CEREMONIAL UNIFORMS. Looking for some help!

AlienFTM

MIA
Book Reviewer
I don’t think that’s Dave Rutherford Jones - he’s quite short
Why I doubted it myself. He hasn't been Colonel all that long. Probably his predecessor depending on the age of the picture.
 

AlienFTM

MIA
Book Reviewer
but you also get runs like this. Subtle differences don't make for good posters
In a similar vein, I remember once hearing posited that no map of the world is accurate three weeks after it is published.

May have been Tomorrow's World ages ago, while looking at turning aerial photos into maps in half an hour.
 

Caecilius

LE
Kit Reviewer
Book Reviewer
Nothing is ever easy is it haha, just when I think I've found the answer it creates more questions - I found this pic online tagged as being the LD. I'd hazard a guess the LD are on the right with the buff collars, but who are the ones on the left? My eyesight is failing, but could they be the old 9th/12th lancers? I'm starting to think this poster is an act of masochism!
This is the problem you'll have. Both sets of uniform are LDs, but from different antecedent regiments. Much of the cavalry will be the same because full dress isn't worn so nobody bothered to design a new one when they amalgamated. For example, the Lancers full dress you've put on the poster seems to be 16th, but there are five other variations to consider.
 

AlienFTM

MIA
Book Reviewer
This is the problem you'll have. Both sets of uniform are LDs, but from different antecedent regiments. Much of the cavalry will be the same because full dress isn't worn so nobody bothered to design a new one when they amalgamated. For example, the Lancers full dress you've put on the poster seems to be 16th, but there are five other variations to consider.
I seem to recall in his history, Mallinson makes the point that the amicable Light Dragoons amalgamation allowed them to design entirely new uniforms in the spirit of the four component regiments.

For example the LD regimental belt is worn over the shoulder, which wasn't the case certainly in 15/19H and AFAIK, 13/18H, whilst retaining the Assaye elephant, a 19H accoutrement.

I believe LD PTU has no direct link back to either 15/19H or 13/18H.
 

Caecilius

LE
Kit Reviewer
Book Reviewer
I seem to recall in his history, Mallinson makes the point that the amicable Light Dragoons amalgamation allowed them to design entirely new uniforms in the spirit of the four component regiments.

For example the LD regimental belt is worn over the shoulder, which wasn't the case certainly in 15/19H and AFAIK, 13/18H, whilst retaining the Assaye elephant, a 19H accoutrement.

I believe LD PTU has no direct link back to either 15/19H or 13/18H.
I think that's the case with most amalgamations where compromises on uniforms need to be made, but looking at that photograph it seems that LDs have separate stocks of full dress from their antecedents. It's hard to explain the different collar and Busby colours otherwise.
 

AlienFTM

MIA
Book Reviewer
Nothing is ever easy is it haha, just when I think I've found the answer it creates more questions - I found this pic online tagged as being the LD. I'd hazard a guess the LD are on the right with the buff collars, but who are the ones on the left? My eyesight is failing, but could they be the old 9th/12th lancers? I'm starting to think this poster is an act of masochism!
Flash of inspiration. LD took over Robertson Barracks, Swanton Morley maybe 15-20 years ago, from 9/12L. Maybe this picture relates to that occasion, hence, apparently, LD and Lancer uniforms.

40 years ago we didn't bother with that sort of ceremony. Who knows? Shrug.
 

footpad6

Old-Salt
Afternoon chaps..........so, where do I draw the line?
You draw it through the words "The King's Troop" as the I'm sure you wouldn't want to insult the guys and girls of the Chestnut Troop, and the thirteen other Batteries of Royal Horse Artillery serving within the Orbat. Also, on the PDF attached, white hackles on a white background isn't working. :rolleyes:
 

2/51

LE
Teeny tiny point, the tartan patch for the RRofS should actually be off-centre. It is a strange quirk and I do not know why it is such. Have added a picture.

Black buttons on the spats as well, which is a very important differentiation from other Scottish units that have spats (mainly bands right enough).


 

Xenol

Swinger
You draw it through the words "The King's Troop" as the I'm sure you wouldn't want to insult the guys and girls of the Chestnut Troop, and the thirteen other Batteries of Royal Horse Artillery serving within the Orbat. Also, on the PDF attached, white hackles on a white background isn't working. :rolleyes:
There's a reason I included the rest of the RHA below, it's in order of precedence. The background is only temporary anyway.
 

Xenol

Swinger
Teeny tiny point, the tartan patch for the RRofS should actually be off-centre. It is a strange quirk and I do not know why it is such. Have added a picture.

Black buttons on the spats as well, which is a very important differentiation from other Scottish units that have spats (mainly bands right enough).
Thanks for the note on buttons - the squares are actually the stable-belt colours rather than TRFs however in this poster.
 
I really couldn't tell you.

However, for reference, the bloke fine upstanding man in the centre is Abdullah II bin Al-Hussein, King of Jordan, and Colonel-in-Chief of the Light Dragoons. I half suspect the man talking to him is David Rutherford-Jones - Wikipedia, Colonel of the Light Dragoons.

Edit. But I could be wrong on the latter. He was a nig looie when I was in and it's a few years since I saw him when he oversaw the building of the new Tank Museum.
I was at Camberley with DR-J, he retired in 2011 and I'm assuming that picture was taken in 2017 when King Abdullah's son commissioned? If so it should be Paul Nanson at his side, but he's a Fusilier...
 

Caecilius

LE
Kit Reviewer
Book Reviewer
Flash of inspiration. LD took over Robertson Barracks, Swanton Morley maybe 15-20 years ago, from 9/12L. Maybe this picture relates to that occasion, hence, apparently, LD and Lancer uniforms.

40 years ago we didn't bother with that sort of ceremony. Who knows? Shrug.
The gold things across the chest are from Hussar uniforms. Lancers would have a two-tone jacket with a big patch over the chest and dragoon guards would have a plain tunic.
 

Caecilius

LE
Kit Reviewer
Book Reviewer
I was at Camberley with DR-J, he retired in 2011 and I'm assuming that picture was taken in 2017 when King Abdullah's son commissioned? If so it should be Paul Nanson at his side, but he's a Fusilier...
The pic looks like it's in Swanton Morley rather than Camberley to me.
 
The pic looks like it's in Swanton Morley rather than Camberley to me.
Could well be - just conflating the King with the 2017 Sov's Parade that he did and thinking it could be that walk up from Queen Vic to the saluting dais.

I blame the fog.
 

AlienFTM

MIA
Book Reviewer
The gold things across the chest are from Hussar uniforms. Lancers would have a two-tone jacket with a big patch over the chest and dragoon guards would have a plain tunic.
I did a Queen's birthday at JHQ I think in 79. Since I passed the 9/12L comment above, I seem to recall their ceremonial headdress reminded me then of a policeman's helmet and their dress uniform bore no resemblance to that of hussars.

But I could be wrong.
 

footpad6

Old-Salt
There's a reason I included the rest of the RHA below, it's in order of precedence. The background is only temporary anyway.
Ah, I think I understand the issue now: you fundamentally don't understand how this works.

The Royal Horse Artillery (RHA) has a ceremonial uniform, there are currently fifteen sub units of RHA, each of which, if the occasion demands, wear the ceremonial uniform. Each of which, if the occasion demands, would take up the position afforded by you to the King's Troop.
The RHA also has a Number One Dress ( no1 Dress) each of the units, if the occasion demands, would wear this - including the King's Troop.


FYI: Within the RHA there is an order of seniority ( precedence ) it runs from the most Senior, The Chestnut Troop ( A Bty, The Chestnut Troop RHA to give it's full title) through great units such as Mercer's Troop (G Parachute Bty, Mercer's Troop RHA) right down to the most junior, The King's Troop RHA.
 

Chimp

ADC
 

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