Campaigning begins for 2009.

Discussion in 'The Intelligence Cell' started by Nehustan, Jan 2, 2006.

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  1. Nehustan

    Nehustan On ROPs

    It seems pretty clear to me that campaigning hasn't stopped since the elections last year. This is of course understandable, the lesser election for the Tory leadership almost directly after the general election kept the 'battlebus' rolling.We have three parties with everything to lose.

    The Labour party has its status as the Governemnet to lose, and just how badly they lose, if they do not secure an unheard of 4th term, will denote the future of their party in the C21st. I mean this party is only around a 100 years old, a little older if one considers the Fabian society as its origin. Surely the question is do we need three parties all clamouring for the centre ground? If we don't then eventually the centre will become too crowded, and as the famous axiom goes 'last one in first one out'. Without the socialist rationale of the labour party what function do they serve? If they have moved to the centre ground (or actually further right than that) they now occupy a political arena historically inhabited by Liberal/Wig thought, which I suppose could be summed up succinctly as by nature consensus politics.

    So let us consider the Liberals. It seems that their leader is in trouble. I find it totally bizarre that Liberals, by the nature of their politic, would even consider 'blaming' a leader, as I have said the Liberal ethic may best be considered as 'consensus', so if the party is in trouble it is the fault of the whole party. Liberalism is about ethics not personalities, I personally love watching the Liberal conference and thinking 'Oh my god can these people look any more Geeky' then I listen and even with the fact they look like they should be driving Citroen 2CVs, I find I agree with them despite the fact they often look like they should be having tea at the vicars, leading a scout troop, or working at the National Trust. I think when the Liberals come through this suspicious (its pretty obvious who have the party in their sights, I'm not sure if they intend destruction or an attempt at takeover, time will tell) attack on their leadership and thus party, people will come to realise that Liberal politics is more about 'consensus' than leadership, especially a 'leadership' that has increased its share of the vote, that's success isn't it? The Liberals maybe have the least to lose in this parliamentary term of constant campaigning, as they are sure to continue growth, especially as the C21st century progresses, after all Britian is by its nature a Liberal Democracy, within which the Wigs have a long established tradition.

    So what about the Conservatives. This Cameron chap seems pretty radical in his view of 21st Century politics, what do they term it, 'compassionate conservatism'? The Labour party has brushed of their clamour about 3rd world development, effectively saying 'put your money where you mouth is....actions speak louder...' etc. The Labour party had better be careful with this challenge. Certain people 'in the know' will probably have much information to leak as this campaigning goes on. Sure there's a lot of info covered by OSA, but there's enough people who haven't signed OSA (i.e. NGO people) to talk about all the good work that has been done (anyone bumped into any ex-sappers who seems to always be travelling to the developing world???), beginning during the last conservative government. When the conservatives are accused of jumping on the 'band wagon' of third world development, the Labour Party may in fact be 'people in glass houses throwing stones' and I'm not just talking about the hermetically sealed 'glass houses' in Thames House. The very permanent under secreataries who have been advising them on such third world issues, may be continuing objectives set down in the end days of the Conservative government. In which case the Labour party may well end up with egg on their face. When it comes to the clues, they're not that deeply hidden, they may easily emerge when the time is right, when they do I'm sure people will say 'No s**t Sherlock!!!'

    So then its full steam ahead by my reckoning with solid campaigning and dirty tricks all the way to the ballot box...don't you just love democracy :twisted:
  2. Good post Nehustan

    I feel we have the choice between a rock an a hard place with Labour and the Conservatives, no wonder people are disaffected with democracy in this country and the new Toryboy will not make any difference, it is all an act.

    At least Labour has to keep a sense of social justice, with the Conservatives it will be open shop on privatising everything.

    I think the best choice might be to give Gordon Brown a try, he seems to be old Labour more than pretend labour and that is what we desperately need right now.

    In an ideal world we would be able to follow the Liberal ideas, but they will never get in, so I am not going to vote for them and give the Conservatives a chance. The Liberals are needed though, more than ever, as a balance to the other two moving to the right.

    I am worried that a vacuum is forming and something more unpleasant may fill it, but perhaps we are just moving to a political system more like the sepitcs with two right of centre parties with one more on the right than the other.

    Blair always has be a conservative, as far as I'm concerned anyway and I will be glad to see the back of the little **** and his hangers on like his Mrs.
  3. Nehustan

    Nehustan On ROPs

    Yep Blair is as 'dubious as dubya' (wow I just coined a new metaphor!!!!) I recall sometime ago hearing a 'rumour' that Blair was recruited by MI5 while at University to spy on his fellow lefties. Had a brief look around and found a page related to that rumour, seems to trace back to hearsay from Shayler...

    'But I think the only way we can explain Blair's behaviour is that he is blackmailable by the intelligence services. I know that the intelligence services have files on most of the Labour government because I saw some of the files while I was there. In fact ... [inaudible audience interjections, laughter] ...Well, one of the things I want to tell you is that – I actually, I didn't see this myself, I must admit – but somebody who was reviewing Blair's file, this was when Blair was unknown really, in 1992, not particularly well known, told me that Blair was an MI5 agent. In the 1980s he'd reported on members of CND and the so-called Trotskyists in the Labour Party.'

    Sorry for the 'hearsay' but after all this is the Rumour Service :twisted:
  4. What a load of unsubstantiated crap. I don't doubt the existence of files, but The Security Service, blackmailing the PM into changing policy ? Someones been watching Spooks methinks. "I saw them" - Then "well actually it was someone who told me" Hmmm that sounds plausible. If you know someone in TH who is leaking info, I'd be careful. Especially talking about it on this means. You might end up being visited by the chaps on the First Floor.
  5. Nehustan

    Nehustan On ROPs

    You're absolutely right, it is very unlikley that the SS are blackmailing Blair. That he had a handler from his time since University, that's probably a given, but I guess when he becomes the PM its a lot easier to have 'meets', they're called 'briefings'. He's a rat, and is certainly like no socialist I have ever met. I cite his policies as evidence, they are certainly NOT hearsay.


    As to posting here I draw you attention to the name of this forum, I'd posit that the word rumour justifies 'hearsay'.

    (P.S. As to C Branch, they don't usually seem to complain.)
  6. I use the rule with conspiracies, that people in general are both stupid and lazy, therefore to cook up and actually make most of these convoluted conspiracies work, when we cant get a train to run on time or shoot the wrong Brazilians on the Tube, does not seem to stand up.

    Most things a I'm afraid are a coincidence.

    Don't know where I heard this, ( maybe while I was being abducted by aliens 8O ) but it rings true to me.

    Take the objective Diana test as an example:

    :?: What is more likely a MI6 conspiracy led by Phil the Greek


    :?: The habitual drunk chauffer ran into a wall driving too fast in a tunnel

    Blair might be a nasty piece of work, but I also doubt he is in the pocket of MI5. Shayler was just attempting to cook up some more publicity for his book I expect.

    The real worry is the new Toryboy is a Blair mk2 without the left of the Labour party to hold him in check.

  7. Hold on.
    I thought the SS were no more, after the second world war?
  8. Nehustan

    Nehustan On ROPs

    Sorry...Security Service (SS), MI5, 'Holy' Office, Dream Factory ;) I like SS tho', it makes me smile :twisted:
  9. Nehustan

    Nehustan On ROPs

    I think you are right in the case of Diana to apply Ockham's razor, but in regard to the SS I think the situation in NI with the Sinn Fein fellow proves the service's capability of infiltrating (if in fact not creating in totality, but thats another issue) organisations. Let's not forget that during the 70s and 80's elements in the Labour/Socialist movement were seen as a VERY real threat, as was the CCCP. 'Recruiting' an ex-public schoolboy 'socialist'? Well within the realms of possibility.....
  10. Certainly feasible. But don't you think that this would have appeared with a bit more plausibility? He is very unpopular with a LOT of Labour MP's (mine is Denis Skinner FFS), and don't you think that some unattributable backbriefing would have occured. Or hasn't the press got the balls to run it? It would be in the interest of both sides of the media to run this. Remember the old song from Magazine "Shot by both sides" ??
  11. Nehustan

    Nehustan On ROPs

    No unsubstantiated crap would be saying he was going to defect to the Conservative party and be able to launch an attack on the Labour party in '45 minutes.' :twisted:
  12. Nehustan

    Nehustan On ROPs

    Good points, you may be right...I'm sure if the evidence came up it would be run, it would however be seen as a direct attempt to bring down the Labour party (and of course they'd try and hide behind the HMG appellation they currently hold, but I doubt their downfall would really destabilise the UK), and as I said in my first post

    The Labour Party would have a considerable amount to lose if there was any truth to this, even if it was just that Blair was more Fabian than Trotsky. There is no doubt that the 'outing' of the Sinn Fein fellow will cause much damage to them, even tho' in the short term they think they can profit from the sneaky behaviour of the SS...newsflash...they're spooks...its their job.
  13. The outing of the SF mole will not damage the Labour Party. It will infact enhance the reputation. The outing of agents is a double edged sword. The cudo's of the population finding out that the security apparatus is competant, as against the loss of a source.
  14. I seem to remember reading somewhere that Blair was planning on joining the Conservatives originally, but then got converted to the labour party after meeting Cherie. Would go some way to explaining a few things, least of all the say-one-thing-and-do-the-complete-opposite habit in education.
  15. Cameron has been REALLY clever in offering to Back Blairs reforms, and even dared him to go further. Don't underestimate Cameron, I think he's quite a wily character.