Cameronians (Scottish Rifles).

#1
I heard a story once that the Cameronians when stationed in Germany just after WW2 had a battle with a Russian unit that almost created an international incident. Apparently the Soviets pushed the envelope, as they often did in those immediate post war years before boundaries were established, and the Cams (being what they were) pushed right back.

I have often heard it alluded to though nothing concrete. Seems the incident was quickly hushed up. Any one have any information?
 
#2
I was stationed in Minden in the 70's and the locals remembered the Second battle of Minden.
The story goes like this ish.
A jock was stabbed by a taxi driver whilst out down town. Next day following work the RSM parades all the jocks on the square, St Georges Brks and leads them down town to sort out the locals.
Our clerk an elderly German lady who had worked for the Brit mil since 46 said it was terrible. they where 'kicking' babies out of prams and all males where smacked.
there was a full scale riot down in the town centre and MP from all over BAOR where sent.
The battalion was confined to camp until quick posting was arrainged and a couple of jocks where said to have been caught pouring fertilizer into the town water supply hence the Poision Dwarf nickname.
Disbanded in 68. I served with an old sgt from the battalion in Belize in 78 and he was very proud of their actions on the day.
john
 
#3
The only story I know about that regiment is the one about the WW2 Burma campaign - senior doctor at formation HQ receives signal from some unit MO saying 'Have two cases dengue. Request disposal instructions.' and signalled back 'Try the Cameronians Sgts' Mess - they'll drink anything.'

As they say, I'll get my coat ...
 
#4
jonwilly said:
Disbanded in 68.
I don't think they were actually "disbanded" In a round of Regiment amalgamations they chose not to be amalgamated, and I think they were placed in "suspended animation"
 
#5
OK, sort of within topic.

What colour head dress did the Cameronians wear? Was the Glengarry standard dark blue, rifle green, or black? toorie same colour as cap?
 

ugly

LE
Moderator
#6
I thought they became the Queens own Highlanders?
 
#7
Jonwilly wrote
couple of jocks where said to have been caught pouring fertilizer into the town water supply hence the Poision Dwarf nickname
My recollection is that the general conduct over a period of time by the soldiers led to increasing hostility between the civvies and them. The locals had a swear word which translated as poison dwarf and they allied this to the (smallish) jocks. The squaddies learned the phrase in german and anyone using it in their hearing qualified for a good bashing. Don't now recall the reference to town water supply. Sure, it attracted great interest at the time. Larry Adler (harmonica player) got in on he act and said problem was that squaddies could not speak german (yea - really?) and the army started the german language lab courses.
 
#8
RCSignals said:
OK, sort of within topic.

What colour head dress did the Cameronians wear? Was the Glengarry standard dark blue, rifle green, or black? toorie same colour as cap?
It was an all-black glengarry, including the little bobble on top. Otherwise, it was a standard ToS with a black hackle. Tartan was Douglas, and the most visually distinctive thing about their uniform was the officers' Sam Browne belts; worn with two shoulder straps, crossed at the back, but uncrossed at the front. Sort of a cross between Rifle Brigade and Lowland Brigade, unsurprisingly.

Can't tell some of my best friends were Cameronian, can you?

Diana Henderson's book on the Scottish Regiments has a good section on them.
http://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/0004710258/?tag=armrumser-21

PS The regular battalion went in 1968, most soldiers went to RS and KOSB; the two TA companies remained until the 1990s - D Coy 1/52 went with options (gun club got their TAC in Hamilton), No.4 Coy 2/52 in Motherwell eventually got rebadged KOSB in the late 1990s, with that location drawn down to platoon size under SDR.

There's still one officer (or was until recently) wandering around wearing a black hackle. And a few soldiers with a Douglas patch under the Leslie patch on their ToS.......
 
#9
Thank-you Gravelbelly. So the standard TOS was black hackle only, or tartan patch and black hackle?
 
#10
RCSignals said:
jonwilly said:
Disbanded in 68.
I don't think they were actually "disbanded" In a round of Regiment amalgamations they chose not to be amalgamated, and I think they were placed in "suspended animation"
This is fact. my father was in the Cameronians and told me this.

RCSignals said:
Thank-you Gravelbelly. So the standard TOS was black hackle only, or tartan patch and black hackle?
As well as the hackle all of their badges and buttons on No2's/Service Dress were black.
 

ugly

LE
Moderator
#11
twicer said:
RCSignals said:
jonwilly said:
Disbanded in 68.
I don't think they were actually "disbanded" In a round of Regiment amalgamations they chose not to be amalgamated, and I think they were placed in "suspended animation"
This is fact. my father was in the Cameronians and told me this.

RCSignals said:
Thank-you Gravelbelly. So the standard TOS was black hackle only, or tartan patch and black hackle?
As well as the hackle all of their badges and buttons on No2's/Service Dress were black.
OK no disputing first hand knowledge, but where did the Queens own Highlanders come from?
 
#12
twicer said:
RCSignals said:
jonwilly said:
Disbanded in 68.
I don't think they were actually "disbanded" In a round of Regiment amalgamations they chose not to be amalgamated, and I think they were placed in "suspended animation"
This is fact. my father was in the Cameronians and told me this.

RCSignals said:
Thank-you Gravelbelly. So the standard TOS was black hackle only, or tartan patch and black hackle?
As well as the hackle all of their badges and buttons on No2's/Service Dress were black.
That's because of the Rifles lineage...........they didnt have colours either

http://www.regiments.org/regiments/uk/inf/026Camer.htm
 
#13
ugly said:
OK no disputing first hand knowledge, but where did the Queens own Highlanders come from?
They came from the amalgamation of the Queens own Cameron Highlanders and Seaforth Highlanders
 
#16
I used the word 'disbanded' as I knew they had ceased to exsist as a line battalion back in 68.
The Sgt I shared transit accomadation with in Belize 78, was ex Cameronians and had been a young jock the day they sorted out Minden.
In those days I could drink and was a Scotch man, but there was no way I was in his leauge.
He was taking a 7 day survival course on one of the offshore keys and his large pack had 14 bottles of Scotch as his personal survival rations.
The Muscat Regt of Oman wear a Bright Red Tam O' Shanter as their headress, the Sultan having served as a Subaltern with the Jocks in BAOR.
john
 
#17
My post generated a lot of interesting anecdotes on the Cameronians (Scottish Rifles). They wore a Rifle Green glengarry not black though the 'tourie' (bobble for the sassenachs) was black. All ranks wore a black hackle in their Balmorals/TOS with a Douglas tartan patch and their capbadge, which at the time of their disbandment was the old Lowland Brigade cap badge.

Although highly aware of the Cams' antics in Minden in the early 1960s the incident I originally referred too occurred in 1945-46. It seems to have been lost in the mists of time.

The Cameronians were a fine regiment, very tough and proud of the fact they were Scotland's only Rifle Regiment. I remember marching off parade when their pipe band struck up their Regimental March, "Within a mile o' Edinburgh toon" at Rifle Regiment pace. Damn!

Their last serving officer retired from the KOSB a year or so ago, he wore his Rifle Regiment blazer for the occasion. End of an era.
 
#18
Vasco said:
The only story I know about that regiment is the one about the WW2 Burma campaign - senior doctor at formation HQ receives signal from some unit MO saying 'Have two cases dengue. Request disposal instructions.' and signalled back 'Try the Cameronians Sgts' Mess - they'll drink anything.'

As they say, I'll get my coat ...
:lol: :lol: :lol: but you better get your coat, as you know they were Chindits in that campaign, I don't think I will try that anecdote with my near-teetotal surviving relative who was one of them. :wink:
 
#19
Busterdog said:
My post generated a lot of interesting anecdotes on the Cameronians (Scottish Rifles). They wore a Rifle Green glengarry not black though the 'tourie' (bobble for the sassenachs) was black. All ranks wore a black hackle in their Balmorals/TOS with a Douglas tartan patch and their capbadge, which at the time of their disbandment was the old Lowland Brigade cap badge.

Although highly aware of the Cams' antics in Minden in the early 1960s the incident I originally referred too occurred in 1945-46. It seems to have been lost in the mists of time.

The Cameronians were a fine regiment, very tough and proud of the fact they were Scotland's only Rifle Regiment. I remember marching off parade when their pipe band struck up their Regimental March, "Within a mile o' Edinburgh toon" at Rifle Regiment pace. Damn!

Their last serving officer retired from the KOSB a year or so ago, he wore his Rifle Regiment blazer for the occasion. End of an era.
Good post, Busterdog. Anyone remember their custom of parading with rifles for the Kirk, and posting armed sentries at the four corners? A long history behind that.
 

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