• This is a stand-to for an incoming competition, one of our most expensive yet.
    Later this week we're going to be offering the opportunity to Win £270 Rab Neutrino Pro military down jacket
    Visit the thread at that link above and Watch it to be notified as soon as the competition goes live

Concealed Weapons- Making America Safer?

#1
Oops a daisy:

http://www.sun-sentinel.com/news/na...s-ap-florida-concealed-weapons,0,954678.story

Paper: Fla. Gives Gun Permits to Felons

FORT LAUDERDALE, Fla. -- Hundreds of criminals were able to obtain concealed weapons permits in Florida because of loopholes, errors and miscommunication, a newspaper reported Sunday.

An analysis of state records show the roughly 410,000 Floridians licensed to carry hidden guns included 1,400 who had pleaded guilty or no contest to felonies, 216 with outstanding warrants, 128 named in active domestic violence injunctions and six registered sex offenders, the South Florida Sun-Sentinel reported.

"I had no idea," said Baker County Sheriff Joey Dobson, who sits on an advisory panel for the state Division of Licensing, which issues permits for carrying concealed weapons. "I think the system, somewhere down the line, is broken. I guarantee you the ordinary person doesn't know (that) ... and I'd venture to guess that 160 legislators in Florida don't know that, either."

The newspaper obtained the names of people on the state's concealed weapons permit list shortly before state lawmakers sealed it from public scrutiny July 1.

Marion Hammer, a Tallahassee lobbyist for the National Rifle Association, blamed law enforcement gaps, "bleeding-heart, criminal-coddling judges and prosecutors" for missteps that put guns in the hands of criminals.

Critics, however, say the NRA pressures lawmakers to ignore the problem.

"The people who are intimately familiar with these laws, the people at the NRA, they know exactly what's going on," said Kristen Rand, legislative director of the nonprofit Violence Policy Center. Florida's gun lobby and the program's administrators "know they're permitting some bad people, but they don't want the general public to know that."

The newspaper said it found that concealed weapons permits have soared from roughly 25,000 in 1987, the first year carrying a concealed gun was legal in Florida, to more than 410,000.

In Miami-Dade County, the number of licenses jumped from 2,200 to 42,521 as of Dec. 31, and in Broward County, which includes Fort Lauderdale, it went from 25 to 35,884.

"That's an alarming increase," Coral Springs Police Chief Duncan Foster said.
 
#2
#4
Out of interest, I wonder how many of them were actually Floridians? FL issues non-resident permits.

Still, couple of gaps in the system need plugging, but overall, not a major issue.

NTM
 
#5
Not too mention:

Lists of names. I can GURANTEE you that paper didn't do one, single, solitary confirmation of who had arrest records, who had outstanding warrants, etc.

How many John Smith's are their in Florida? So John Smith has a warrant and his name matches someone on the "list." Bam. Another one to chaulk up to the ole anti gun crowd.

Fools buy into it, without checking any further facts or corrobating anything.

Oh, but Phil, some of those have to be real? No shit? Really? How many true life criminals get guns anyway? Golly gee whiz Phil. We really live in a violent society like that? You mean where criminals will really break the law and get a gun, no matter what is written on a piece of paper? Say it isn't so...

Oh, yeah, the gun ban in England is doing real well too. Violent, gun use crime in in the UK has really gone down...
 
#6
Well, it has your "brothers" in "LE" down there concerned. I don't know in the grand scale of things how big of a difference an extra 1,500 criminals with a permit to carry concealed weapons makes in the vortex of retardation that is the Sunshine State, but I do find it rather odd that the law and the bureaucracy in Florida seems to be configured so that a felon can carry, but he can't cast a vote in an election.
 
#7
Phil306 said:
Not too mention:

Lists of names. I can GURANTEE you that paper didn't do one, single, solitary confirmation of who had arrest records, who had outstanding warrants, etc.

How many John Smith's are their in Florida? So John Smith has a warrant and his name matches someone on the "list." Bam. Another one to chaulk up to the ole anti gun crowd.

Fools buy into it, without checking any further facts or corrobating anything.

Oh, but Phil, some of those have to be real? No s***? Really? How many true life criminals get guns anyway? Golly gee whiz Phil. We really live in a violent society like that? You mean where criminals will really break the law and get a gun, no matter what is written on a piece of paper? Say it isn't so...

Oh, yeah, the gun ban in England is doing real well too. Violent, gun use crime in in the UK has really gone down...
And I suppose you have evidence of this, Phil. Or is it just conjecture? Either way, I imagine the Governor and the Legislature will be taking a good look at what's been uncovered. I guess we'll see how right you are then.
 
#8


;-)
 
#9
At least they have some idea who the felons are. they can withdraw the permits.

Imagine if it was our Home office! They wouldnt even know how many and to whom they had wrongly issued permits to!
 
#10
Dogface said:
Ahh, such a thread started by an academian in California not even allowed to exercise his right of choice, one way or the other, about the matter which he posts. Surprise. Surprise. :roll:
Depends on what county he's in. Most California counties are effectively 'shall issue.'

NTM
 
#11
California_Tanker said:
Dogface said:
Ahh, such a thread started by an academian in California not even allowed to exercise his right of choice, one way or the other, about the matter which he posts. Surprise. Surprise. :roll:
Depends on what county he's in. Most California counties are effectively 'shall issue.'

NTM
As I recall, he lives in near SF, CA. (Northern California?) This city and California in general can be pretty restrictive, on types of firearms allowed and/or issue of a CWP. :thumbdown:
 
#12
Wrong- yet again.
 
#13
Crab,

You have NO CLUE what you are talking about. MOST places in California, a CCW is IMPOSSIBLE to get. ANYWHERE.

I work as a police officer in Northern California. In 17 years, I have NEVER seen a CCW permit. EVER.

You have no clue what you are talking about. You are just another anti gun idiot, spewing their agenda.
 
#14
Phil306 said:
Crab,

You have NO CLUE what you are talking about. MOST places in California, a CCW is IMPOSSIBLE to get. ANYWHERE.

I work as a police officer in Northern California. In 17 years, I have NEVER seen a CCW permit. EVER.

You have no clue what you are talking about. You are just another anti gun idiot, spewing their agenda.
It's a (thankfully) rare person who can contradict themselves in just 11 words:

MOST places in California, a CCW is IMPOSSIBLE to get. ANYWHERE.
Reading is fun, Phil. Scroll up and take a look. I didn't say anything about California state and local laws. That was a point raised by California_Tanker. I was referring to Trip_wire's assertion that I lived in the Bay area, nothing more. (And I'm rather tickled by the fact that in all the time he has spent taking up far too much room on this earth, he is so ignorant of the geography of his own country that he is still unsure whether San Fran is in Northern California or not. You're a real sharp one Trip, real sharp. ;) )

As I recall, he lives in near SF, CA. (Northern California?)
Secondly, at no point on this thread have I made explicit criticism of right to carry laws. The article is actually about the ineptitude of the Floridian bureaucracy. You guys merely assumed that the point I was wishing to make was associated with the gun-control agenda and not that Floridians have the cognitive capacity of a staple gun. Can that tell us something about your subconsciouses, or does it just tell us that you're not much good at things like reading comprehension? Surely even the most avid supporters of "Shall issue" laws when it comes to concealed weapons would concede that giving them to convicted felons and sex offenders probably isn't the most sensible move one can make.

Now, do you have any evidence to back up your otherwise baseless claims that the journalists have fabricated and embellished their story? Didn't think so.

If you have an attention span that allows you to read anything longer and more detailed than the menu at Krispy Kreme, Phil, I suggest you dig out the full article, which IIRC, is about 3-4 pages. The revelations seem to have your colleagues in Florida most upset.
 
#15
Phil306 said:
Crab,

You have NO CLUE what you are talking about. MOST places in California, a CCW is IMPOSSIBLE to get. ANYWHERE.

I work as a police officer in Northern California. In 17 years, I have NEVER seen a CCW permit. EVER.
Probably because CCW holders tend to be law-abiding and wouldn't run afoul of you.

Not sure if Dublin is in Contra Costa or Alameda, but between the two counties there are about 600 CCW permits. Not many, but more than Santa Clara (190) or San Francisco (10). On the other hand, CCWs in Fresno county numbers about 3,000. I'm in Madera as I type this, over 1,000 of Madera's 124,000 residents of all ages have CCWs. Mendocino's Sheriff's stated policy is "Shall issue if no legal disqualification." Even pot-filled Humbolt county has a Sherrif who generally just signs away. Only the enlightened denizens of the Bay Area really try to avoid CCWs. The stupid thing is that they're state-wide, so a Mendocino person can carry a gun in San Jose when visiting, but I live there and I can't.

NTM
 

New Posts

Latest Threads

Top