Cheney receives a subpoena

#1
This could be the start of the downfall.

Cheney, others served with subpoenas by wiretapping investigators Michael Roston
Published: Wednesday June 27, 2007

The Senate Judiciary Committee has served Vice President Dick Cheney and other officials in the White House and Justice Department with subpoenas over President George W. Bush's warrantless wiretapping programs.

"Over the past 18 months, this Committee has made no fewer than nine formal requests to the Department of Justice and to the White House, seeking information and documents about the authorization of and legal justification for this program," Senator Patrick Leahy (D-VT), Chairman of the Senate Judiciary Committee, said in a statement released to RAW STORY. "All requests have been rebuffed. Our attempts to obtain information through testimony of Administration witnesses have been met with a consistent pattern of evasion and misdirection."

The subpoenas were authorized last week by the Judiciary Committee by a 13-3 vote, and target "documents related to authorization and reauthorization of the program or programs; the legal analysis or opinions about the surveillance; orders, decisions, or opinions of the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Court (FISC) concerning the surveillance; agreements between the Executive Branch and telecommunications or other companies regarding liability for assisting with or participating in the surveillance; and documents concerning the shutting down of an investigation of the Department of Justice’s Office of Professional Responsibility (OPR) relating to the surveillance," according to the release.

In the subpoena letters, Leahy made particular reference to the Bush administration's attempts to roll back existing oversight of the domestic spying program conducted through the National Security Agency.

"This Committee’s inquiry into this warrantless electronic surveillance is essential to the performance of its constitutional legislative and oversight responsibilities," he wrote. "The Administration has asked Congress to make sweeping changes to FISA – a crucial national security authority over which the Judiciary Committee has jurisdiction. It is impossible to make informed legislative decisions without understanding fully the Administration’s interpretation of FISA and the perceived flaws in that legislation that led the Administration to operate a program outside of its provisions for more than five years."

The letters were sent to the Justice Department, the Office of the White House, the Office of the Vice President, and the National Security Council. The recipients of the subpoenas are called on to comply with the subpoenas by July 18.

http://rawstory.com/news/2007/Cheney_others_served_with_subpoenas_by_0627.html
 
#2
Cheney told Leahy to go and fcuk himself once before. I'll put good money on him doing it again.
 
#3
crabtastic said:
Cheney told Leahy to go and fcuk himself once before. I'll put good money on him doing it again.
Yeah, that's why he has now been subpoenaed. You cant tell a subpoena to go fcuk itself. That's the beauty of them.
 
#4
Not being thick..but can someone put this in laymans terms for the boys...who aren't thick as well.

i hate the Americans and especially all involved in the present administration (including the future i/c middle east-bliar).

many dankes

blowmoi

and gordon...please....blow me you tight jock freak..squaddies hate you anyway..student...haircut...can't pass apwt...pft...donut shop...etc..
 
#5
But isn't it written into the constitution that US politicians (and celebrities) and anyone else who can afford a good lawyer is above the law?

He won't be having sleepless nights, surely?
 
#6
Other then the triall and conviction of the Blige Rat Blur I can think of no other plesant thought then then man who I blame above all others getting his comupance.
john
 
#7
goodkurtz said:
Yeah, that's why he has now been subpoenaed. You cant tell a subpoena to go fcuk itself. That's the beauty of them.
Actually they can. There's this little thing called Executive Privilege that they'll probably try and argue means they don't have to comply since it's a national security/terrorism matter. That and IIRC appointed officials can refuse to attend or answer committee's questions.
 
#8
Brick said:
goodkurtz said:
Yeah, that's why he has now been subpoenaed. You cant tell a subpoena to go fcuk itself. That's the beauty of them.
Actually they can. There's this little thing called Executive Privilege that they'll probably try and argue means they don't have to comply since it's a national security/terrorism matter. That and IIRC appointed officials can refuse to attend or answer committee's questions.
One of the major principles of of a civil Democracy is that no one is above the law. And that, of course, also includes the president. This isn't a fancy little add on, its fundamental.
If Cheney refuses to comply with the subpoenas that will, in one move, show that America has slipped from being a Democracy and has become a Republic ruled by a small elite that considers itself above the law.
This is end game stuff.
The greatest danger to Bush & Cheney now comes from those most close to them.

Think of the English nobility forcing King John to sign the Magna Carta at Runnymede.
Or think what happened to Julius Caesar when he tried to over rule the senators.
 
#9
Heywood_Jablowme said:
Not being thick..but can someone put this in laymans terms for the boys...who aren't thick as well.

i hate the Americans and especially all involved in the present administration (including the future i/c middle east-bliar).

many dankes

blowmoi

and gordon...please....blow me you tight jock freak..squaddies hate you anyway..student...haircut...can't pass apwt...pft...donut shop...etc..

I take your contribution was fuelled by alchohol and and/or bannned substances :twisted:

I think Leahy will be told to politely go and do something else.
 
#10
I take your contribution was fuelled by alchohol and and/or bannned substances

I think Leahy will be told to politely go and do something else.
And just what are you on Rickshaw? :D
Leahy hasn't sent them a fcuking party invite. Having not got what he wanted he took it to a judge and the judge has turned Leahy's requests into a subpoena.
A subpoena is a legal command that one must obey or one finds oneself in contempt and liable to imprisonment.
In other words Leahy's requests for information aren't coming from him any more. They are now coming from the Man. They now coming from the Law.

And how does that old song go?
"I fought the law and the law won."
 
#11
This from The Raw Story.
I'm not sure what the legal expert is saying about the administration 'running out the clock'. The terms of the subpoena determine the clock speed now I would have thought.


Legal expert: White House stonewalling may force Congress to charge president with criminal offenses David Edwards and Muriel Kane
Published: Wednesday June 27, 2007

Keith Olbermann announced on Wednesday's Countdown that the White House is refusing on grounds of executive privilege to honor Senate subpoenas and release documents relating to its warrantless wiretapping. In addition, Vice President Cheney's chief of staff, David Addington, has sent a letter to Sen. John Kerry (D-MA) saying Cheney's office will not comply with oversight by the National Archives because it is not "an agency."

Olbermann then turned to law professor Joanathan Turley, who agreed tentatively that the administration might move slowly enough to "run out the clock" on its time in office. "But there is one thing that might concern them about the court," Turley said, "and that is, you know, for many years, since we first found out about this program, some of us have said that this was a clearly criminal act that the president called for. ... If we're right, not only did he order that crime, but it would be, in fact, an impeachable offense."

"Both sides, both Democrats and Republicans, have avoided this sort of pig in the parlor," Turley continued. "They don't want to recognize that this president may have ordered criminal offenses. But they may now be on the road to do that, because the way Congress can get around the executive privilege in court is to say, we're investigating a potential crime."

Olbermann went on to joke that the attempt to pin down Cheney's real nature is starting to sound like a game of 20 Questions. Turley laughed and said, "The position adopted by Mr. Addington and Mr. Cheney, to put it bluntly, was absurd. ... In past administrations, if someone like Mr. Addington made such a moronic argument as this one, they would be out of a job the next week. ... I think that what it really shows is the lack of sort of adult supervision within the administration."

Olbermann probed further into why Cheney has given up claiming he is not part of the executive branch but is still not complying with the order. "Is this an attempt to stop what Congressman Emanuel talked about yesterday, cutting off the funding? Is it just more smokescreen?"

"This administration, I have to say, has a certain contempt for the law," said Turley. "They treat it like some of my criminal defendents used to treat it. ... They come up with any argument that might work. ... It's a sort of shocking development. ... But at the end of the day, they will lose, and they're making the situation worse."

The following video is from MSNBC's Countdown, broadcast on June 27
 
#12
goodkurtz said:
I take your contribution was fuelled by alchohol and and/or bannned substances

I think Leahy will be told to politely go and do something else.
And just what are you on Rickshaw? :D
Leahy hasn't sent them a fcuking party invite. Having not got what he wanted he took it to a judge and the judge has turned Leahy's requests into a subpoena.
A subpoena is a legal command that one must obey or one finds oneself in contempt and liable to imprisonment.
In other words Leahy's requests for information aren't coming from him any more. They are now coming from the Man. They now coming from the Law.

And how does that old song go?
"I fought the law and the law won."
Its a bit too early even for me :D

What I mean is that I think the President will pull rank and even if the tomtit was to hit the fan the final act could well be a Presidential Pardon. It doesn't make it right but we have virtually the same type of politicos as you and they will stop at nothing to squirm out of any situation.

And I suspect that you think that as well :D
 
#13
What I mean is that I think the President will pull rank and even if the tomtit was to hit the fan the final act could well be a Presidential Pardon. It doesn't make it right but we have virtually the same type of politicos as you and they will stop at nothing to squirm out of any situation.

And I suspect that you think that as well
The Chimp can't pull rank. Any rank that the President has, has been granted to him WITHIN a legal framework. 'Executive Privilege' is therefore a feature of the legal constitution of the United States.
The founding fathers took this into consideration. They took precautions to make sure that no president should try and grab the powers that monarchs often did in Europe.
No one in a civil society is above the law. Its very important to understand that.
If indeed a situation was to arrive where it was thought necessary for the president to operate beyond how the law stood then a law would have to be introduced to change the law in which he would still operate and be liable to.

If Cheney and/or Bush were to ignore the subpoena they would be holding the law itself in contempt.
Criminal charge one.
If it was then found in answer to the questions raised in the subpoena that he had exceeded the law with the wire tap program, that alone would be criminal charge two.

But then of course if we then find that thousands of cases of wire tapping were the illegally made then that opens them both to thousands of criminal charges. And as well as that in a litigious place like America thousands of private lawsuits as well.

What we are seeing the beginning of is a headlong crash between the judiciary and the executive branches of the American government.
No one usually issues a subpoena to the Veep.
You can no more ignore a subpoena than you could avoid an electric shock if you stuck your fingers in a wall point and threw the switch.
I'll try and find out when, or even if its ever done before.
 
#14
The title of the article I posted is interesting:
White House stonewalling may force Congress to charge president with criminal offenses
'Force' being the operative word. I'm sure those fat comfortable cats in congress would rather their sleep was not disturbed by anything other than a lobbyist offering them a five star lunch. However, they would be FORCED to act if they were presented with evidence that the President and his Veep had exceeded the law. Otherwise they themselves would be in legal jeopardy.
No matter what other things a congressman may do it is his fundemental duty to uphold the constitution of the United States. So now they will be forced to do some of the work they should have been doing these past seven years.

By some amazing coincidence rather than design I am reading a book called 'Burr' at the moment. It is about a previous Vice President Aaron Burr, who in 1804 whilst serving as the veep shot and killed one General Alexander Hamilton in a dual. He was charged with several counts of murder but managed to get off.
So Cheneys got a way to go yet. But he did shoot a man by accident on a hunting trip last year. That must have been about the only whimpy thing he has ever done. Not the shooting of course, but the lame 'I did it by accident' excuse offered by him later.
 
#15
G_K please do keep us up to date. Maybe we have had B'liar so long we are becoming too cynical about the machinations of Gobmint.

I'll bet you a beer tho' the sneaky barstewards find a way out :twisted:
 
#17
The thread was started about the wire tap subpoenas.
Other subpoenas relating to the attorney firings are up and Bush is digging in his heels. That alone is a signal that he has been breaking the law. He can't afford to hand over the docs because they incriminate him.
It seems, for the moment, subpoenas don't work.

So whats it going to be? Do they send in a squad of Chicago's finest who like to drink on duty and know how to use a billy club?
Or does one send in the animal welfare people with a tranquilizer dart gun to get that fcuking chimp out his cage?
He can stall, but he can't hide. He's in check.

White House refuses to turn over documents in probe of federal prosecutors Michael Roston
Published: Thursday June 28, 2007

The White House, under attack from Congress for allegedly firing federal prosecutors based on political affiliation, asserted executive privilege Thursday and said they could not turn over documents that could shed light on the prosecutors' firings. A top Senate Democrat who is leading the investigation accused the White House of 'Nixonian stonewalling.'

In a letter to the chairmen of the the House and Senate Judiciary Committees, President George W. Bush's attorney asserted that White House would not turn over subpoenaed documents for former presidential counsel Harriet Miers and former political director Sara Taylor.

"With respect, it is with much regret that we are forced down this unfortunate path which we sought to avoid by finding grounds for mutual accommodation," White House counsel Fred Fielding wrote. "We had hoped this matter could conclude with your committees receiving information in lieu of having to invoke executive privilege. Instead, we are at this conclusion."

Senate Judiciary Committee Chairman Patrick Leahy (D-VT) slammed President Bush's move.

"This is a further shift by the Bush Administration into Nixonian stonewalling and more evidence of their disdain for our system of checks and balances," he said in a statement released to RAW STORY. "This White House cannot have it both ways. They cannot stonewall congressional investigations by refusing to provide documents and witnesses, while claiming nothing improper occurred....Increasingly, the President and Vice President feel they are above the law - in America no one is above law."

Thursday was the deadline for surrendering the documents which had been subpoenaed by Congress June 13. The White House also asserted that Miers and Taylor would not testify next month, as directed.

If neither side will budge, "the stalemate could end up with House and Senate contempt citations and a battle in federal court over separation of powers," according to the Associated Press.

Bush "attempted to chart a course of cooperation" by releasing more than 8,500 pages of documents and sending Gonzales and other senior officials to testify before Congress, Fielding said in his letter, according to AP.

He noted that the Administration had offered a compromise where Miers, Taylor, Karl Rove and their deputies would be interviewed by Judiciary Committee aides behind closed door -- without transcripts. Democrats refused.

In related news, Democratic staff told RAW STORY that the House Committee on Oversight and Government Reform cancelled a business meeting today during which Rep. Henry Waxman (D-CA) had threatened to issue subpoenas related to White House security breaches.

DEVELOPING....
 
#19
Jesus that's blatant.
 
#20
You can't block a subpoena. It's not a suggestion its an order.
On the conceptual front. If one subpoena is not complied with, and indeed allowed not to be, it devalues all other subpoenas issued through out the states every day. The Law can't afford to lose this one.
If they haven't been arrested yet its probably because no one knows how to do it.
His resistance will be overcome. The legal framework that governs the whole of the country and everybody in it cannot be held to ransom by what is in effect now, a runaway presidency.
This is the stage where trying to stave of a presidency heading for bankruptcy, they raid the pension fund.
Its all down hill from now on in, they are going the way of Robert Maxwell, they have stepped across the line. And like Maxwell these people were surrounded by people who knew what was going on but didn't have the balls to keep it in check before it has got as far as this.

America is now in a full blown constitutional crisis.

And... er...weren't we supposed to be showing the Iraqis how to govern themselves properly, within the rule of law, or something?

Seems the Green Zone has now come to Washington.
 

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