinovac/s or Sputnic.
 

GDog

Old-Salt
I find it bemusing how glibly people rattle this line off now. Was this ever a concern with any previous vaccine you've ever had? I must have had about 10, as an adult, and this is the first time anyone has mentioned it. Are you fretting about everything else you've ever been vaccinated for as well?

It matters because the public were told the vaccines will stop most transmission, which leads to herd immunity and the end of the pandemic. End the epidemic and everything can go back to normal.

Even if there was no good reason for you personally to take it, you ought to in order to contribute to the wider public health goal of eradicating the epidemic.

This has led to people like myself being widely vilified as 'selfish', 'covidiots' and all the rest by people who are angry about my personal decision to not take the vaccine and so think that I ought to be made to suffer some bureaucratic purgatory via an app as punishment. The last time I chose to have a flu vaccine 2 years ago this was not part of the equation. I resent it being part of the decision this time around.

Anyway, the facts have changed and the vaccines may merely reduce transmission, and between the Indian variant's higher capacity for transmission and the reduced effect of vaccination, herd immunity is now a pipe dream.

If herd immunity is not possible then there's no longer any sense in continuing to push for a mass vaccination campaign backed by coercive threats. The only valid policy objective was to stop the hospitals being overwhelmed and in that regard the vaccines have worked well enough and the relevant people protected by vaccination months ago.

Notwithstanding the vaccines suddenly failing to protect from serious illness - which seems less likely as time goes on - this should all have been over a long time ago.
 
It matters because the public were told the vaccines will stop most transmission, which leads to herd immunity and the end of the pandemic. End the epidemic and everything can go back to normal.

Even if there was no good reason for you personally to take it, you ought to in order to contribute to the wider public health goal of eradicating the epidemic.

This has led to people like myself being widely vilified as 'selfish', 'covidiots' and all the rest by people who are angry about my personal decision to not take the vaccine and so think that I ought to be made to suffer some bureaucratic purgatory via an app as punishment. The last time I chose to have a flu vaccine 2 years ago this was not part of the equation. I resent it being part of the decision this time around.

Anyway, the facts have changed and the vaccines may merely reduce transmission, and between the Indian variant's higher capacity for transmission and the reduced effect of vaccination, herd immunity is now a pipe dream.

If herd immunity is not possible then there's no longer any sense in continuing to push for a mass vaccination campaign backed by coercive threats. The only valid policy objective was to stop the hospitals being overwhelmed and in that regard the vaccines have worked well enough and the relevant people protected by vaccination months ago.

Notwithstanding the vaccines suddenly failing to protect from serious illness - which seems less likely as time goes on - this should all have been over a long time ago.
You are correct.

mass vaccinations of any unknown disease are unlikely to completely eradicate a virus.

considering however that the mass vaccination of the population has resulted in a massive reduction in deaths and hospitalisation I’d say it’s been a complete success on that front.

obviously the tin foil hat brigade will continue to stand by their flawed logic.

however, until such a time as this brand spanking new, never before seen virus mutates several times and enough people have had exposure to enough variants of the virus to build up an immunity, it’s the way forward.

I’m struggling to see what you’re getting at. Are you upset that the vaccination programme has reduced deaths, hospitalisation and transmission?

or are you upset that they haven’t managed first time around to develop a top notch, class a1 vaccine for a completely brand new virus?
 
Seen elsewhere yesterday:

"All UK call signs with military experience you are requested to apply for enrolment with fellow UK ex-military service personnel. We are currently going to March on parliament on the 8th of September headdress to be worn. You will be required to prove military experience. Please remember we only advocate legal forms of protest and resistance. If you are interested then please get in touch with. On Telegram: Royal Marines @bellzaac Army @Juliethotel33 Navy @billybob999 RAF @Thelastpeopleonearth "

HTH
 
Seen elsewhere yesterday:

"All UK call signs with military experience you are requested to apply for enrolment with fellow UK ex-military service personnel. We are currently going to March on parliament on the 8th of September headdress to be worn. You will be required to prove military experience. Please remember we only advocate legal forms of protest and resistance. If you are interested then please get in touch with. On Telegram: Royal Marines @bellzaac Army @Juliethotel33 Navy @billybob999 RAF @Thelastpeopleonearth "

HTH
What’s the March for?
 

964ST

LE
Seen elsewhere yesterday:

"All UK call signs with military experience you are requested to apply for enrolment with fellow UK ex-military service personnel. We are currently going to March on parliament on the 8th of September headdress to be worn. You will be required to prove military experience. Please remember we only advocate legal forms of protest and resistance. If you are interested then please get in touch with. On Telegram: Royal Marines @bellzaac Army @Juliethotel33 Navy @billybob999 RAF @Thelastpeopleonearth "

HTH
I can actually see a small problem/issue with that statement!

“headdress to be worn!“ it opens a whole can of worms.

You will have crossdressing, no underpantwearing, map of Africa, ex-serving experts trying to be a part of the „resistance“,
But no normal respectful contact group of a resistance movement would use „them there“ contact addresses??

although when leaving the military I did have my official contact address as „JockMacPlop@“ which is not good when applying for jobs!

And just to stay on thread, I got my Vaccination (COVID) Passport?? Yesterday. In reality it is a couple of bits of paper with QR codes that you can access an App with, that will allow you to travel (hopefully?). Mad as a Box of Frogs!
 
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I can actually see a small problem/issue with that statement!

“headdress to be worn!“ it opens a whole can of worms.

You will have crossdressing, no underpantwearing, map of Africa, ex-serving experts trying to be a part of the „resistance“,
But no normal respectful contact group of a resistance movement would use „them there“ contact addresses??

although when leaving the military I did have my official contact address as „JockMacPlop@“ which is not good when applying for jobs!

And just to stay on thread, I got my Vaccination (COVID) Passport?? Yesterday. In reality it is a couple of bits of paper with QR codes that you can access an App with, that will allow you to travel (hopefully?). Mad as a Box of Frogs!
I can't see them being any different to the Ulster veterans who turned out recently if done properly.
 

Joker62

ADC
Book Reviewer
Seen elsewhere yesterday:

"All UK call signs with military experience you are requested to apply for enrolment with fellow UK ex-military service personnel. We are currently going to March on parliament on the 8th of September headdress to be worn. You will be required to prove military experience. Please remember we only advocate legal forms of protest and resistance. If you are interested then please get in touch with. On Telegram: Royal Marines @bellzaac Army @Juliethotel33 Navy @billybob999 RAF @Thelastpeopleonearth "

HTH
2 of those Twitter handles (Army & Navy) haven't been in use since they were set up, the Marine one only seems to retweet and, I assume, the RAF one doesn't exist but judging by the name itself, I reckon that they don't won't the RAF there. The march is set for 08/09/21 and they want a Forces vanguard.
 
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