China - rising power

#1
Watching BBC World Service broadcasting from Australia. Many Australians identifying with China as a power for good... and complaining about imperialist Britain.

China is a responsible rising power. Discuss.
 
#6
The Intelligence2Debate from Sydney Australia, Have we anything to fear from a powerful China? Has just voted no.
 
#8
I've been to India a few times and quite a few lads I've spoken to certainly aren't the biggest fans of us
yet still they come.
 
E

exmunkey

Guest
#9
Last time I was in OZ during early 90's they were heavily into the tiger economy. Queensland had a lot of the street nemes and menus in English and Japanese, guess it'll all start changing to chinese

The Chinese have taken a major foothold in Africa, they are the rising power. It will be interesting to see what happens in the next decade
 
#11
The Chinese have taken a major foothold in Africa, they are the rising power.
From where I'm sitting right now (somewhere in Africa - no details for OPSEC), I can see a tower block under construction with Chinese engineers. Chinese surveyors are a common site where the shi'ite roads and bridges are being repaired. Slightly different form of colonisation or just a desire to hoover-up the remaining world's resources? They're winning some major contracts in AFG as well but that's a whole new topic.
Was the question about Oz hedging their bets and going with the big boy on the block or about the Chinese? I forget...
 
#12
Did Australia just spend 1.6bn on Growler to defend themselves against Britain?

This is cold war era paranoia, great for Defence spending, wonder who has the most to gain from it.....
 

Grumblegrunt

LE
Book Reviewer
#13
according to recent reports I've been reading some 'experts' reckon that china wont have its carrier/s finished before 2020 as they have to develop anti sub, radar etc for it/them.

I didn't realise BAE was advising china on the technology of fitted for but not with - it not a secret?
 
#14
Watching BBC World Service broadcasting from Australia. Many Australians identifying with China as a power for good... and complaining about imperialist Britain.

China is a responsible rising power. Discuss.
Because we're too far away to care about, whereas China on the other hand....

Or maybe it's something to with the lack of gold medals at the recent sports day
 
#15
Last time I was in OZ during early 90's they were heavily into the tiger economy. Queensland had a lot of the street nemes and menus in English and Japanese, guess it'll all start changing to chinese

The Chinese have taken a major foothold in Africa, they are the rising power. It will be interesting to see what happens in the next decade
Yet the Chinese foothold is very thin and showing signs of fraying. There have been bomb attacks on Chinese workers, a Chinese Mine Manager has been killed by his African staff, Chinese workers have been shot by Park Rangers whilst engaged in poaching, and caught smuggling banned Ivory home.
 
#16
Yes, after all violence in Africa is an entirely new phenomenon. No other foreigners were ever killed there ever.

As to the original topic, yes. They are a force for 'good' so far as 'good' is defined as the stability of the international system. If we confuse that with 'our continued uncontested dominance of the international system' then they're Wrong And Evil.

Woo-ooooh-ooooh-ooooooooh-boogah-boogah-boogah-weneedanaircraftcarrier-ooooh.

If it's been sent from my HTC Sensation using Tapatalk then I'm probably pissed.
 
#17
Yes, after all violence in Africa is an entirely new phenomenon. No other foreigners were ever killed there ever.

As to the original topic, yes. They are a force for 'good' so far as 'good' is defined as the stability of the international system. If we confuse that with 'our continued uncontested dominance of the international system' then they're Wrong And Evil.

Woo-ooooh-ooooh-ooooooooh-boogah-boogah-boogah-weneedanaircraftcarrier-ooooh.

If it's been sent from my HTC Sensation using Tapatalk then I'm probably pissed.
There's always been violence in Africa. But aimed bomb attacks at Chinese workers employed on a Chinese project that suposedly would create jobs for African workers but hasn't as every single member of staff has been imported by the Chinese management from China ? Violence in labour disputes in not uncommon, but the Chinese Manager was singled out and crushed to death. The rise in poaching in Kenya has been squarely blamed purely on the desire of Chinese staff to own ivory and has resulted in Kenayan Rangers shooting at poachers who turn out to include Chinese nationals when the bodies were checked. Kenya is also pissed off at Chinese owned farms that shift all their product home to China, far does it's a Chinese owned farm but the Kenyans are getting peeved...

However. My point is, is that he Chinese foothold in Africa is already showing signs of stress and fraying at the edges.
 
#18
There's always been violence in Africa. But aimed bomb attacks at Chinese workers employed on a Chinese project that suposedly would create jobs for African workers but hasn't as every single member of staff has been imported by the Chinese management from China ? Violence in labour disputes in not uncommon, but the Chinese Manager was singled out and crushed to death. The rise in poaching in Kenya has been squarely blamed purely on the desire of Chinese staff to own ivory and has resulted in Kenayan Rangers shooting at poachers who turn out to include Chinese nationals when the bodies were checked. Kenya is also pissed off at Chinese owned farms that shift all their product home to China, far does it's a Chinese owned farm but the Kenyans are getting peeved...

However. My point is, is that he Chinese foothold in Africa is already showing signs of stress and fraying at the edges.

And,let's not forget that China is not that competitive in manufacturing,now that the 'workers' are demanding better wages,and a better standard of living,because of the 'boom' that attracted Western firms to China.

UK/European companies,that moved out there because of the 'low wage' bill,are now finding that said bill is rising,and transportation costs are also rising,making their chinese operations,that little bit more 'expensive',and realising these costs aren't going to come down,are looking at ways of cutting costs.
 
#19
And,let's not forget that China is not that competitive in manufacturing,now that the 'workers' are demanding better wages,and a better standard of living,because of the 'boom' that attracted Western firms to China.

UK/European companies,that moved out there because of the 'low wage' bill,are now finding that said bill is rising,and transportation costs are also rising,making their chinese operations,that little bit more 'expensive',and realising these costs aren't going to come down,are looking at ways of cutting costs.
And reading the same Economist article are moving to Vietnam and other such places...
 
#20
There's always been violence in Africa. But aimed bomb attacks at Chinese workers employed on a Chinese project that suposedly would create jobs for African workers but hasn't as every single member of staff has been imported by the Chinese management from China ? Violence in labour disputes in not uncommon, but the Chinese Manager was singled out and crushed to death. The rise in poaching in Kenya has been squarely blamed purely on the desire of Chinese staff to own ivory and has resulted in Kenayan Rangers shooting at poachers who turn out to include Chinese nationals when the bodies were checked. Kenya is also pissed off at Chinese owned farms that shift all their product home to China, far does it's a Chinese owned farm but the Kenyans are getting peeved...
Is there any factor there that wasn't present in the European colonial period? Africans don't like outsiders taking the pickings home - not really a surprise.

On the other hand, Africans don't like to do without either. They're quite happy to play us and the Chinese off against each other, telling each what we want to hear about how awful the other is and how they'd side with one side if only they didn't need the money so much - of course, if only a better offer could allow them to ignore those awful exploiting Chinese/Westerners (delete as applicable). A quick Google reveals that not all Africans want the Chinese out and us back in.

Personally, I think the Economist has presented a balanced picture of the pros and cons. It might soothe our post-Imperial vanity to believe that no-one can do it for them quite like we did but Africans are not exactly the helpless heroine being tied to the railway by moustache-twirling Chinese.
 

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