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Chris Packham's annual attack on grouse shooting

One thing's sure: if pheasant shooting was the pastime of unemployed Yorkshire miners, it would've gone the way of bear-baiting yonks ago. But because it's the toffs who "enjoy" it, even though it's immensely destructive to the environment, no-one says a word - not even about the juicy subsidies the land-owners get from the gobment for their sordid little "sport".

MsG
Am afraid that the abolition of fox hunting disproves this bizzare theses.
 

Helm

MIA
Moderator
Book Reviewer
One thing's sure: if pheasant shooting was the pastime of unemployed Yorkshire miners, it would've gone the way of bear-baiting yonks ago. But because it's the toffs who "enjoy" it, even though it's immensely destructive to the environment, no-one says a word - not even about the juicy subsidies the land-owners get from the gobment for their sordid little "sport".

MsG
 
Report them for the birds of prey thing , IF they are actually doing it , which in this day and age is quite unusual . .
As Lapua says , people have to control their cats and dogs though .
The amount of people around here who walk their dogs off the lead , letting them run through every single cover is quite staggering .
Reporting is one thing.....Proof is quite another .
In the case I'm talking about it is a large estate with mainly tenant farmers.....they know what the Keeper and his cohorts do but are never going to stand up in court when the estate owners are pro shooting and have actively defended the keeper going as far as to tell "mis truths" in court .
It's the same on the large moors in Scotland.....coupled with when brought to court the keepers get little more than a slap on the wrist and the estate pay's any fine .
There can be and is no defence for poisoning or shooting a Golden Eagle yet it happens around the Grouse Moors every year.

Agree a new generation of enlightened Keepers are coming through ( I teach some of them ) but it's a slow process and too many get a job on an estate run by the older generation and have all the good knocked out of them only too soon.

I grew up from the age of 11 with an air rifle glued to my hand....I shot enough rabbits to pay for my first proper German air rifle ( Fienwerkbau 127 sport ) at the age of 14 (50p a bunny)

At home the family farm is the only "estate" in the area that doesn't have a game shoot , we don't allow the local hunt on the land either but do have several trusted guns who carry out pest and Deer control . Cats strangely don't seem to be a problem with the accident rate among the farm cats seeming to keep numbers under control and if one is stupid enough to fall asleep in the wheel arch of a truck then that's Darwinism at work . Dogs not under control is a problem at Lambing but then so are bloody kids with townies thinking they have the right to roam anywhere ....mercifully we have few footpaths .We do have 4 breeding pairs of Barn Owls , well above average count of Tawny Owls , Peewits and Snipe in the brooks , and always above average counts of songbirds . We also have a delightful 72 year old Granny in one of the houses who keeps the Magpie population under control with her Larsen trap.

It's a tough struggle to make a living in the country side at the moment and the next few years with Brexit bring a lot of uncertainty but as a whole we need public support and a few of the large shooting estates seem to be trying their hardest to loose any support we have .The "Toff" image is no help .
 
The biggest single problem out here now is without doubt the white tailed eagle. Contrary to what many have been told, the WTE was shot out of Scotland because of its economic impact on sheep, in particular lambs and not because "toffs" killed it indiscriminately. Much is spoken in the Gaelic oral tradition about this but it was and still is ignored by most.
Due to the fact that most bird species here have to nest on the ground, cats have an impact far greater than they may elsewhere. I know a friend who in the space of one week witnessed his cat taking home over a dozen Corncrake chicks: he promptly shot the cat and has never had one since.
Unfortunately, most folks have no idea of the work involved in land management, their education coming from TV programs presented by the likes of Mr Packham. They never see cats decimating groups of nests, hedgehogs eating chicks of badgers in the latter stages of bTB. As such, getting folks properly educated in the way land management works is the issue; if we could have programs showing the nitty gritty instead of the "nice" things. Having said that, I have no doubt that there would be many complaints if such a program was shown.
 
Having said that, I have no doubt that there would be many complaints if such a program was shown.
Oh, I don't know about that.

I for one would pay good money to watch Kate Humble gralloch a red stag, or perhaps strangle a badger or two...






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The biggest single problem out here now is without doubt the white tailed eagle. Contrary to what many have been told, the WTE was shot out of Scotland because of its economic impact on sheep, in particular lambs and not because "toffs" killed it indiscriminately. Much is spoken in the Gaelic oral tradition about this but it was and still is ignored by most.
Due to the fact that most bird species here have to nest on the ground, cats have an impact far greater than they may elsewhere. I know a friend who in the space of one week witnessed his cat taking home over a dozen Corncrake chicks: he promptly shot the cat and has never had one since.
Unfortunately, most folks have no idea of the work involved in land management, their education coming from TV programs presented by the likes of Mr Packham. They never see cats decimating groups of nests, hedgehogs eating chicks of badgers in the latter stages of bTB. As such, getting folks properly educated in the way land management works is the issue; if we could have programs showing the nitty gritty instead of the "nice" things. Having said that, I have no doubt that there would be many complaints if such a program was shown.
Indeed. There was enough outcry over Watership Down being shown over Easter...
 
Going back to the annual attack on grouse I've been invited to do some walked up in Sep and thought I'd take my beat up AYA 20bore. As I have never done this before I thought I'd ask what choke recommendations you might have. Currently its choked ½ and Full - as it came out of the factory in the 70s. I've got to get the crossover stock shortened so its an ideal opportunity to have the chokes eased. Quarter and half? I'll stick with nothing heavier than 28g
 
Going back to the annual attack on grouse I've been invited to do some walked up in Sep and thought I'd take my beat up AYA 20bore. As I have never done this before I thought I'd ask what choke recommendations you might have. Currently its choked ½ and Full - as it came out of the factory in the 70s. I've got to get the crossover stock shortened so its an ideal opportunity to have the chokes eased. Quarter and half? I'll stick with nothing heavier than 28g
Shoot with the gun as it is if you are used to it; grouse - you either hit them or you don't in my (limited) experience of shooting them.

I do however do a bit of loading and most of the guns are fixed choke of English (and some Scottish) manufacture in various combinations of 1/2, 3/4 or full.
 
Mick9abf,

Thank you. I bought the gun as a general beat up gun to prevent me over using my old Beesleys and my hammer gun is not sensible for traipsing over the moor. Not used to it yet as stock is too long so needs to be shortened to my measurements, so taking your advice I'll only take get the very full choke eased back a bit.

Rgds
Trax
 
Going back to the annual attack on grouse I've been invited to do some walked up in Sep and thought I'd take my beat up AYA 20bore. As I have never done this before I thought I'd ask what choke recommendations you might have. Currently its choked ½ and Full - as it came out of the factory in the 70s. I've got to get the crossover stock shortened so its an ideal opportunity to have the chokes eased. Quarter and half? I'll stick with nothing heavier than 28g
My personal choice would be 1/4 & 1/2 , full choke tends to muller stuff if you hit them bang on in my experoience.
 
Thread resurection because Packham is being a bit of twat again. Was reading the paper in the hotel this morning and this article caught my eye. Very well written IMHO and makes the point that conservation and estate management should go hand in hand if only the eco-warriors would let those who know how to get on with it ................er, get on with it.

20180923-105246_p0.jpg
 
Packham depend on the urban majority ignorant of country matters or land management. Had a wee war of words earlier in the year with those against issuing licences to shoot ravens. Was told emphatically that there was no evidence to prove ravens did damage to lambs by a couple of rather ill informed individuals. When I then posted footage, I was reprimanded for filming and not "chasing the ravens away". When asked what these eco warriors expected these birds to eat should they be chased away, I was told worms and stuff like that! You could not make it up.
 
Packham depend on the urban majority ignorant of country matters or land management. Had a wee war of words earlier in the year with those against issuing licences to shoot ravens. Was told emphatically that there was no evidence to prove ravens did damage to lambs by a couple of rather ill informed individuals. When I then posted footage, I was reprimanded for filming and not "chasing the ravens away". When asked what these eco warriors expected these birds to eat should they be chased away, I was told worms and stuff like that! You could not make it up.
Most of the fcukwits in my village are home counties ******* , the nearest they`ve been to the countryside is a walk around a local park , they rock up and know it all about countryside management , one silly cow tried to argue foxes dont eat poultry or lambs and that I was wrong to shoot foxes ,another argued wildlife shouldnt be shot( managed ) as it was cruel and unnecessary, she was ranting about this as she tucked into a supermarket beefburger ,the hypercritical fat cow.
 

ancienturion

LE
Book Reviewer
Anyone who owns two Poodles can never be taken seriously.
It wouldn't have been quite so bad if they were standard but he is not to be trusted anyway because, apparently, he has lied before.
 
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