Centralised Bergen / Webbing storage

#1
Firstly sorry if this has been covered elsewhere - I did a search but didn't find anything!

May I ask how many units have G4 controlled bergen / webbing storage and issue, before and after training, as opposed to individuals keeping them inside or above their lockers?

Am I the only one that thinks it is a monumental waste of time and, therefore, money in wasted hours drawing and returning them?

Apparently it is meant to reduce theft of the bergen / webbing / sleeping system when people leave the TA; however, judging by the number of bergens above lockers, it seems that very few people take their bergens home anyway.

Once again, the regular attenders are being punished, as the non-attenders are not inconvenienced by virtue of their absence.

How do units manage the issue and return of these items before and after training? How long does it take? Are they stored empty or full?

Comments / rants welcome...

Hartman
 
#2
In my old unit, initially webbing, sleeping bags and bivvy bags were issued to the troops. (40 sets to each troop, who kept them in their stores) However there were frequent cases of bivvy bags going missing from the troop stores. I then introduced a LTI (Long term issue sheet) listing each item of webbing and a few boxes on the bottom for a signature, which was updated regularly. Individuals were then allowed to take their webbing home, which created space in the stores. That not issued was boxed, labelled and sealed.


The LTI sheet was deemed as an accountable document by the QM and as such if an individual left, he would be chased for the webbing etc. If he was not caught, it was ent with a case file for write off action.

Only works if you have the QM and a few others on your side I suppose
 
#3
Taffnp thanks for your reply, although, I meant something completely different: bergen, webbing and sleeping system being issued immediately prior to training and taken in after it.

It must impact training time, not to mention messing everyone about, and taking up much needed stores space. It would be interesting to see the workings out of the brain-box who thought of this plan.
 
#4
I know what you meant, and my old unit once had that system. Each weekend before training, it was a case of drawing weapon, rations and webbing and at the end of the weekend handing it back in. Even worse, it was stripped into it's component parts!!! It therefore had to be assembled and stripped each time.

The SQMS at the time was a bean counter and when there was an inspection, he could show x amount of belts, ammo pouches etc.

Why not suggest to someone sympathetic that it would be better to issue it as a long term issue and records would be stored in a Webbing folder. No great hardship and makes life easier all round.

For inspections you have 40 sets of webbing on the shelf and 60 on LTI = 100 either way.
 
#5
That's what we have now and have had for years.

We sign a form on initial issue. When people discharge they hand it back or get billed if things are missing or taken to Court if things are missing and they don't respond.

But now they want the entire unit, every man-jack, to hand in bergen and webbing to the stores and draw it out "for legitinate training" purposes only!

Some cretin wrote a LANDSO and every TA unit has had to do this.

Good grief.
 
#6
I think if that was the case, I would look for my own set of webbing. If bits wear out, you can always change them.

I remember on one weekend, there were about 12 of us waiting to hand in our webbing with the contents in the Bergan, (never got the same one again) The storeman was overwhelmed and as a result never checked it all before returning the paperwork on which it was signed for. As a result many people took advantage and had the odd water bottle and spare ammo pouch. This made it a worse idea rather than prevent the loss of kit, it promoted it.
 
#8
irlsgt said:
Why not have regular/irregular inspections of kit to make sure it hasn't gone missing?
Because generally theft is not the problem - this will get picked up quickly. It is people having all this stuff at home, drifting out of the TA and not handing it back in.

Often the cost of recovery is greater than that of the kit. That said, a mil landrover turning up at your house with a shouty SQMS can get an awful lot of stuff back very cheaply.

msr
 
#9
msr said:
irlsgt said:
Why not have regular/irregular inspections of kit to make sure it hasn't gone missing?
Because generally theft is not the problem - this will get picked up quickly. It is people having all this stuff at home, drifting out of the TA and not handing it back in.

Often the cost of recovery is greater than that of the kit. That said, a mil landrover turning up at your house with a shouty SQMS can get an awful lot of stuff back very cheaply.

msr
Problem is that Pte X is not flagged as a non attender for about three months, a number of cordial letters are sent to welcome him back into the fold etc.

Before there is the kit collection process, six months or longer may have elapsed. When you knock on his door, you often get someone completely different answer and say "Joe Bloggs" ? never lived here, or has moved to some far flung place for work.


That was it, case file of all his 1157 kit and any 1033's and any locally produced LTI forms submitted to QM for write off.

However being stubborn, I often tracked down the individual and contacted the local RMP's or MOD Plod. Had one who worked in a hospital and MOD plod called to visit. Got all his kit back :)
 
#10
Taffnp said:
msr said:
irlsgt said:
Why not have regular/irregular inspections of kit to make sure it hasn't gone missing?
Because generally theft is not the problem - this will get picked up quickly. It is people having all this stuff at home, drifting out of the TA and not handing it back in.

Often the cost of recovery is greater than that of the kit. That said, a mil landrover turning up at your house with a shouty SQMS can get an awful lot of stuff back very cheaply.

msr
Problem is that Pte X is not flagged as a non attender for about three months, a number of cordial letters are sent to welcome him back into the fold etc.

Before there is the kit collection process, six months or longer may have elapsed. When you knock on his door, you often get someone completely different answer and say "Joe Bloggs" ? never lived here, or has moved to some far flung place for work.


That was it, case file of all his 1157 kit and any 1033's and any locally produced LTI forms submitted to QM for write off.

However being stubborn, I often tracked down the individual and contacted the local RMP's or MOD Plod. Had one who worked in a hospital and MOD plod called to visit. Got all his kit back :)
Hence, I suspect, the new directive...

msr
 
#11
Personally I liked having my bergen/webbing home, so I could sort my sh!t out without having to run around like a mad thing of friday night! How about some kind of deposit system?
 
#12
Its a shite idea .Adds to time on weekends and messes bloke around for no reason .Kits signed out to me yet I am supposed to leave it in a store room .So if stuff goes missing probably cant claim on insurance and will be billed for it .Not to mention the admin nightmare.
 
#13
omegahunter said:
Personally I liked having my bergen/webbing home, so I could sort my sh!t out without having to run around like a mad thing of friday night! How about some kind of deposit system?
This was mentioned a few years ago with regards to 1157 issued kit, and it was deemed inappropriate. There was also talk of witholding the first months pay. However, if it is a voluntary matter I see no problem whatsoever. The kit is paid for and when the individual leaves, he gets his money back.


Those that do not wish to pay the deposit will have to come in and pack their kit.

However a simple good idea here will take years to be thought of elsewhere
 
#14
Thanks for your replies...

I would be interested to hear which TA units are running this system before and after training and how it is working out for you!

Also does anyone happen to have a copy of LANDSO 6102 as I am not at a DII terminal today.

Many thanks.
 
#15
Sounds gash to me... why can't they simply keep hold of some of your back pay?

When you leave if you hand in all your monkeys and parrots = you get the wonga.

Leave without returning kit = MOD keeps the wonga.

Its not that hard.
 

The_Duke

LE
Moderator
#16
We run this system. It is not ideal but it works well enough.

The problem with issuing kit to everyone is not limited to theft - there are also the equipment care concerns.

Part of the handing back process is the question of "Any breakages? Anything need replacing?", allowing the NRPS to replace/repair as required. Any dirty kit is returned to the soldier for cleaning before being handed in, and any wet kit labelled and hung up to dry before being packed back in the individual boxes.

Of course, all soldiers are paragons of EC virtue, and would never keep dirty, wet, kit stuffed in their lockers/garage if they took it home at endex. They would always report all damages immediately to allow the system to request replacements rather than turning up 30 seconds before the transport departs on a Friday to hand in their shredded webbing, expecting an instant replacement. :roll:
 
#17
pardon my ignorance, why cant it be issued on an 1157 and the soldier/officer keeps it however they wish. If they want to keep it in the TAC (which should be encouraged) or take it home if they leave then it gets billed to them.
As an ex regular I kept all my kit at home, easier to sort it out as and when required. When I left I handed it all in, any missing items was billed and if during my service I had damages/missing kit it was upto me during diffys and exchange to square it away.
Ive recentley joined the TA and havent yet been issued any webbing, I think my unit issues the kit then it is stored in the TAC, cant see the problem with this aslong as when its required, its issued and I can keep my own webbing.
 
#18
I keep my set in a locker at my TAC.
If I need it it's there and if we have a kit inspection, it's there. It's also handy because once you customise (extra pouches ect.) it you don't have to dissasemble it just to go back into stores!

Or why not use your bounty to buy an assault vest?
 

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