Chieftain Ammo

Bollox

War Hero
Just watched a program on the US MBT M103 on which they explained that to remove a loaded projectile they had to get outside the tank and use a wooden pole down the barrel to knock the projectile out of the breach. Using two part ammo the charge casing would push the projectile hard into the rifling making the round impossible to withdraw.
With the Chieftain and Challenger tanks using a similar two part round (though bagged rather than brass cased) could the projectile be removed from inside the vehicle.
 
Drill shells and shot had a piece of rope on the arse end to pull them out.
 
Just watched a program on the US MBT M103 on which they explained that to remove a loaded projectile they had to get outside the tank and use a wooden pole down the barrel to knock the projectile out of the breach. Using two part ammo the charge casing would push the projectile hard into the rifling making the round impossible to withdraw.
With the Chieftain and Challenger tanks using a similar two part round (though bagged rather than brass cased) could the projectile be removed from inside the vehicle.
If it's bagged, will it be hard into the rifling? So couldn't the projectile be pulled out quite easily. Maybe elevating the barrel and letting gravity give a hand?
 
HESH could be removed from within the vehicle, there was a piece of kit (can't member what it was called, probably Tool HESH 120mm) Removal for the use of.) there is a cut out on the base of the round into which a key fits attached to a wire which was then used to extract the round.

FIN, APDS and DST were all removed by using the barrel cleaning staves from outside the vehicle.

I'm sure a gunnery nark will be along soon to give you chapter and verse.
 

4(T)

LE
Drill shells can lock surprisingly tightly into the rifling lead, even if they've been inserted softly. Often they will not drop out even with the barrel at high elevation (arty guns).

If you got over-enthusiastic during gun park drill and used the rammer - then the shell is definitely is not coming out of its own accord, and you have to use the extraction kit (or a pole and big hammer).

If and when you get the shell out, you often get to discover just how heavy it is as you carry it up and down the nearest hill, or ten times around the gun park...
 
105mm Tk HESH has a ridge on the driving band to prevent this. It also had a base fuze if rolled at 6mph Armed.
 

BopBopBop

War Hero
Drill shells can lock surprisingly tightly into the rifling lead, even if they've been inserted softly. Often they will not drop out even with the barrel at high elevation (arty guns).

If you got over-enthusiastic during gun park drill and used the rammer - then the shell is definitely is not coming out of its own accord, and you have to use the extraction kit (or a pole and big hammer).

If and when you get the shell out, you often get to discover just how heavy it is as you carry it up and down the nearest hill, or ten times around the gun park...
Only ever used 120mm drill rounds on the Cheftain turret simulator in Catterick during basic training in 1971.

It was to my great relief as a weedy 17 year old racing snake loader to find that the drill rounds were twice has heavy as the practice and live ammunition I loaded over the next few years.

Also loved loading the .50 ranging gun and gpmg and sorting out the stoppages.

Great memories as part of a well oiled tank crew on the battle runs.
 
It was to my great relief as a weedy 17 year old racing snake loader to find that the drill rounds were twice has heavy as the practice and live ammunition I loaded over the next few years.
That will be in your imagination, they are the same weight, or you were trying to load 120mm drill roads in a 60mm gun :oops:
 
Can't remember a tool to remove Hesh rounds. Always seem to remember to use staves if you had to remove a round. Never had to do it though so might be talking out of my arse as usual.


Posted from the ARRSE Mobile app (iOS or Android)
 

BopBopBop

War Hero
That will be in your imagination, they are the same weight, or you were trying to load 120mm drill roads in a 60mm gun :oops:
I'm sure the 120mm Chieftain drill rounds at Catterick were heavier than the real thing.
Never loaded or fired anything that was 60mm. What would that be.
 
I'm sure the 120mm Chieftain drill rounds at Catterick were heavier than the real thing.
Never loaded or fired anything that was 60mm. What would that be.
A mortar.
 

AlienFTM

MIA
Book Reviewer
HESH could be removed from within the vehicle, there was a piece of kit (can't member what it was called, probably Tool HESH 120mm) Removal for the use of.) there is a cut out on the base of the round into which a key fits attached to a wire which was then used to extract the round.

FIN, APDS and DST were all removed by using the barrel cleaning staves from outside the vehicle.

I'm sure a gunnery nark will be along soon to give you chapter and verse.
@aghart is your man.
 
If and when you get the shell out, you often get to discover just how heavy it is as you carry it up and down the nearest hill, or ten times around the gun park..
Now why would you want to do that?
 
That will be in your imagination, they are the same weight, or you were trying to load 120mm drill roads in a 60mm gun :oops:
Re-invention of the squeeze bore? Or sheer determination?
 
@California_Tanker mentioned this in his latest(?) Q&A video and how clearing the barrel could prove a little awkward.
Watch from about 00:26.

 

BopBopBop

War Hero
A mortar.
Ah. Never touched one of them.

The drill rounds at Catterick were never used in a "real" Chieftain.

They had two crude turret simulators that must have had dedicated drill ammunition.

It operated a bit like a bowling alley. The rounds were loaded and fired. I'm sure the breach recoiled and the loaded ammunition was ejected into a bin on the outside.

We had to get the rounds out of the bin and put them into the turret racks before we could practice loading.

I could hardly pickup the hesh it was so heavy.
Noticed the difference straight away when we did live firing a couple of weeks later at Warcop?
img261.jpg
MBT.jpg
 
Last edited:

New Posts

Latest Threads

Top