Clarification regarding “forced” mobilisation in reserves?

[Anonrecruit890]

Hi all,

I am due to join the Army Reserve in the near future (not stating which corp / regiment, although it is not the infantry).

I have been trying to get a clear answer in regards to being mobilised while in the Army Reserve.

It is pointless ringing up the recruitment line (which I assume Capita are running) as they have no clue over anything aside from answering very basic general questions (and will actually open the British Army website and start reading off things word for word to answer you if they don’t know the answer, under the impression you are not aware it exists).

I have asked my unit a few times but I can’t seem to get a clear answer, it usually ends up with one of the below answers:

- They start answering it and then drift off to another topic

- Make a joke out of the answer “just fake an injury and they’ll let you off”

- They come out with “why are you joining up if you have no intention of going to war?” and in general will guilt-trip me for asking the question

Please note that I am not intending to dodge or “run away” from a mobilisation should one occur, I would just like to know what the chances are, where in the world I could expect to be deployed at this point in time and so I know what to tell my employer (whom my day job is with) so that there is assurance on their side as to what the situation is.

For deployments / operations, I am aware that the regular army is prioritised first, followed by ex-regulars in the reserves, followed by reserves who have opted into the “High Alert Readiness” programme, followed by standard reservists only (I’m aware there are many MoD staff who are former armed forces serving who could be called up amongst all this also).

So taking the above into account (and the current state of world affairs), the chances of myself being mobilised are fairly “low – minimal”, right? I am not intending to opt into the “High Alert Readiness” programme so even if there was a need to pull resources from the reserves, it would make sense for someone who has already committed into “High Alert Readiness” and is better prepared to go and be called up compared to someone who is not.

I would like to finish that I am not joining the Army Reserve to “get free stuff”, nor am I joining to do the bare minimum (although there is in theory nothing wrong with that as long as you meet the minimum requirement). I am intending to ask for extra days a year and to go on as many activities, courses and events that are available to me at the time. I just want clarification on the mobilisation situation for myself and my employer in my day job.

Thank you

 

[dingerr]

I don’t think this totally answers your question, but it may go some way.

Rights and responsibilities for reservists and employers

 

[theblindking]

Hi all,

I am due to join the Army Reserve in the near future (not stating which corp / regiment, although it is not the infantry).

I have been trying to get a clear answer in regards to being mobilised while in the Army Reserve.

It is pointless ringing up the recruitment line (which I assume Capita are running) as they have no clue over anything aside from answering very basic general questions (and will actually open the British Army website and start reading off things word for word to answer you if they don’t know the answer, under the impression you are not aware it exists).

I have asked my unit a few times but I can’t seem to get a clear answer, it usually ends up with one of the below answers:

- They start answering it and then drift off to another topic

- Make a joke out of the answer “just fake an injury and they’ll let you off”

- They come out with “why are you joining up if you have no intention of going to war?” and in general will guilt-trip me for asking the question

Please note that I am not intending to dodge or “run away” from a mobilisation should one occur, I would just like to know what the chances are, where in the world I could expect to be deployed at this point in time and so I know what to tell my employer (whom my day job is with) so that there is assurance on their side as to what the situation is.

For deployments / operations, I am aware that the regular army is prioritised first, followed by ex-regulars in the reserves, followed by reserves who have opted into the “High Alert Readiness” programme, followed by standard reservists only (I’m aware there are many MoD staff who are former armed forces serving who could be called up amongst all this also).

So taking the above into account (and the current state of world affairs), the chances of myself being mobilised are fairly “low – minimal”, right? I am not intending to opt into the “High Alert Readiness” programme so even if there was a need to pull resources from the reserves, it would make sense for someone who has already committed into “High Alert Readiness” and is better prepared to go and be called up compared to someone who is not.

I would like to finish that I am not joining the Army Reserve to “get free stuff”, nor am I joining to do the bare minimum (although there is in theory nothing wrong with that as long as you meet the minimum requirement). I am intending to ask for extra days a year and to go on as many activities, courses and events that are available to me at the time. I just want clarification on the mobilisation situation for myself and my employer in my day job.

Thank you

Right. So this is kind of piece of string question. Simply put, your liability for compulsory (not "forced" which is problematic in it's own right) mobilisation is contained within the Reserve Forces Act 1996 - knock yourself out.

If you cannot (or won't) subject yourself to this obligation under the laws of the realm, you'd be advised to have a good hard think as these are changing times.

 

[Spec-op1989]

I wouldn't trust Capita to breathe in and out in the right order, you're doing a sensible thing coming here.


Not a frequently used sentence, that last.

 

[God-fearing Pagan]

@Anonrecruit890 current deployments are generally able to generate the bulk of manpower from the regulars. Deficits are usually able to be met by Reservists who volunteer themselves in response to a ‘Trawl’ usually advertised in Orders.
Some niche/specialist troops may find themselves compulsorarily mobilised but current ops don’t demand this that often and where they do it is known and planned for as much as possible/people can be bothered.
Obviously, if something big kicks off then that can change if we need to generate lots of troops.
I think the AR’s Terms & Conditions of Ssrvice (TACOS) state that reservists cannot deploy more than once per five year period (unless they volunteer themselves for additional tours).

Short answer: it’s not often currently but Be prepared should something big happen.

 

[CRmeansCeilingReached]

Hi all,

I am due to join the Army Reserve in the near future (not stating which corp / regiment, although it is not the infantry).

I have been trying to get a clear answer in regards to being mobilised while in the Army Reserve.

It is pointless ringing up the recruitment line (which I assume Capita are running) as they have no clue over anything aside from answering very basic general questions (and will actually open the British Army website and start reading off things word for word to answer you if they don’t know the answer, under the impression you are not aware it exists).

I have asked my unit a few times but I can’t seem to get a clear answer, it usually ends up with one of the below answers:

- They start answering it and then drift off to another topic

- Make a joke out of the answer “just fake an injury and they’ll let you off”

- They come out with “why are you joining up if you have no intention of going to war?” and in general will guilt-trip me for asking the question

Please note that I am not intending to dodge or “run away” from a mobilisation should one occur, I would just like to know what the chances are, where in the world I could expect to be deployed at this point in time and so I know what to tell my employer (whom my day job is with) so that there is assurance on their side as to what the situation is.

For deployments / operations, I am aware that the regular army is prioritised first, followed by ex-regulars in the reserves, followed by reserves who have opted into the “High Alert Readiness” programme, followed by standard reservists only (I’m aware there are many MoD staff who are former armed forces serving who could be called up amongst all this also).

So taking the above into account (and the current state of world affairs), the chances of myself being mobilised are fairly “low – minimal”, right? I am not intending to opt into the “High Alert Readiness” programme so even if there was a need to pull resources from the reserves, it would make sense for someone who has already committed into “High Alert Readiness” and is better prepared to go and be called up compared to someone who is not.

I would like to finish that I am not joining the Army Reserve to “get free stuff”, nor am I joining to do the bare minimum (although there is in theory nothing wrong with that as long as you meet the minimum requirement). I am intending to ask for extra days a year and to go on as many activities, courses and events that are available to me at the time. I just want clarification on the mobilisation situation for myself and my employer in my day job.

Thank you

Forget likelihood. Are you willing to mobilise?

If not, then go join a darts league or something.

 

[Anonrecruit890]

I don’t think this totally answers your question, but it may go some way.

Rights and responsibilities for reservists and employers

Thanks. Yes I've had a good read through that. It's helpful knowing the options you have, though I'm more just going into the general chances of being "called up" compared to the regulars and other reservists who are more prepared and in a better shape to go than me.

Right. So this is kind of piece of string question. Simply put, your liability for compulsory (not "forced" which is problematic in it's own right) mobilisation is contained within the Reserve Forces Act 1996 - knock yourself out.

If you cannot (or won't) subject yourself to this obligation under the laws of the realm, you'd be advised to have a good hard think as these are changing times.

I'm aware of the laws and the fact that I can ultimately be called up no matter what if something horrific goes down (obvious). My question is more for the general current state of affairs at the moment in the world with current deployments / operations, I'm aware if something like World War III broke out it is quite likely nearly the entire bulk of the reserves could end up having to go (although of course God forbid this would ever happen).

I wouldn't trust Capita to breathe in and out in the right order, you're doing a sensible thing coming here.


Not a frequently used sentence, that last.

Yeah they're not great, my application has been taking ages.

@Anonrecruit890 current deployments are generally able to generate the bulk of manpower from the regulars. Deficits are usually able to be met by Reservists who volunteer themselves in response to a ‘Trawl’ usually advertised in Orders.
Some niche/specialist troops may find themselves compulsorarily mobilised but current ops don’t demand this that often and where they do it is known and planned for as much as possible/people can be bothered.
Obviously, if something big kicks off then that can change if we need to generate lots of troops.
I think the AR’s Terms & Conditions of Ssrvice (TACOS) state that reservists cannot deploy more than once per five year period (unless they volunteer themselves for additional tours).

Short answer: it’s not often currently but Be prepared should something big happen.

The corp / role I'm going into isn't really anything unique or something there are only a "select few" of, there will be plenty others in the same role as me. Would you say it's pretty much regulars / reservists who "want to do it" that are going on them currently?

Forget likelihood. Are you willing to mobilise?

If not, then go join a darts league or something.

I probably should have mentioned that I am somewhat debating joining the Army full-time at the moment, I'm still unsure if I want to commit to it all or stick with my day civilian job for now.

My general question here is joining the Army Reserve and getting mobilised fairly often and my employer kicks off and goes apeshit that I keep getting "sent away" for periods at a time and I could be put in a situation where I would have to leave the Army Reserve or find another day job in civilian life that would accommodate me being called up X amount of times. Obviously there's my family to deal with also if I get sent to a dangerous place (although the same can be said there for most people who join up).

Thanks for all the replies so far all.

 

[Daxx]

If you join the AR, you are subject to compulsory mobilisation. It's quite simple really.

 

[cowgoesmoo]

My general question here is joining the Army Reserve and getting mobilised fairly often and my employer kicks off and goes apeshit that I keep getting "sent away" for periods at a time and I could be put in a situation where I would have to leave the Army Reserve or find another day job in civilian life that would accommodate me being called up X amount of times. Obviously there's my family to deal with also if I get sent to a dangerous place (although the same can be said there for most people who join up).

Thanks for all the replies so far all.

Highly improbable that you'd be frequently mobilised unless you actively volunteered for it. Just be aware it's something that could happen in theory but very unlikely to happen in practice. Last I saw was a vision of reservists being available for a deployment once every 3-5 years, and that was only if a suitable role was available and everybody was willing.

The last widespread compulsory mobilisation was Iraq 2003 as we were already committed in Afghan. With the current defence budget in ruins and a lack of appetite for foreign adventures by Joe Public there is no chance of 2 simultaneous campaigns happening again anytime soon. The army is aware of the need to keep civi employers on side so try not to antagonise them by making unreasonable demands on reservists.

 

[Ravers]

Obviously it varies massively from unit to unit, role to role, arm to arm etc.

I’ve been a reservist for nearly 12 years (both Army and Navy) and in that time I’ve never seen anyone mobilised who didn’t volunteer for it.

 

[theblindking]

Thanks. Yes I've had a good read through that. It's helpful knowing the options you have, though I'm more just going into the general chances of being "called up" compared to the regulars and other reservists who are more prepared and in a better shape to go than me.
I'm aware of the laws and the fact that I can ultimately be called up no matter what if something horrific goes down (obvious). My question is more for the general current state of affairs at the moment in the world with current deployments / operations, I'm aware if something like World War III broke out it is quite likely nearly the entire bulk of the reserves could end up having to go (although of course God forbid this would ever happen).
Yeah they're not great, my application has been taking ages.
The corp / role I'm going into isn't really anything unique or something there are only a "select few" of, there will be plenty others in the same role as me. Would you say it's pretty much regulars / reservists who "want to do it" that are going on them currently?
I probably should have mentioned that I am somewhat debating joining the Army full-time at the moment, I'm still unsure if I want to commit to it all or stick with my day civilian job for now.

My general question here is joining the Army Reserve and getting mobilised fairly often and my employer kicks off and goes apeshit that I keep getting "sent away" for periods at a time and I could be put in a situation where I would have to leave the Army Reserve or find another day job in civilian life that would accommodate me being called up X amount of times. Obviously there's my family to deal with also if I get sent to a dangerous place (although the same can be said there for most people who join up).

Thanks for all the replies so far all.

I think everyone who has responded to your original post understands the frame of reference that you have applied to it.

What you are asking here is effectively what will the weather be like like in six months time and you have been told to carry an umbrella.

That's it. Pure and simple. What has happened in the past is irrelevent and your idea that you may only be cumpulsoralily mobilised "if something horrific happens" suggests that you may need a bit of a read up on the current state of UK defence and the wider world.

I am trying to be helpful here but having spent some time in a phase 2 training establishment where the majority of soldiers desperately wanted to mobilise (and had limited opportunities to do so), your apparent unwillingness to do so - voluntarily - is causing me issues.

 

[DB216LOKDVR]

If your that concerned about mobilisation then perhaps the Army Reserve is not for you.

However if you wish to do military activities and get paid for it and you can only commit at the weekends, evenings and for 2 weeks in the summer then consider joining the ACF/CCF as a Adult Instructor.

Depending on your location, civi job, qualifications and shortage of Adults Instructors in your region you may be able to attain a ACF Commission (used to be Class B Commission with a call up liability but normally they were at the bottom of the list/last resort).

This is a genuine response based on my own experiences as a former member of a Training Team in the TA.

Why would the Army Reserve wish to pay you, equip you and train you if you do not wish to deploy/mobilise?

 

[Spec-op1989]

Thanks. Yes I've had a good read through that. It's helpful knowing the options you have, though I'm more just going into the general chances of being "called up" compared to the regulars and other reservists who are more prepared and in a better shape to go than me.
I'm aware of the laws and the fact that I can ultimately be called up no matter what if something horrific goes down (obvious). My question is more for the general current state of affairs at the moment in the world with current deployments / operations, I'm aware if something like World War III broke out it is quite likely nearly the entire bulk of the reserves could end up having to go (although of course God forbid this would ever happen).
Yeah they're not great, my application has been taking ages.
The corp / role I'm going into isn't really anything unique or something there are only a "select few" of, there will be plenty others in the same role as me. Would you say it's pretty much regulars / reservists who "want to do it" that are going on them currently?
I probably should have mentioned that I am somewhat debating joining the Army full-time at the moment, I'm still unsure if I want to commit to it all or stick with my day civilian job for now.

My general question here is joining the Army Reserve and getting mobilised fairly often and my employer kicks off and goes apeshit that I keep getting "sent away" for periods at a time and I could be put in a situation where I would have to leave the Army Reserve or find another day job in civilian life that would accommodate me being called up X amount of times. Obviously there's my family to deal with also if I get sent to a dangerous place (although the same can be said there for most people who join up).

Thanks for all the replies so far all.

What is your civvy job?

 

[Anonrecruit890]

Highly improbable that you'd be frequently mobilised unless you actively volunteered for it. Just be aware it's something that could happen in theory but very unlikely to happen in practice. Last I saw was a vision of reservists being available for a deployment once every 3-5 years, and that was only if a suitable role was available and everybody was willing.

The last widespread compulsory mobilisation was Iraq 2003 as we were already committed in Afghan. With the current defence budget in ruins and a lack of appetite for foreign adventures by Joe Public there is no chance of 2 simultaneous campaigns happening again anytime soon. The army is aware of the need to keep civi employers on side so try not to antagonise them by making unreasonable demands on reservists.

Thank you for your post. Have the only actual compuslory mobilisations been during major conficts then? I was under the impression they happen all the time.

Obviously it varies massively from unit to unit, role to role, arm to arm etc.

I’ve been a reservist for nearly 12 years (both Army and Navy) and in that time I’ve never seen anyone mobilised who didn’t volunteer for it.

Thanks for your input. Do you mind me asking what corp / regiment you're in?

I think everyone who has responded to your original post understands the frame of reference that you have applied to it.

What you are asking here is effectively what will the weather be like like in six months time and you have been told to carry an umbrella.

That's it. Pure and simple. What has happened in the past is irrelevent and your idea that you may only be cumpulsoralily mobilised "if something horrific happens" suggests that you may need a bit of a read up on the current state of UK defence and the wider world.

I am trying to be helpful here but having spent some time in a phase 2 training establishment where the majority of soldiers desperately wanted to mobilise (and had limited opportunities to do so), your apparent unwillingness to do so - voluntarily - is causing me issues.

I think you may have misunderstood. I am not saying no to mobilisation, I am asking in general how much I could expect (also where in the world I may end up, at a guess) when going in as the Reserves (not the infantry) as I would like to get an idea of what I could expect and obviously my employer is going to want to know if I'm going to be getting called up to be away for various periods. I'm asking these questions here because the Capita recruitment phone lines are hopeless and I get different answers from my reserve unit when asked.

I'm due to head to selection centre in two weeks so I still have plenty of time here.

I'm intending to ask for extra days and get involved in any courses or events that interest me so I'm not looking to suck up the free driving licence and money and then leave here, I really want to get involved and do more than just the bare minimum.

If your that concerned about mobilisation then perhaps the Army Reserve is not for you.

However if you wish to do military activities and get paid for it and you can only commit at the weekends, evenings and for 2 weeks in the summer then consider joining the ACF/CCF as a Adult Instructor.

Depending on your location, civi job, qualifications and shortage of Adults Instructors in your region you may be able to attain a ACF Commission (used to be Class B Commission with a call up liability but normally they were at the bottom of the list/last resort).

This is a genuine response based on my own experiences as a former member of a Training Team in the TA.

Why would the Army Reserve wish to pay you, equip you and train you if you do not wish to deploy/mobilise?

I'm not shying away from it, my initial queries where what I could expect and what to tell my employer as they are going to want to know what the outlook is going to be if I'm going to be sent away on so many periods.

I don't know how many people on this thread are in civilian life themselves but generally it is quite normal to have questions / queries about a job you are applying for, it's a bit pointless to get a job and then ask the questions afterwards.

What is your civvy job?

I'd rather not say on here as my civvy job is going to give away which corp I'm joining.

 

[Spec-op1989]

Well it ain't tanks or artillery then.

 

[Daxx]

Could always try airsoft instead

 

[cowgoesmoo]

Thank you for your post. Have the only actual compuslory mobilisations been during major conficts then? I was under the impression they happen all the time.

Everybody who goes on operations is `mobilised`, it's a legal process which clearly defines every parties rights and responsibilities. (With a few exceptions) everyone in the last 15 years who has been mobilised has volunteered to be mobilised. There are High-Readiness Reserves and Sponsored Reserves who will be more likely to be mobilised however you're not one of them.

Any vacancies on operations/exercises relevent to the units role will usually be advertised several months in advance on weekly orders or drill nights etc, if you're interested then the unit admin staff will make the arrangements. In terms of duration: most are between 3 and 6 months in theatre, add on Pre-Deployment Training and Post-Operational leave and you're somewhere between 4 and 12 months for the deployment, although i've heard of people going for as little as 2 weeks in exceptional circumstances. Most of the current demand is in the middle east, a few in africa, and a few in places like Cyprus, Gibraltar, Falklands etc.

I wouldn't be concerned about being called up at short notice several times a year as it's very unlikely (but not impossible) to happen. It'll take you a year or 2 to get through basic training and get trained in role to the point where you would be able to function on operations anyway.

 

[D_Gun2019]

@Anonrecruit890 - In the application process you are encouraged to comprehend your role fully and understand completely what this involves - but it seems certain things you should know to get a complete picture are always difficult to come by, and make people question your motives (most here have tried answering it as best they can, but still questioned your motives). You know your motives, they don't need to so don't rise to them and just focus on the answers - another question you may ask if your are mobilised then become injured and can't perform your Civy job when you return are you financially compensated, is your employer?

When they use the phrase "You know what you signed up for" lets make sure they know all the negatives as well as the positives, and just answer the question if its a 'perceived' negative question - this aids in a full understanding.

I would say from my research you'll need to 'complete' your training first, and for the moment in today's climate only voluntary is required, but is voluntary 'asked' of you or do you seek it out, seems to be debatable topic.

But like you i have no idea, seems no one really does there are too many factors.

All you can say for certain is you'll need to complete your training first and so you could get a 'timeline' of that then you can assure your employer its very unlikely (if at all) it will happen before the end of that date, 2021? (assuming it takes 2 years....) Along time in Civy world.

 

[ugly]

Please note that I am not intending to dodge or “run away” from a mobilisation should one occur, I would just like to know what the chances are, where in the world I could expect to be deployed at this point in time and so I know what to tell my employer (whom my day job is with) so that there is assurance on their side as to what the situation is.

The Tories have less appetite for playing war than Labour, so should you join just keep voting cost conscious Tory, that way then you will know if its real and you end up going to war.
Frankly the chances of getting mobilised for the next ten years for anything serious (excluding attempts to wave the flag in front of Putin etc) are slim to nil. The appetite for warmongering seems to be cyclical, apart from operations that are legally and morally justifiable (Falklands, Gulf war etc) then unless we ae threatened I doubt you will need to worry.
However and its a big however I have heard of a yeomanry unit where members have been warned for deployment to Eastern Europe.
Quite how that is legally enforceable I dont know and its not my concern. Using mobilisation to fill the gaps on non operational tours is a bad thing especially when the option is deploy or leave!
The troops saying if you wont deploy then dont join are right in a way. The way to look at is I suppose is comparing it to 1938 and the Munich Crisis. You could train before the rush and maybe even deploy and be sacrificed in a cold 2 man slit trench outside Kaliningrad or wait for the instant sunshine to warm up your home?

 

[FORMER_FYRDMAN]

Hi all,

I am due to join the Army Reserve in the near future (not stating which corp / regiment, although it is not the infantry).

I have been trying to get a clear answer in regards to being mobilised while in the Army Reserve.

It is pointless ringing up the recruitment line (which I assume Capita are running) as they have no clue over anything aside from answering very basic general questions (and will actually open the British Army website and start reading off things word for word to answer you if they don’t know the answer, under the impression you are not aware it exists).

I have asked my unit a few times but I can’t seem to get a clear answer, it usually ends up with one of the below answers:

- They start answering it and then drift off to another topic

- Make a joke out of the answer “just fake an injury and they’ll let you off”

- They come out with “why are you joining up if you have no intention of going to war?” and in general will guilt-trip me for asking the question

Please note that I am not intending to dodge or “run away” from a mobilisation should one occur, I would just like to know what the chances are, where in the world I could expect to be deployed at this point in time and so I know what to tell my employer (whom my day job is with) so that there is assurance on their side as to what the situation is.

For deployments / operations, I am aware that the regular army is prioritised first, followed by ex-regulars in the reserves, followed by reserves who have opted into the “High Alert Readiness” programme, followed by standard reservists only (I’m aware there are many MoD staff who are former armed forces serving who could be called up amongst all this also).

So taking the above into account (and the current state of world affairs), the chances of myself being mobilised are fairly “low – minimal”, right? I am not intending to opt into the “High Alert Readiness” programme so even if there was a need to pull resources from the reserves, it would make sense for someone who has already committed into “High Alert Readiness” and is better prepared to go and be called up compared to someone who is not.

I would like to finish that I am not joining the Army Reserve to “get free stuff”, nor am I joining to do the bare minimum (although there is in theory nothing wrong with that as long as you meet the minimum requirement). I am intending to ask for extra days a year and to go on as many activities, courses and events that are available to me at the time. I just want clarification on the mobilisation situation for myself and my employer in my day job.

Thank you

Technically, if they want you, they get you, unless you successfully appeal on the multiple grounds available, which isn't particularly arduous.

Anecdotally, I've never heard of anybody being successfully mobilised who didn't want to be, though, by the same token, I am aware of several instances where a failure to show willing was considered a block to further promotion.

Essentially, the more specialist your unit, the greater the pressure on you will be in the event that something did kick off. Personally, I think it will be a long time before this nation's politicians are brave/stupid enough to re-run 2003, with all that followed for the AR, and you'll die in your bed having bored your descendants rigid with tales of wet weekends in the remoter parts of the UK.