Camerons dilemma

Discussion in 'Current Affairs, News and Analysis' started by FORMER_FYRDMAN, Apr 21, 2010.

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    FORMER_FYRDMAN LE Book Reviewer

  2. Clegg only said things that the public want to hear tbh. When it comes down to the street fight it'll be about the big two, also the voters like to scare the big guns and they have a great chance here, ably assisted by a media that also like to put the boot in. Thankfully we don't elect Prime Ministers but I do see that the TV image of the leaders of the parties is becoming more and more important. Unfortunately, this distracts from the policies which, I think, has been proved by the Clegg love-in. Policies is what matters and this will become the focus closer to the polling day. It always does.
  3. When it comes to polling day the Limp Dicks will be third as usual.
  4. udipur

    udipur LE Book Reviewer

    I agree with Heffer's analysis of Cameron. He is a bit of shape shifter yet has not managed to slough off his privileged background - something that Clegg has achieved rather adroitly.

    Clegg represents a minority who can sway to opinion far more easily than the behemoths of Labour or the Conservatives. He did say what people wanted to hear and he did it in a way that won them over. Brown made some pretty powerful announcements that night (and, to paraphrase Heffer, they also seem to have died before even leaving the womb) yet Cameron didn't land a punch or come across particularly well.

    What we see on telly is often not the real deal with anyone. Over the years you get to meet various people and you find out that there is a polish to their style which works well through modern media but it is not the real them. I hear good things about Cameron, I have heard Brown is a wily operator but a bit of a bully and that Clegg is smart as a button.

    No we are not officially electing the Prime Minister but their party. However, the past decade and a half has seen the public become so obsessed with celebrity that these three must nail this part of the appeal factor. Clegg is in front, Cameron is wavering and Brown is as curmudgeonly as ever.

    None of the manifestos make for reassuring reading but then no economist can predict what's going to happen, no sociologist can tell you how many foreigners will come to live here, no diplomat can reassure anyone of entente cordiale. Remember the old adage that no plan survives contact with the enemy?

    We are having a fascinating election because of the uncertainty, not despite it. There will be some interesting changes afoot and there will be trouble in their implementation. Whichever way you look at it, lots of public sector people are going to pull into Gravy Train central and find no ongoing service. The private sector is going to continue to struggle and unemployment will remain a terrific drain on our economy.

    I shall vote, review the results and reconsider Operation Oz Bound - will keep the wife happy, will live in a booming economy and will get to see the Ashes in some other grounds.
  5. Auld-Yin

    Auld-Yin LE Reviewer Book Reviewer Reviews Editor

    Last week was the first of three debates. I believe that both Brown and Cameron had dismissed Clegg before the show (because that is what it was) and therefore left this nice little gap he could fill as the nice boy and was allowed to shine. Clegg took it brilliantly.

    I don't think this will be allowed to happen in shows 2 & 3 and that the two others , Cameron in particular, will not allow him such freedom.

    FORMER_FYRDMAN LE Book Reviewer

    I agree that lightening won't strike twice but I don't think it needs to - the Lib Dems have succeeded in changing the game for two reasons:

    1. The media, particularly broadcast media, is generally liberal left and now they have something genuinely to cheer for and promote.
    2. Their poll position changes the perception that they are the 'third party' and a pack of 'no-hopers'. Agreed, that may cost them some of their usual tactical element but they will pick up votes from this new perception of viability.

    They are also difficult to attack without looking scared or looking like the reactionary face of the 'old politics'.

    I suspect that we are on our way to a hung Parliament and that Cameron may well be on his way to joining Kinnock in the 'How the hell did they lose that one' club.

    Looking on the bright side, Ed Balls is predicting that Gordon will remain in Number 10 until 2017, which should spread panic and fear amongst the undecided.
  7. To be honest. I don't think it's anything Clegg has done, rather what the press has NOT done. ALL the attention has been on Cameron and his background, mainly ignoring the largely public school bacground of the current crop of Ministers.

    Which makes it almost complete hypocrisy on the part of Labour.
  8. If only the Tories had asked Boris Johnson to be shadow PM…
  9. You're right they won't, but then will it look like Cam & Brown are acting like the playground bullies and are picking on Clegg and perversely have him peceived as some victim, hence +++ in the polls?
  10. Brown knows he has lost, his awful "I agree with Nick" performance in the last debate means that Labour private polling is indicating something that we dont know.

    His only way out is an "anti-Tory alliance", which could save Labour but leave the Lib-Dems in the wilderness for another 100 years.

    You can read the lies here:

  11. Brown's own words

    "As the opinion polls do not yet point to a Liberal Democrat government, Mr Brown sensed an opening. "There are two competing visions of the future," he said. "If you want a referendum on the new politics, you have got to consider voting Labour. We are the only party committed to a referendum on it. You won't get one with the Tories."

    Remind me.....Which party refused to hold a referendum, having made a Election promsie to hold one?
  12. I've met Cameron and he was much more inspiring in person. He wasn't impressive at the debate though and I thought that while he had clearly been coached in body language, it made him look unnatural. Had he been more himself, he would have taken the shine off Nick Clegg's casual stance and his other mistake was not to savage Gordon Brown when he started his "Answer the question" malarky.
  13. As has been stated, it was the first of three debates. Both Gordon and Dave had to put in a restrained performance as they both had a lot to lose if they messed up.

    Clegg had much more freedom to play to the crowd and he did exactly that - good on him.
    Post the debate, the media departments of the two main parties have had a chance to realise that the public actually want to see the leaders having a dust-up. I would expect that the shackles will come off and Clegg will get a bit of a slapping in the next one. Cameron, especially, will have to really assert some authority on the debate and call Clegg out on some of the more unpalatable policies that the Lib-Dems are touting e.g. their stance on European federalism and Trident.

    Clegg now has something to lose, let's see how he mixes it on a more level playing field.

    I can't see how Brown can actually come out of this well, as he's going for the obvious tactic of rubbishing the Conservatives whilst cosying up to the Lib-Dems. His problem is that he's got to do this with out looking repellently smug if it's going well - or completely desperate if it isn't - and he's not that good an actor. I also suspect he would have issues on trusting Clegg not to shaft him by appearing at first to be on-team and then turning on him later.

    It would actually be better for him if Clegg send him lots of "Sod-off Gordon, I don't want to be your pal" signals right from the start of the discussion. He could then go back to the easier task of sniping at both of his opponents.

    I'm looking forward to the next debate with eagerness!
  14. Seeing how all three play it will make it worth watching all on its own. Cameron risks being floored by Clegg though on the EU if Clegg pushes his referendum plan. Some semi-committed Conservative and UKIP voters will lap it up.
  15. Ok, I'm going to regret this I'm sure, but I'll bite anyway - I'm genuinely not sure what it is that Clegg's referendum plan is/means, and I've seen conflicting information on whether its actually a straight referendum on EU membership, or a pledge (much like the one Labour made) to hold a referendum before further passing of power over to EU?