Covid Passports - Yay or ney?

Should we have have Covid passports?


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ches

LE
As I always say when people start talking about conspiracies; as a mid-ranking (ex) civil servant, any conspiracy would require people like me, my friends and my ex-colleagues to support it if the conspiracy was to succeed. The level of cooperation, coordination, competence, control and discretion would be massive.

Believe me, were not that good. (But then I would say that, wouldn’t I...)

As an example of the awesomeness of the people required to successfully support a conspiracy, one of the most organised, intelligent and capable people I ever worked with once went to Scotland with her new boyfriend and asked him where the town of “Atob” was, because a lot of taxis seemed to come from there...

This ^
Conspiracy my arse. It would need a cast of millions & a massively obvious implementation. FFS the govt can't even stop idiots wanting to get a fcuking haircut. Some ppl are reading waaaayyyy too much into the majority of democratic govts struggling to cope despite warnings from the scientific community over many years of something like this happening & said govts knee jerking into generally woolly responses.

There simply isn't the tech capability (on an individual advanced IT skills requirement alone!!), tech infrastructure, tech procurement path to enable anything remotely related to monitoring (via track & trace), or control of the population. The ruckus in Bristol is a clear indication of that, not withstanding the many instances of unrest that haven't made the national news.
 

WightMivvi

War Hero
For most people, the incentive is simply to bring forward the date when we can have some semblance of normality.
If we have to go through another wave of infection and another lockdown because of a refusal to accept "covid passports" it will be akin to cutting our collective noses off to spite our collective face.
Wot ‘e said.

Vaccination passports / certificates are an accelerated route back to normality.
 

Cold_Collation

LE
Book Reviewer
This ^
Conspiracy my arse. It would need a cast of millions & a massively obvious implementation. FFS the govt can't even stop idiots wanting to get a fcuking haircut. Some ppl are reading waaaayyyy too much into the majority of democratic govts struggling to cope despite warnings from the scientific community over many years of something like this happening & said govts knee jerking into generally woolly responses.

There simply isn't the tech capability (on an individual advanced IT skills requirement alone!!), tech infrastructure, tech procurement path to enable anything remotely related to monitoring (via track & trace), or control of the population. The ruckus in Bristol is a clear indication of that, not withstanding the many instances of unrest that haven't made the national news.
Years ago, I was a media officer in the NHS. Local services were going to be radically reorganised and some bitter pills were going to have to be swallowed. We put together a very good, coherent information programme about what needed to happen and why.

On the Wednesday to Friday before the public launch, we briefed over 3,000 staff. Late on Friday night the Department of Health issued an embargo; Labour was going to take a kicking in the European elections and was scared of how many more votes 'we' would cost them.

The following week in the local papers, we got an absolute kicking anyway, but were banned from responding.

In those 3,000 staff were people of all political persuasions, and some were only too keen to stick the boot in.

That's just one healthcare trust. Now multiply that across the whole of the UK Civil Service. Ideas of a conspiracy theory are absolute nonsense.
 

ches

LE
On the question of conspiracy....with the aim of what precisely? The economy has imploded at its fastest rate, almost unprecedented, with the resultant depression. Many thousands have lost their jobs or had to move to lower paid jobs as a result. Local services across all sectors are at breaking point, there is increasing unrest being seen as lockdown continues, there is political discourse across all parties. So, to perpetuate this situation doesn't benefit anyone, let alone the very few who's shaky profile has increased through this crisis. No one benefits with the UK govt or its advisors in falsely extending this situation.

On the flip side, if someone was to postulate with some decent sources rather than fookin facebook that the Chinese deliberately let this thing out of a lab with the intent of crippling western economies while they made hay in the sunshine, then that i would far easier believe than the Illuminati & the lizard ppl in the UK govt are at it again.
 

Cold_Collation

LE
Book Reviewer
On the question of conspiracy....with the aim of what precisely? The economy has imploded at its fastest rate, almost unprecedented, with the resultant depression. Many thousands have lost their jobs or had to move to lower paid jobs as a result. Local services across all sectors are at breaking point, there is increasing unrest being seen as lockdown continues, there is political discourse across all parties. So, to perpetuate this situation doesn't benefit anyone, let alone the very few who's shaky profile has increased through this crisis. No one benefits with the UK govt or its advisors in falsely extending this situation.

On the flip side, if someone was to postulate with some decent sources rather than fookin facebook that the Chinese deliberately let this thing out of a lab with the intent of crippling western economies while they made hay in the sunshine, then that i would far easier believe than the Illuminati & the lizard ppl in the UK govt are at it again.
The Tories are doing alright out of it. It's the poor people who are affected, innit.
 
On the question of conspiracy....with the aim of what precisely? The economy has imploded at its fastest rate, almost unprecedented, with the resultant depression. Many thousands have lost their jobs or had to move to lower paid jobs as a result. Local services across all sectors are at breaking point, there is increasing unrest being seen as lockdown continues, there is political discourse across all parties. So, to perpetuate this situation doesn't benefit anyone, let alone the very few who's shaky profile has increased through this crisis. No one benefits with the UK govt or its advisors in falsely extending this situation.

I think a lot of people have done very well out of lockdown and while those people might recognise, in an abstract, intellectual way, that it can't go on forever, they don't see why they should give up their new leisurely lifestyles quite yet, or their 15 minutes of fame, or their opportunities to one-up their neighbours.
 

Chef

LE
They already have the power.
Passports.
Mental health act.
Judiciary.
RIPA.
None of those have quite the same mass coverage as the Covid Regs 2121 nor got through on the nod.
 

ches

LE
I think a lot of people have done very well out of lockdown and while those people might recognise, in an abstract, intellectual way, that it can't go on forever, they don't see why they should give up their new leisurely lifestyles quite yet, or their 15 minutes of fame, or their opportunities to one-up their neighbours.

Lot of ppl my arse, the only ppl who have benefitted are the low paid who were furloughed & were able to get 100% of their wage while sat on their arses. At the other end of the scale there are a small number who through foresight & entrepreneurial ideas made money from the changes that COVID brought about. Beyond that the average earner/house owner has been pretty savaged by this thing. The majority of those who may have benefitted, those at the bottom end of the wages chain, are certainly not going to be any of those who may have any degree of influence on the propagation of COVID & the associated legislation. So how that can be termed a conspiracy is beyond me.
 
People go on about the amount of money London and other cities have lost. What those people have failed to realise is that money has been ploughed back into local economies, small towns and local traders. So money has been spread around rather than centralised.

And if it is one thing we should take away from this is that local businesses do a great job and to desert them after this has finished would be a great injustice.
 
Lot of ppl my arse, the only ppl who have benefitted are the low paid who were furloughed & were able to get 100% of their wage while sat on their arses. At the other end of the scale there are a small number who through foresight & entrepreneurial ideas made money from the changes that COVID brought about. Beyond that the average earner/house owner has been pretty savaged by this thing. The majority of those who may have benefitted, those at the bottom end of the wages chain, are certainly not going to be any of those who may have any degree of influence on the propagation of COVID & the associated legislation. So how that can be termed a conspiracy is beyond me.

Not at all, plenty of middle and upper-middle class professionals have taken to the working-from-home lifestyle like ducks to water and are not looking forwards to the commuter grind again. Especially those on the public payroll who have little to do and guaranteed job security. They're saving money on season tickets and petrol and firing up the laptop for a couple of hours a day from their gardens (then again in the evening to get drunk on Zoom) and enjoying the finest deliveries that Waitrose and Amazon have to offer. These are the sorts scaremongering on social media, they are having a marvellous time and hope it never ends!
 
None of those have quite the same mass coverage as the Covid Regs 2121 nor got through on the nod.
Merely highlighting that they already have the powers.

In times of national emergency such a wars, pandemics, situations where the health service is in imminent danger of being overwhelmed, these things generally happen with a nod.

you only need to look over the channel to see what happens when you dither.
 

Cold_Collation

LE
Book Reviewer
Not at all, plenty of middle and upper-middle class professionals have taken to the working-from-home lifestyle like ducks to water and are not looking forwards to the commuter grind again. Especially those on the public payroll who have little to do and guaranteed job security. They're saving money on season tickets and petrol and firing up the laptop for a couple of hours a day from their gardens (then again in the evening to get drunk on Zoom) and enjoying the finest deliveries that Waitrose and Amazon have to offer. These are the sorts scaremongering on social media, they are having a marvellous time and hope it never ends!
Stop talking cock. Many of those working from home are working harder than ever. I live with one of them.
 

Chef

LE
Stop talking cock. Many of those working from home are working harder than ever. I live with one of them.
It reminds me of people who got issued mobile phones in the early days.

'Look at me, I'm so important that they've given me a mobile!'

Not realising that firstly they were now available outside of office hours and secondly that the really important people are very hard to find, even in business hours let alone outside them.

Working from home, unless one strictly logs on and off in business hours, seems to bleed through to 'a few minutes' either side of work times. Add those who send e-mails in silent hours as they have no social skills of life outside work and I'm sure lots of people are working extra time whether they want to or not.* It happened to a friend of mine who felt pressured into it. They left because of it.

When I left the site I was done until the next day.

*Not your significant other C_C.
 

Cold_Collation

LE
Book Reviewer
It reminds me of people who got issued mobile phones in the early days.

'Look at me, I'm so important that they've given me a mobile!'

Not realising that firstly they were now available outside of office hours and secondly that the really important people are very hard to find, even in business hours let alone outside them.

Working from home, unless one strictly logs on and off in business hours, seems to bleed through to 'a few minutes' either side of work times. Add those who send e-mails in silent hours as they have no social skills of life outside work and I'm sure lots of people are working extra time whether they want to or not.* It happened to a friend of mine who felt pressured into it. They left because of it.

When I left the site I was done until the next day.

*Not your significant other C_C.
Re. the bold:

A friend of mine from some years ago was PA to the Queen of Jordan. Prior to that, she was PA to some very senior execs.

She described her job as keeping people away - “It’s very important for people at certain levels to just have thinking time.”

Re. the rest:

I‘ve worked from home for eight years now. As people are now discovering, or have over the last year, it’s very difficult to punctuate your day. The joke here has been, “Is it wine o’clock yet?”

It’s very difficult to punctuate the day when gyms and everything else are shut. My usual gambit is a mid-morning run/core workout session. Otherwise, the day just drifts and the days just merge.
 

Chef

LE
Re. the bold:

A friend of mine from some years ago was PA to the Queen of Jordan. Prior to that, she was PA to some very senior execs.

She described her job as keeping people away - “It’s very important for people at certain levels to just have thinking time.”

Re. the rest:

I‘ve worked from home for eight years now. As people are now discovering, or have over the last year, it’s very difficult to punctuate your day. The joke here has been, “Is it wine o’clock yet?”

It’s very difficult to punctuate the day when gyms and everything else are shut. My usual gambit is a mid-morning run/core workout session. Otherwise, the day just drifts and the days just merge.
Similar to Mrs Chef who's worked from home for several years. Sometimes work will stretch out, it's a multi-national multi-time zone company. But she's been able to keep work and home life separate. It helps to have a dedicated workroom, a luxury a lot of folk don't have the space for.

The friend who left due to mickey taking is doing a similar job but is very careful to wear work clothes and change at the end of the working day. It makes a difference. Also the new company is much better at the 9-5 philosophy.
 
It reminds me of people who got issued mobile phones in the early days.

'Look at me, I'm so important that they've given me a mobile!'

Not realising that firstly they were now available outside of office hours and secondly that the really important people are very hard to find, even in business hours let alone outside them.

Working from home, unless one strictly logs on and off in business hours, seems to bleed through to 'a few minutes' either side of work times. Add those who send e-mails in silent hours as they have no social skills of life outside work and I'm sure lots of people are working extra time whether they want to or not.* It happened to a friend of mine who felt pressured into it. They left because of it.

When I left the site I was done until the next day.

*Not your significant other C_C.
I’ve found working from home has improved my productivity. We still have managers who are against it, but that’s more driven by lack of talent by the managers.

Only a fool sends out emails late are night. You can set outlook out to send your emails out at a pre determined time. I regularly compare my emails and send them out a few hours after I finish.
 
We have been running the company from home for the last 13 months, the Directors have decided that people only need to do a couple of days in the office. It has worked for us really well.
 

Chef

LE
I’ve found working from home has improved my productivity. We still have managers who are against it, but that’s more driven by lack of talent by the managers.

Only a fool sends out emails late are night. You can set outlook out to send your emails out at a pre determined time. I regularly compare my emails and send them out a few hours after I finish.
I suspect that some who are against it are those who manage the office rather than the people in it. You don't need a stationery monitor if you no longer have a stationery cupboard.

It'll require a major change in some people to get used to working from home and probably a major upheaval in taxes, insurance, employer's liability and H&S as well. I should imagine that some homes are simply not fit to be used as a permanent workplace.
 

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