Chinese J-10 Fighter-Doesnt this look like the Typhoon?

#2
You bought any Chinese techological gear of late? I'd give it about a month before it comes to bits in your hands. Not a problem with an M3 player but.....

But yes, it would appear China has copied a few ideas!
 

seaweed

LE
Book Reviewer
#4
Interesting to see comparisons of dimensions vs Typhoon. I would imagine the Ch have long since helped themselves to all the plans and dats for the Typhoon. Madness not to, the way they play things.
 
#6
Ah so... Vigorous Dragon....
 
#10
Cold_Collation said:
No, it doesn't. Just ask the Israelis. Nowt to do with them. :twisted:
Sorry, you are right - different colour altogether for starters...
 

Biped

LE
Book Reviewer
#11
The Pakistanis are in negotiations to buy up to 50 of them.
 
#13
The Israelis sold the Lavi prototype and all the drawings, along with a load of US defence tech to the Chinese.
 
#14
Semper_Flexibilis said:
The Israelis sold the Lavi prototype and all the drawings, along with a load of US defence tech to the Chinese.
But they said they didn't. And, as has been rightly pointed out, it's a different colour.

But then, they don't borrow UK passports to go on holiday, either...

:twisted:
 
#15
Modern computers come up with the same answers to aerodynamic problems so it's inevitable that many modern aircraft resemble each other.

As mentioned, the J-10 owes the vast majority of its genesis to Israel. However, later in its development the Russians kept the Project going. Finally, the Pakistanis also presented the Chinese with early model F-16As to play with.

Regards,
MM
 
#17
Cold_Collation said:
There's lots of speculation as to its electronic performance, or lack of it, MM.

Any feel from your side - that you can talk about?
Purely personal speculation from open source data. However, we all know that China is the most ruthless exploiter of foreign technology around and it’s likely to be pretty useful.

The J-10 was developed with Israeli and Sovi…oops…Russian assistance. Ergo, we can expect the airframe/engine mix to perform well. Dynamically therefore, I would expect it to be on a par with equivalent Western 4th gen aircraft such as Gripen. Interestingly, open source images have also appeared of a new J-10 variant with an F-35 style engine intake designed to reduce Radar Cross Section (RCS) by masking the compressor blades. However, I certainly wouldn’t consider it a LO type.

In terms of systems, they’ll have likely majored on a mix of the latest Israeli (don’t forget that the Israelis were about to provide the Chinese with state of the art AWACS technology until the US blocked the sale) and Russian technology with various copied Western systems and software. Again, the Israelis have a long history of supplying AAMs to China (Python 3 being a classic example) and the Russians make very good missiles. The Chinese now have an active radar AAM in the PL-12 which Russian sources have claimed they developed. This is probably on a par with early model AMRAAMs and therefore a major step up in terms of air-air capability over pervious Chinese IR and semi-active radar threats. It also significantly increase the export appeal of the J-10.

In short, I’d guess that the J-10 could be considered up there with (and possibly exceed in some respects) early model 4th gen fighters (Gripen A/F-16C/FA-18C) in terms of air-air capabilities. Air-ground it’s likely to be less well integrated (especially with things like targeting pod/sensor/EW fusion) than Western types.

Overall, well worthy of respect, especially as it’s very cheap and the Chinese are no doubt busy integrating Active Electronically Scanned Array (AESA) technology which will offer a step change and may bring it up to a level approaching Gen 4.5 (Typhoon/Rafale) capabilities.

Given that Pakistan have already bought the type and several other nations – notably Iran – are showing interest, the J-10 should probably be assumed to be the baseline air-air threat (alongside Flanker) in the coming decade or so. It certainly isn’t a Fishbed in new clothes.

Hope the above is useful.

Regards,
MM
 
#18
Magic_Mushroom said:
Cold_Collation said:
There's lots of speculation as to its electronic performance, or lack of it, MM.

Any feel from your side - that you can talk about?
Purely personal speculation from open source data. However, we all know that China is the most ruthless exploiter of foreign technology around and it’s likely to be pretty useful.

The J-10 was developed with Israeli and Sovi…oops…Russian assistance. Ergo, we can expect the airframe/engine mix to perform well. Dynamically therefore, I would expect it to be on a par with equivalent Western 4th gen aircraft such as Gripen. Interestingly, open source images have also appeared of a new J-10 variant with an F-35 style engine intake designed to reduce Radar Cross Section (RCS) by masking the compressor blades. However, I certainly wouldn’t consider it a LO type.

In terms of systems, they’ll have likely majored on a mix of the latest Israeli (don’t forget that the Israelis were about to provide the Chinese with state of the art AWACS technology until the US blocked the sale) and Russian technology with various copied Western systems and software. Again, the Israelis have a long history of supplying AAMs to China (Python 3 being a classic example) and the Russians make very good missiles. The Chinese now have an active radar AAM in the PL-12 which Russian sources have claimed they developed. This is probably on a par with early model AMRAAMs and therefore a major step up in terms of air-air capability over pervious Chinese IR and semi-active radar threats. It also significantly increase the export appeal of the J-10.

In short, I’d guess that the J-10 could be considered up there with (and possibly exceed in some respects) early model 4th gen fighters (Gripen A/F-16C/FA-18C) in terms of air-air capabilities. Air-ground it’s likely to be less well integrated (especially with things like targeting pod/sensor/EW fusion) than Western types.

Overall, well worthy of respect, especially as it’s very cheap and the Chinese are no doubt busy integrating Active Electronically Scanned Array (AESA) technology which will offer a step change and may bring it up to a level approaching Gen 4.5 (Typhoon/Rafale) capabilities.

Given that Pakistan have already bought the type and several other nations – notably Iran – are showing interest, the J-10 should probably be assumed to be the baseline air-air threat (alongside Flanker) in the coming decade or so. It certainly isn’t a Fishbed in new clothes.

Hope the above is useful.

Regards,
MM
It is, thank you. Puts squabbling over Typhoon Tranche 3 and AESA development/integration into perspective. And all those quibbles over A war not THE war...

C_C
 
#19

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