CGS: British Army to get US style 'Commissioned Warrant Officers'?

Discussion in 'Current Affairs, News and Analysis' started by jim30, Jul 9, 2017.

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  1. Yeah, I mean it comes back to powers for the job, I was highlighting that I'm totally ignorant of what powers the crabs might need to do their jobs so passing no judgement on their insistence that it's service police. From the civi side of the fence, I was having a (tenuous) guess at why that might be.
  2. seaweed

    seaweed LE Book Reviewer

    Because they had a completely different role in a ship with responsibilities for welfare as well as discipline. Why they had to be squeezed into a one-size-fits-all 'police' role baffles me.
  3. seaweed

    seaweed LE Book Reviewer

    It will be interesting to see how this need for specialist cyber-warriors plays out on board HM ships. Rhetorical qn as the answer is surely classified.
  4. Auld-Yin

    Auld-Yin LE Reviewer Book Reviewer Reviews Editor

    As long as they don't use their magic elektrickery stuff to try and change the rules of Uckers......
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  5. Yes likewise...why? Because...forms. Oh god. The forms.

    I was in absolutely no way playing the my squirrels are more secret than your squirrels game.

    I invoke the bridge because I don't want to be pushing the conversation in an inappropriate direction, not because I think you're going to say something you shouldn't at all. Enough lurking on here has led me to observe some questionable probing from strangers before now. As another poster said earlier of me, "Who the hell are you and where have you popped up from". I'm just making a point of wearing that on my sleeve.

    I am however, very interested in the organisational structures across different organisations and how they might get better and that question of what they do, legal power, statutory mission/role etc.
  6. Indeed. This would almost certainly best be done by outsiders. However, the results of their objective research would be subject to horrific political fighting.

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  7. Grey Fleet, Submariners or WAFU rules? I assume the Droggies have their own rules too but managed to avoid any exposure to those.
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  8. ugly

    ugly LE Moderator

    Interestingly I wonder how many professionally qualified SME types would want to subject themselves to Military discipline at that time of life. Its very different recruiting ex sncos from the army into the Navy at PO rank to do techy work and expecting a clerk of works or MIET to give up home life, mortgage and kids (these folk tend to be trade trained not graduates) having grafted hard to get off the tools and into supervisory level, to chuck it all in and argue over down and out or up and in!
  9. Much as we all love to indulge in the 'cyber warrior' and 'fourth military force' fantasies, they are not what was being spoken about in Gen Carter's interview. What the article did state was:
    1. Army leaders will be recruited direct from the civilian world rather than rising up through the ranks, under a proposed overhaul to bring in specialist skills for 21st century warfare.
    2. The British Army is considering hiring direct from industry and the boardroom to get civilians who have already had established careers in areas like cyber technology, aviation technology and logistics.
    3. the modern way of working suggests that as we embrace a lot of the specialisms that we have got to embrace, we are going to have to offer different career structures.
    4. would need profound changes to careers structures and the way the Army recognises status.
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  10. Actually, something very close to the answer for defensive / reactionary ops (normal jogging and CPTs) is earlier in the thread.

    How defence does offensive cyber war on the frontline is a humongous problem that hundreds of special interest groups know they have the only answer for!
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  11. We seem to have made a sweeping assumption that this is all about "Cyber", whatever that is!

    Firstly, I don't think it is.. I think there is a fundamental issue with nurturing and sustaining a whole raft of specialist capability across the military spectrum: forensics, legal and cultural factors, weapon capabilities and civil engineering to name but a few..

    Secondly, I think there is a danger in dealing with "cyber" as a single issue.. I don't think it is at all.. from where I stand there are at least four facets to the issue:

    1. Constructing and operating information systems in direct support of military operations.
    2. Constructing maintaining and defending data transmission paths in a hostile environment.
    3. Conducting enemy data capture and analysis operations.
    4. Conducting active offensive operations against enemy information and communication infrastructures.

    I humbly suggest that although such functions are mutually supportive, they are unlikely to be generated by a common core process..
    Last edited: Jul 13, 2017
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  12. ....and I repeat my point that we did have these creatures, and we got rid of them because our promotion system was allowed to morph into something that forced them out! We need to find some way in which the myopic views and influence of the Fishheads, Steely Eyed Killers and FJ Pilots are moderated within the selection system..

    Carter is, along with many in MoD, deluded if he thinks that such individuals exist in the outside world, or that he can recruit them. The system will no doubt recruit someone into these posts, however I strongly suggest they will either be bluffers or receive a stiff ignoring from the rest of the system if they show any competence whatsoever..

    Whole life career management by functional area might just achieve something in the long term.. short term fiddling with sticking plaster solutions simply illustrate the depth of the mess we are in..!
    Last edited: Jul 13, 2017
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  13. Agreed it would only stand a chance in my view if Staff and Regimental Duties careers became separate specialisms in their own right and we did away with the Generalist Officer concept which is now no longer a fit for what is required.
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  14. Totally and the CGS has described several models and one is about senior leadership imported. This one is really important because one wants to understand how they will succeed in the incumbent culture to actively help and also the army aren't leading the charge on this (the cops are trying to do this and have at least one cadre in place) BUT the organisational culture is at least setup in the military that not everyone is created equal*

    *no value judgement, a factual observation on culture
  15. I don't think it matters where the expert comes from; grown internally, recruited from industry, contractor it consultant. If decision makers can't access the expertise because it is buried beneath layers of bluffing staff officer, because they don't know what to ask or how to use the advice, then the expert is pointless.
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