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Camerons EU Speech

Travelgall

MIA
Kit Reviewer
#1
David Cameron's EU speech: full text » Spectator Blogs

Ideally I'd love a non party political comment on this but it is Arrse. I guess to the EU this speech is shocking, but to me its fairly mild in terms of what could have been said. Personally I would have laid it on a bit more about the numbers of British soldiers who are buried in cemeteries because Europeans tend to like dictators - Napoleon, Hitler, Kaiser Bill, Milloseyvic, Milosievik - That Serb fella. I would have also been straight on the phone after the speech to Angela reminding her Britain just became Germany's biggest partner; and that if we choose to leave she better stop thinking about trade tariffs otherwise she'll be getting some rather irate calls from BMW, Audi and Volkswagen et all.

Assuming that this speech had to be made, how would you have done it and how will all the other political parties react?
 
#2
The thing that occured to me and seems to have been ignored by all is what happens if the UK does say Bye bye.

Everyone keeps going on about how we can still carry on doing business etc but what if the EU gets a monk on and just says "You know what, **** you. Go sell and buy your stuff from the Chinks and the Africans".

Could be fun :)
 
#3
Not going to happen anyway.

Unless Cam gets his hands in his pockets quickly and starts handing out the money domestically, he'll be dead and buried before the Tories get a sniff of power again. (Scottish independence excepted).
 
#4
Didn`t he promise a referendum if he got in last time ? Seems like he`s just using this to put the frighteners on europe, and maybe claw back some of the conservative losses to UKIP.
Even if he gets in next time, he`ll find some excuse not to have a referendum, it`s all smoke and mirrors when it comes to any of the political parties.
 

Wordsmith

LE
Book Reviewer
#5
It's Call Me Dave playing politics again. He's under pressure on three fronts:

-- An increasingly eurosceptic UK electorate
-- Over 100 backbenchers discontented over Europe.
-- UKIP now polling regularly over 10% in the opinion polls.

All of those hit his chances of winning a majority in 2015.

My money says he want to promise a poll after the next election then try and weasel out of it (just like his last manifesto promise to hold a referendum on repatriating powers). But I think he's now put the possibility of an in/out referendum firmly in the UK electorate's consciousness and I think momentum for one will now be unstoppable.

I also expect Millipede to watch the polling numbers and if Conservative support recovers, to promise one of his own.

Pandora's box has been opened.

Wordsmith
 
#6
Matters not what the Eton Mess promises 'after the next election'.

Labour, the next Government, has already spoken…


Douglas Alexander, the shadow foreign secretary, told BBC Breakfast:
We don't believe it's a decision you could or should take now. We need to see the changing shape of Europe in the years ahead.
We've never ruled out referenda in principle but, in practice, we think the priorities should be stability, jobs and growth.


That's a NO to the public having any say then.
 
#8
Telling you chaps, if any of you think there's even the remotest chance of the Tories being in power after the next election.. Go out and give your head a good, long shake.

I wouldn't be over confident about the following term or three either.

FWIW if Labour had won the last election I think we'd be saying the same about them. The last election was a poison chalice, whoever got the term would rule over one of the less happy periods in our recent history and be blamed and remembered for it.

And aside from that, he said the same last time. He lied then too.
 

Travelgall

MIA
Kit Reviewer
#9
It's Call Me Dave playing politics again. He's under pressure on three fronts:

-- An increasingly eurosceptic UK electorate
-- Over 100 backbenchers discontented over Europe.
-- UKIP now polling regularly over 10% in the opinion polls.

All of those hit his chances of winning a majority in 2015.

My money says he want to promise a poll after the next election then try and weasel out of it (just like his last manifesto promise to hold a referendum on repatriating powers). But I think he's now put the possibility of an in/out referendum firmly in the UK electorate's consciousness and I think momentum for one will now be unstoppable.

I also expect Millipede to watch the polling numbers and if Conservative support recovers, to promise one of his own.

Pandora's box has been opened.

Wordsmith
I agree with a lot of what you say, but I would also include the fact that the EU is changing massively and this has also forced Cameron's hand. I'm not so sure about Miliband, I suspect that he's a gut European to whom allowing the opinion of the general public on this issue to actually dictate policy genuinely horrifies him. But he will have pressure of his own from his backbenchers, the great and good of Labour who have nice sinecures in Europe - Kinnock, Mandleson, Ashton (or who hope to President Blair) and a Media that will ask for a great deal more clarity (read an actual policy) than he gave on Radio 4 a couple of days ago.

If I were Labour I would make sure Blair and Mandleson were as far away from the UK as it is possible to be should this referendum take place. Because a lot of their Northern voters love the EU about as much as they love Labour's Metropolitan view on immigration. Indeed I think politically this could bring SOME Conservative UKIP'ers back into the fold (enough to make a difference) if Cameron lays down actual legislation, if I were Nigel Farage I'd be on Rosetta Stone right now learning "Northern" and practicing learning the difference between Mushy Peas and Guacamole.

The other obvious question is what do the Junior Partners do. They are torn between being popular and being true believers on Europe. Clegg is adept enough a politician to realise when he's on a looser, but will his party sacrifice electoral viability? The Liberals are very vulnerable on this too, especially in their South West Heartlands.
 

Grumblegrunt

LE
Book Reviewer
#10
it was a vote for me speech pure and simple. you cant renegotiate with the EU unless you leave it, he knows he cant get back in on his own bat so it trying the blackmail route. it was drivel spun and worded to appeal to everybody by saying nothing.

the people want out now by a decent majority because we are sick of it. so as usual in a UK democratic style pioneered by the EU we might (if we are lucky and vote for him) get the possibility of a choice in 5 years time.

I wonder if like last time all the other parties will promise a referendum as well? the libs have been very quiet about this since their last manifesto.
 

Grumblegrunt

LE
Book Reviewer
#11
its in the EUs interest for us to decide now what we want so they can carry on without us winging about everything. they are worried that if we go and make it work then everyone else will follow - so I would say they need to up their game a lot.
 

Wordsmith

LE
Book Reviewer
#14
If we get close to the next election, and Call Me Dave thinks he'll lose it, I wonder if he'll leave a poison pill for Millipede.

He could put a law on the statute book in the last session of parliament authorising a referendum in 2017, then challenge Millipede to say whether he'd remove it if Labour won the election.

I'd say that would give Millipede a few problems.

Wordsmith
 
#15
I agree with a lot of what you say, but I would also include the fact that the EU is changing massively and this has also forced Cameron's hand. I'm not so sure about Miliband, I suspect that he's a gut European to whom allowing the opinion of the general public on this issue to actually dictate policy genuinely horrifies him. But he will have pressure of his own from his backbenchers, the great and good of Labour who have nice sinecures in Europe - Kinnock, Mandleson, Ashton (or who hope to President Blair) and a Media that will ask for a great deal more clarity (read an actual policy) than he gave on Radio 4 a couple of days ago.

If I were Labour I would make sure Blair and Mandleson were as far away from the UK as it is possible to be should this referendum take place. Because a lot of their Northern voters love the EU about as much as they love Labour's Metropolitan view on immigration. Indeed I think politically this could bring SOME Conservative UKIP'ers back into the fold (enough to make a difference) if Cameron lays down actual legislation, if I were Nigel Farage I'd be on Rosetta Stone right now learning "Northern" and practicing learning the difference between Mushy Peas and Guacamole.

The other obvious question is what do the Junior Partners do. They are torn between being popular and being true believers on Europe. Clegg is adept enough a politician to realise when he's on a looser, but will his party sacrifice electoral viability? The Liberals are very vulnerable on this too, especially in their South West Heartlands.
CMD is trying hard to be all things to all men, pro Europe but holding out the hope of giving us plebs a say in the matter. Europe, I suspect, will rightly assume that he doesn't have the bottle to actually "go nuclear" and hold an in/out referendum, and they'll call his bluff.

Joe public, meanwhile, is fully aware of his previous form on kicking this problem into the long grass of "in the next parliament", and will continue to push, via support for UKIP, for a decision/referendum BEFORE the next general election.

Labour will, as always, do nothing decisive until forced by events, and the Liberals know already that they'll face extinction whoever wins next time.

Back on the mainland, nothing much hass improved, and once the weather improves I confidently predict a summer of mass riots across Europe, possibly leading to one or more governments falling ( and, ideally, hung from the nearest lamp post, pour encourager les autres).

I'd propose the EU is a prime candidate for the arrse dead pool 2014.
 
#16
Telling you chaps, if any of you think there's even the remotest chance of the Tories being in power after the next election.. Go out and give your head a good, long shake.

I wouldn't be over confident about the following term or three either.

FWIW if Labour had won the last election I think we'd be saying the same about them. The last election was a poison chalice, whoever got the term would rule over one of the less happy periods in our recent history and be blamed and remembered for it.

And aside from that, he said the same last time. He lied then too.
do you not think this could be a vote winner? it'll certainly suck up the UKIP vote as its they only way they'll get what they want and i think there's a lot of people who even though they're not tories would like out of the EU or at least would like to be asked (i'm only basing this on anecdotal evidence and people i've spoken to's opinions as here in scotland there arent many conservatives kicking about).

personally i'd like to stay in the EU and think there should be a renegotiation of powers but i think a referendum (realistically with all three of the major parties campaigning for a Yes vote) would be a good opportunity to talk about all of the benefits we've gained from the EU rather than just the negatives.
 
#17
"In order to restore index linking to State Benefits, cut the NHS permissible waiting list to three months and supply all school children with a free sports training kit. We need to remain in the European Union. Silly notions of referenda, spouted by a dying party with nothing but spite in their hearts for the vision of a bright, Labour led future have no place here"

Problem solved.

Or, to put it another way, 99% of voters don't actually give a **** whether we're in the EU or not and will vote for whichever party says they will give them the most money.
 
#18
As someone who voted Conservative last time, I can safely say they won't be seeing my vote again. I don't even care if my UKIP vote lets Labour in, at least it'll help get UKIP on the radar.

Lying ****ing weasel. Give us our referendum NOW!
 
#20
If we get close to the next election, and Call Me Dave thinks he'll lose it, I wonder if he'll leave a poison pill for Millipede.

He could put a law on the statute book in the last session of parliament authorising a referendum in 2017, then challenge Millipede to say whether he'd remove it if Labour won the election.

I'd say that would give Millipede a few problems.

Wordsmith



<Clegg> No way Jose <Clegg>
 

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