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Corona, the mess bill

I was reading a few things today that just jarred immediately and set me thinking, which is always dangerous.

Apparently the treasury has spent £280Bn on its immediate Coranavirus measures, with no short-term likelihood of an end to the farago that is the lockdown cycle. The economic knock-ons are unpredictable, but promise to be eye-watering too. Boris said today that there are no plans to increase income tax, VAT or NI to help balance the books. Somehow, they are going to find a magic way of paying down the costs.

Of course it is not only the UK that has this issue, pretty much every other country is in a similar position.

The Germans have a handy precedent, which still lurks on their law books. It was called the 'Lastenausgleichsgesetz' (Burden equalisation law) and was used to get the country running again after the war, along with Marshall Plan money. In its simplest form, anyone who owned property or had any money (In any form: Savings, investments, bonds, debt or credit) had to pay 50-90% of it to the government in the form of a backdated tax. The society as a whole was to benefit. This is still in the federal Grundgesetz (Basic law) Article 14.3, whereby the government cannot confiscate any legally acquired wealth or property from anyone...at all...under any circumstances...whatsoever ... unless the government decides it is for the general good of society. Worryingly, a few senior politicians have been flying this kite again recently, especially the socialists and the greens.

I remember before the GE in UK last year our Green party suggesting that their government would take all savings and wealth above a certain value in exchange for government bonds, as they were sure that the public wouldn't mind their idle cash being put to good use for the community, especially the building of a green economy.

For me the whole thing is a glaring hole in any discourse or policy around the current pandemic, but the question will not go away. Who exactly is going to pay this tab and how?
 
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I'm sure that all parties are reluctant to tax themselves, the upper echelons will be alright, it'd be us workers that take the hit in the arrse like a ruptured 'roid, the gold digging corrupt cxxts
 
I was reading a few things today that just jarred immediately and set me thinking, which is always dangerous.

Apparently the treasury has spent £280Bn on its immediate Coranavirus measures, with no short-term likelihood of an end to the farago that is the lockdown cycle. The economic knock-ons are unpredictable, but promise to be eye-watering too. Boris said today that there are no plans to increase income tax, VAT or NI to help balance the books. Somehow, they are going to find a magic way of paying down the costs.

Of course it is not only the UK that has this issue, pretty much every other country is in a similar position.

The Germans have a handy precedent, which still lurks on their law books. It was called the 'Lastenausgleichsgesetz' (Burden equalisation law) and was used to get the country running again after the war, along with Marshall Plan money. In its simplest form, anyone who owned property or had any money (In any form: Savings, investments, bonds, debt or credit) had to pay 50-90% of it to the government in the form of a backdated tax. The society as a whole was to benefit. This is still in the federal Grundgesetz (Basic law) Article 14.3, whereby the government cannot confiscate any legally acquired wealth or property from anyone...at all...under any circumstances...whatsoever ... unless it is for the general good of society. Worryingly, a few senior politicians have been flying this kite again recently, especially the socialists and the greens.

I remember before the GE in UK last year our Green party suggesting that their government would take all savings and wealth above a certain value in exchange for government bonds, as they were sure that the public wouldn't mind their idle cash being put to good use for the community, especially the building of a green economy.

For me the whole thing is a glaring hole in any discourse or policy around the current pandemic, but the question will not go away. Who exactly is going to pay this tab and how?

That’s a shít idea. I doubt even the German’s would invoke it now. It won’t get though parliament with a Tory capitalist government and even if Labour were in power I doubt their multi millionaire leader would go for it.
 

pc flaps

War Hero
My speculation is it'll be kept off books in some way though I don't know how they'll do that. There is a precedent: In the financial crisis the govt kept two official budget numbers: both with and without "financial interventions" (bank bailouts). The bailouts were off books, not offically part of the deficit number, though we had to sell gilts to finance them.

Once the effects of the furlough and other support have worked through (this will dribble into the next tax year as I doubt it'll really all be over by April) in theory the annual deficit goes back close to the pre-Covid number (around £50 Billion). Though it'll be higher (unless spending falls and / or taxes rise) due to increased payment of unemployment benefits.

What's shot up is the overall amount of debt we owe, and the Covid-related part is so huge (rise of £390 billion in one year) I doubt it'll ever be paid off. As everyone's in the same boat, maybe there'll be an international agreement to not count covid-related debt in any country's budget numbers?

But as for ever paying it off, I don't see it happening in our lifetimes.
 
When I was just a little girl I asked my mother, what will I be? Will I be pretty, will I be rich, here's what she said to me. Que Sera, Sera, whatever will be, will be, the future's not ours, to see que Sera, Sera.

Governments, taking your money and using it very poorly for generations.
 
FFS how much do you think the War to end all wars cost ?
And after that an Influenza Pandemic that killed another x millions of europeans.
And then ... lets have another war .
Massive life lost and inconceivable amounts of dosh to finance it.
The fact is .... this money never existed.

( and while we are at it) .......

Some ******** came up with this pathetic explanation called ' Quantitative Easing ' which was going to make everything all right.

Well its bollocks , just another version of the Emperers new clothes.

It is time to balance the books, in more ways than one
 
When I was just a little girl I asked my mother, what will I be? Will I be pretty, will I be rich, here's what she said to me. Que Sera, Sera, whatever will be, will be, the future's not ours, to see que Sera, Sera.

Governments, taking your money and using it very poorly for generations.
That's because successive governments need to be kept in powdered wigs and pipe tobacco!!
 

Gout Man

LE
Book Reviewer
Council tax increases by at least 5% has been talked about, that’ll make your eyes water, well it will mine.
This is one tax I really detest paying. Mine will be around £220 a month and I don’t even have street lighting, my black rubbish gets collected once every three weeks, the local library is hopeless yet the county council have a huge lovely modern office complex all paid for by my fellow council tax payers and full of people doing what?
I only see a copper with speed guns, it’s robbery this council tax.
 
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The cut in overseas aid was a start. It should have been cut more,and then directed at those who really need it. But at the risk of sounding like a filtheee communist, the banks should be made do the heavy lifting on this one. They were pulled out of the smelly by the taxpayers in banking crisis. Its payback time now.
 
The cut in overseas aid was a start. It should have been cut more,and then directed at those who really need it. But at the risk of sounding like a filtheee communist, the banks should be made do the heavy lifting on this one. They were pulled out of the smelly by the taxpayers in banking crisis. Its payback time now.

I think that you will find that the Banks are in no position to help the taxpayer

Archie
 
I was reading a few things today that just jarred immediately and set me thinking, which is always dangerous.

Apparently the treasury has spent £280Bn on its immediate Coranavirus measures, with no short-term likelihood of an end to the farago that is the lockdown cycle. The economic knock-ons are unpredictable, but promise to be eye-watering too. Boris said today that there are no plans to increase income tax, VAT or NI to help balance the books. Somehow, they are going to find a magic way of paying down the costs.

Of course it is not only the UK that has this issue, pretty much every other country is in a similar position.

The Germans have a handy precedent, which still lurks on their law books. It was called the 'Lastenausgleichsgesetz' (Burden equalisation law) and was used to get the country running again after the war, along with Marshall Plan money. In its simplest form, anyone who owned property or had any money (In any form: Savings, investments, bonds, debt or credit) had to pay 50-90% of it to the government in the form of a backdated tax. The society as a whole was to benefit. This is still in the federal Grundgesetz (Basic law) Article 14.3, whereby the government cannot confiscate any legally acquired wealth or property from anyone...at all...under any circumstances...whatsoever ... unless the government decides it is for the general good of society. Worryingly, a few senior politicians have been flying this kite again recently, especially the socialists and the greens.

I remember before the GE in UK last year our Green party suggesting that their government would take all savings and wealth above a certain value in exchange for government bonds, as they were sure that the public wouldn't mind their idle cash being put to good use for the community, especially the building of a green economy.

For me the whole thing is a glaring hole in any discourse or policy around the current pandemic, but the question will not go away. Who exactly is going to pay this tab and how?
No idea about the UK,but i think the Germans will just continue paying the ''Solidaritätszuschlag'' which was used to pay for the rebuilding of East germany. As Ex East Germany now positively gleams they will probably use the cash to pay for Covid 19.
 
Council tax increases by at least 5% has been talked about, that’ll make your eyes water, well it will mine.
This is one tax I really detest paying. Mine will be around £220 a month and I don’t even have street lighting, my black rubbish gets collected once every three weeks, the local library is hopeless yet the county council have a huge lovely modern office complex all paid for by my fellow council tax payers and full of people doing what?
I only see a copper with speed guns, it’s robbery this council tax.
I share your anger. We live out in the sticks and certainly don’t seem to get any value from our ever increasing monthly Council Tax bill. The really annoying thing to me was the ‘additional’ £50 annual service charge I had to sign up to during lockdown so the robbing bar stewards would collect my green waste every fortnight. Prior to COVID, I did all my own recycling at the local site - try getting a slot there at the moment. So I am now reliant on the fortnightly bin collections of various colours. That’s not a pop at the binmen (bin persons?) by the way, who do a sterling job.
Meanwhile, the majority of the Council office/Admin staff remain WFH on full salaries.
Wiltshire Council = Robbing Bastards!
 

chrisg46

LE
Book Reviewer
I imagine it will go the same way as the debt from the two world wars, and the compensation to the Slave owners (which apparently has only recently been paid off). In about 100 years time, our descendants will read a minor story along the lines "Remember the Great Covid Pandemic of 2020 that you were taught about? Well, we made the last payment today!"
 
When I was just a little girl I asked my mother, what will I be? Will I be pretty, will I be rich, here's what she said to me. Que Sera, Sera, whatever will be, will be, the future's not ours, to see que Sera, Sera.

Governments, taking your money and using it very poorly for generations.
Doris Day walt.
 

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