chally 1 & Chieftain equip Regiments BAOR 1984/5

Proff3RTR

War Hero
Right, title says it all,

Am trying to track down a definitive list of which armoured regiments in BAOR around mid 84 to Mid 85 had what panzer wise, I.e which lot had Chally1 & which had Chieftain, as far as I can recall only 2 RTR and the Royal Hussars had Chally 1’s but I may well be mistaken, my lot 3 RTR did not get ours until 87/88 IIRC.
 

Arte_et_Marte

ADC
Moderator
You are correct so far.

I was with the Royal Hussars in Fally in 84/85 they had Chally 1, and I believe they were the first Regiment to get it.

2 RTR were next door, they had Chally 1 as well.
 

Proff3RTR

War Hero
You are correct so far.

I was with the Royal Hussars in Fally in 84/85 they had Chally 1, and I believe they were the first Regiment to get it.

2 RTR were next door, they had Chally 1 as well.
Nice one, am just trying to find what units had them by say August/ October 85, not many IIRC as said, RH, 2RTR & I am thinking maybe QRIH?
 

Arte_et_Marte

ADC
Moderator
Never had any dealings with QRIH mate.

I'm pretty sure that in 1985 only two Regiments had Chally 1. So the rest of 1BR Corp Armd Regts would have been on Chieftain.

I stand to be corrected though. Far too many years/beers ago. We were sending them to Jordan at the same time (SHIR?) and production plants were closed down and rebuilt somewhere else (Newcastle?) so the numbers coming off the production line was confusing.

(My old man was based at MVEE Chobham at the time, and we'd chat on the military phone network every week. He was keen to know about my adventures with Chally 1 )

RSDG definitely took them to the Gulf in GW1 (I think it was the Mk3. They needed a REME armour and desert upgrade in Saudi Arabia) but it was already superceded by Chally 2 by then.

I always thought that Chally 1 was fairly short lived to be honest.
 

Nosferatu

Clanker
Never had any dealings with QRIH mate.

I'm pretty sure that in 1985 only two Regiments had Chally 1. So the rest of 1BR Corp Armd Regts would have been on Chieftain.

I stand to be corrected though. Far too many years/beers ago. We were sending them to Jordan at the same time (SHIR?) and production plants were closed down and rebuilt somewhere else (Newcastle?) so the numbers coming off the production line was confusing.

(My old man was based at MVEE Chobham at the time, and we'd chat on the military phone network every week. He was keen to know about my adventures with Chally 1 )

RSDG definitely took them to the Gulf in GW1 (I think it was the Mk3. They needed a REME armour and desert upgrade in Saudi Arabia) but it was already superceded by Chally 2 by then.

I always thought that Chally 1 was fairly short lived to be honest.
You can definitely add QRIH to your list.
York Barracks in Munster, and deployed with them on GW 1'
Best regards
Nosferatu
 

Boxy

GCM
Scots DG didn’t get Challenger until they took over from the Royal Hussars in Fally, ‘88 or ‘89
 

Proff3RTR

War Hero
Never had any dealings with QRIH mate.

I'm pretty sure that in 1985 only two Regiments had Chally 1. So the rest of 1BR Corp Armd Regts would have been on Chieftain.

I stand to be corrected though. Far too many years/beers ago. We were sending them to Jordan at the same time (SHIR?) and production plants were closed down and rebuilt somewhere else (Newcastle?) so the numbers coming off the production line was confusing.

(My old man was based at MVEE Chobham at the time, and we'd chat on the military phone network every week. He was keen to know about my adventures with Chally 1 )

RSDG definitely took them to the Gulf in GW1 (I think it was the Mk3. They needed a REME armour and desert upgrade in Saudi Arabia) but it was already superceded by Chally 2 by then.

I always thought that Chally 1 was fairly short lived to be honest.
Very short lived, a little over 12 years between in service date and first Chally 2 getting to 2nd Tanks, my second Regiment & RSDG in Fally we had them a few months and they got sent back, they were not working properly! I was Chieftain trained, but when I got out to Germany my first Regiment (3 RTR) was on Chally 1’s which was late 88, I think the 3rd converted either late 87 or early 88, but as I am not sure and it is outside the time line I am looking at it is irrelevant.

All the best
 
Blues and Royals had them in Paderborn in 88. I think they were so equipped in 87. They were a Type 44 regiment.

IIRC there was a wheeze where CR1 regiments were reduced to 44 tanks, with only 3 Sabre squadrons so that more could be converted.
 
CR1 was supposed to have a longer life. We were to have a two-tier force a bit like with CR1/Chieftain but then cuts got in the way.
Options for Change in 1992. The original plan was for only two regiments of CR2, with the rest of the MBT fleet being replaced in the early 2000s by something undecided. However, because of the size of the overall cuts decimating the equipment programme in the early 90s bit of the LTC, we realised we could actually go for a whole fleet of CR2s in the mid 90s to fill a black hole in LTC years 3 and 4 - the only debate was whether to have six strong or eight weak regiments.
 
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AlienFTM

MIA
Book Reviewer
Blues and Royals had them in Paderborn in 88. I think they were so equipped in 87. They were a Type 44 regiment.

IIRC there was a wheeze where CR1 regiments were reduced to 44 tanks, with only 3 Sabre squadrons so that more could be converted.
Paging @aghart .

On the Omagh RAC Regiment Facebook page there is an excellent explanation as to why RAC handed Omagh to the infantry.

Nothing to do with owning 53% of the border (see Op Banner Post Op Report, attached to Arrse as a PDF many years ago. Good luck finding it) on an OrBat smaller than an infantry battalion.

I remember when I was in Osnabrück early 80s, St Maggie announced she wanted another armoured regiment. There were Chieftains to spare as regiments converted to CR1. Hand Omagh over to the infantry, free up a recce regiment, equip with Chieftain. Jobbed.
 

Bardeyai

Old-Salt
You are correct so far.

I was with the Royal Hussars in Fally in 84/85 they had Chally 1, and I believe they were the first Regiment to get it.

2 RTR were next door, they had Chally 1 as well.
Pretty sure 17/21L had Challenger 1 in 1985 because I went up to visit the Royal Hussars to collect some of yours for reasons I know not.
 

Arte_et_Marte

ADC
Moderator
CR1 was supposed to have a longer life. We were to have a two-tier force a bit like with CR1/Chieftain but then cuts got in the way.

Nothing to do with the life of Chally 1 as it was always going to be replaced early, but we all know that the L60 powerpack in Chieftain was a horrible liability, but there were massive problems with Chally 1 as well. The RH were down to 55% full strength after a two weeker in the field, bombing around Soltau. I have never worked so hard and for so long. It was a better tank, but I don't look back with rose tinted specs.

Blues and Royals had them in Paderborn in 88. I think they were so equipped in 87. They were a Type 44 regiment.

IIRC there was a wheeze where CR1 regiments were reduced to 44 tanks, with only 3 Sabre squadrons so that more could be converted.
The Blues and Royals were usually in Lothian Barracks in Detmold. They swapped out with the Lifeguards every 4/5 years. I think they they left in October '86 to go to Athlone Barracks. (Senelager)

I was with the Royal Hussars they were deffo a 43 type Regiment on Challenger in 1985.

I know that that the OP is only interested in the years 84/85 but wasn't there three 43 type Regiments and four 57 type Regiments in BAOR in 1990? I know that the RH really wanted more tanks than they had.
 

Arte_et_Marte

ADC
Moderator
Pretty sure 17/21L had Challenger 1 in 1985 because I went up to visit the Royal Hussars to collect some of yours for reasons I know not.
17/21 obviously did get Challenger, but I am sure it was later than that. Perhaps your CO just wanted a practise cabby in one before they got the full roll out?
 

LD17

MIA
@Proff3RTR
From the 1983 Staff College Precis

1632301914200.png
 

LD17

MIA
and from my notes:
Challenger 1 deployment

RH @Fallingbostel Aug 1984 (finished delivery)
2 RTR @ Fallingbostel Aug 1984 (began delivery)
17/21 L @ Munster Dec 1985 (began)
QRIH @ Munster June 1986 (began)
RHD/1D @ Sennelager May 1987 (began)
3 RTR @ Hemer Feb 1988 (began)
QOH @ Hohne Jan 1990 (finished delivery)
 

Arte_et_Marte

ADC
Moderator
and from my notes:
Challenger 1 deployment

RH @Fallingbostel Aug 1984 (finished delivery)
2 RTR @ Fallingbostel Aug 1984 (began delivery)
17/21 L @ Munster Dec 1985 (began)
QRIH @ Munster June 1986 (began)
RHD/1D @ Sennelager May 1987 (began)
3 RTR @ Hemer Feb 1988 (began)
QOH @ Hohne Jan 1990 (finished delivery)

That fits in nicely with my fuzzed memory. Nice one.
 
Just to confirm 2RTR started getting CR1 1984 at Fally, at the Standards Parade in 1985 at Paderborn (all four RTR Regts) in front of the Queen 2RTR were the only Regt with CR1.
One did fail to start oops!
 
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